"Airline Internship" at ATP?

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Counselor

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Another site has a forum thread discussing an ATP email advertising an upcoming "airline internship" program at ATP. Apparently, ATP is preparing to offer a 250-hour turbine flight program for ACPP graduates styled as an "airline internship." What is this about?
 
It is in connection with Gulfstream Training Academy. Basically, after you finish the ACPP you then go to Gulfstream and you pay them $25,000 to be a first officer at Gulfstream International Airlines for 250 hours. :banghead:

ATP is getting desperate for students and they are putting their somewhat respected name out there with Gulfstream, which is the biggest joke in the airline industry.

I hope that nobody is dumb enough to sign up for this program.
 
Another site has a forum thread discussing an ATP email advertising an upcoming "airline internship" program at ATP. Apparently, ATP is preparing to offer a 250-hour turbine flight program for ACPP graduates styled as an "airline internship." What is this about?

A complete joke is what it is. $25k to fly as an FO. Most places will pay you to be an FO. stupid
 
Couple of former students in Miami went to Gulfstream. After their 250 hours, they are given the option of spending another 5,000$ for more flight time... BUT!!! It is 121 experience...
 
Crap like this program is why regional salaries won't go up. Paying to work for someone? hahaha... And people will actually buy into this stuff. At least the rich people can and will...
 
Crap like this program is why regional salaries won't go up. Paying to work for someone? hahaha... And people will actually buy into this stuff. At least the rich people can and will...


Everyone should just agree to never pay for any flight training ever again. That way there will be a shortage of trained pilots and the airlines will have to hire people off the street with 0 time.

Then everything will be fair. Anyone that has paid for any training will be shunned and not ever hired.

How many poor kids went to your flight school?
 
seems to me if i'm gonna pay $100/hr for multi time i'd rather it be in a 1900.

except you are forgetting that people who pay to split time in a duchess are both loggign PIC whereas the idiots who go to Gulfstream are PAYING TO WORK FOR AN AIRLINE. That makes no sense, no matter how you try to spin it.
 
except you are forgetting that people who pay to split time in a duchess are both loggign PIC whereas the idiots who go to Gulfstream are PAYING TO WORK FOR AN AIRLINE. That makes no sense, no matter how you try to spin it.


I think they're both paying to fly a piece of junk to build experience to further their career no matter how you try to spin it.

Is there really a difference? If you're paying to fly you're paying to fly. Why pay to build multi experience when someone will pay you to fly twin. You could just work but instead you pay to rent an airplane.

A real pilot would enjoy all the seasoning involved in getting an MEI and battling for multi students instead of just taking the quick way out and buying multi PIC time.

Either way you're buying your way into the profession.
 
I dont think there are enough people out there stupid enough to pay $75k for their commercial multi and 250 hours SIC in a 1900.

If that kind of thing makes you happy, go for it. Check back in when you leave Gulfstream, I'd like to know what you're going to do for the next 500 hours before anyone hires you.
 
I think they're both paying to fly a piece of junk to build experience to further their career no matter how you try to spin it.

Is there really a difference? If you're paying to fly you're paying to fly. Why pay to build multi experience when someone will pay you to fly twin. You could just work but instead you pay to rent an airplane.

A real pilot would enjoy all the seasoning involved in getting an MEI and battling for multi students instead of just taking the quick way out and buying multi PIC time.

Either way you're buying your way into the profession.

I am not arguing that someone should buy time instead of instructing. I am saying that nobody should pay an airline to sit in the right seat for 250 hours. Instead, that airline should pay the person (more than $8.00/hr.) just like every other airline does.
 
I think they're both paying to fly a piece of junk to build experience to further their career no matter how you try to spin it.

Is there really a difference? If you're paying to fly you're paying to fly. Why pay to build multi experience when someone will pay you to fly twin. You could just work but instead you pay to rent an airplane.

A real pilot would enjoy all the seasoning involved in getting an MEI and battling for multi students instead of just taking the quick way out and buying multi PIC time.

Either way you're buying your way into the profession.

No, when you rent an airplane it is yours to do what you want with it, go where you please. This is quite different... this is paying a company to allow you to work in furtherance of their profit driven enterprise. It's despicable and those who do it defecate on the industry.
 
No, when you rent an airplane it is yours to do what you want with it, go where you please. This is quite different... this is paying a company to allow you to work in furtherance of their profit driven enterprise. It's despicable and those who do it defecate on the industry.


Gulfstream airlines is not making a profit. They've lost money three out of the last four years. Would have lost money all four had investors not pumped money in.
 
Gulfstream airlines is not making a profit. They've lost money three out of the last four years. Would have lost money all four had investors not pumped money in.

So which side do you work for? The airline, The investors, or the school? Cause your answers seem rather interesting...

While I agree the 100/hr for a multi would be a greater value in a B1900 rather than a PA44 the reality is that it costs a little more to train in a twin than a single. I for one think its great if you can find a B1900 for 100/hr to train in, as long as it is not in the operations of a part 121 AIRLINE. There is a serious problem with the idea of an airline pilot being an "intern". No matter how cheap the tickets are.

Fact is that Gulfstream charges a large sum of money and then pays you back some of it in the form of $8/hr or so... that way they meet the legal requirements to show that the pilot is technically an employee.

When we stop kidding ourselves, as instructors, airline pilots, managers, and passengers that this is OK we will come to the conclusion that there are better ways to attract and retain pilots for employment as airline pilots as well as maintain a level of safety and experience that our customers expect... demand, from us.

This, I feel, is the wrong direction. Even if financing is difficult to obtain. We start calling banks and congress men and women to explain why educational financing should be made available for pilot training. But I do not think placing "interns" in the cockpit and lowering the standards for an already battered profession is the correct solution.

Good luck to us all.

PS- to those considering flight training, there are many great options out there. Not all are a perfect fit for everyone but there is something out there to help everyone succeed. Dont fall into the trap of allowing your dreams to rush your senses.
 
Check back in when you leave Gulfstream, I'd like to know what you're going to do for the next 500 hours before anyone hires you.

It would seem all this came out before ATP has even finalized the program. It now appears to be up up on our website and the CFI course is also included.

Yes I work for ATP. No I am not going to get drawn into the "PFJ" debate. Just butting in to make sure everyone is aware of what ATPs end of the program entails.
 
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