Anyone here work at Allegiant?

[jynxyjoe]

And I'll say it again. The best jobs I've ever held with the best pay and best QOL have all been at non-union carriers.
Typhoonpilot

Well then in fairness I'll say again: I left my non-union company and made/make much more with my union company from day one.

 

[jtrain609]

Oh, that's rich. So, let me get this straight. If somebody is out of work and no union carriers are presently hiring you would advocate them not taking a job at a non-union carrier? Instead preferring that they remain unemployed? Even when that job could lead them to the necessary qualifications to get hired at a union carrier later down the road?

Further, are you in any way prepared to pay for people with "moral courage" to not take those jobs? Would you and your union brothers set up a fund for them to supplement their unemployment benefits? That would only be fair, as they are helping you to keep your union pay and benefits. Shouldn't those people be compensated for that?

If ALPA would ever start acting like a national union with the benefit of all it's members in mind then I might be inclined to agree with some of your points. But as long as experienced pilots have to start over again at the bottom of a list every time their union carrier has a furlough or goes out of business it's just not going to work the way you hope.

The people without your "moral courage" hired by Allegiant prior to January, 2007 are all pretty much Captains making north of $100K/year. Current upgrade time is around 2 years. Fifteen days off per month on average and home almost every night. Not a bad QOL really.

And I'll say it again. The best jobs I've ever held with the best pay and best QOL have all been at non-union carriers.



Typhoonpilot

I live in Park City, UT. If I had wanted to, I could have gotten the qualifications to work at Skywest in short order.

I chose not to, because I had zero interest in working at a non union regional airline, to say nothing of working at a non union major one day. I went to the company with the highest pay rate, the best work rules, etc. etc.

I am now furloughed. I will not be applying to Skywest, even if they were hiring. I am studying to get OUT of this career, and would rather do that than go work at a place like Skywest, Lynx or Colgan. I'm working a non aviation job until that transition happens, and I'd rather do that than go to some regional that I have no interest in working at.

Now what could change that? Me and my wife having a kid would probably throw me back into the game in short order, or not getting into law/graduate school; but any of those options are probably 2 years off, and I could well be recalled at Express before that happens, so I've got some time.

Either way, I'm unwilling to sell myself short, and I am in fact the person you're trying to make fun of in your post.

 

[MusketeerMan]

So, those members on here that work at Skywest are selling them self short? Comical. One of the only regionals who hasn't furloughed and has done as much as they can to make sure they don't furlough...

What's even more comical is that there are plenty of posts in the past of you, John, complaining while sitting on reserve, etc. and stating that you should have just applied at SKW and that you may make the switch. Funny how your stories change to fit the thread.

Comical.

 

[jtrain609]

Me? Go to Skywest? Find those posts, until then enjoy my ignore list internet tough guy.

 

[Lowlevel]

At mesaba we actually DO have a volentary fund of which you said we should form. ALPA locals are all asking us to pitch in (I do) so they have some fund available if one member can't get work or has severe finacial difficulties. Obviously its not an ALPA national account but we are trying in our own way.

So, if I was working there, instead of my current airline, and I was furloughed (like I will be in a few weeks), and my unemployment was $1000 less than what I was currently earning.....your fund would give me the extra $1000 a month, along with everyone else who needed the $1000 a month? So, the 300 pilots here that are furloughed would get $30000 a month from this fund? Wow! That is some fund! Then maybe I could make my car payment, rent payment, electric bill, grocery expenses, etc.. and sit and wait for a recall instead of going to a non union company and actually earning more there than I did here in the first place.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

So, those members on here that work at Skywest are selling them self short?

Yes. Next question!

 

[typhoonpilot]

I live in Park City, UT. If I had wanted to, I could have gotten the qualifications to work at Skywest in short order.

I chose not to, because I had zero interest in working at a non union regional airline, to say nothing of working at a non union major one day. I went to the company with the highest pay rate, the best work rules, etc. etc.

I am now furloughed. I will not be applying to Skywest, even if they were hiring. I am studying to get OUT of this career, and would rather do that than go work at a place like Skywest, Lynx or Colgan. I'm working a non aviation job until that transition happens, and I'd rather do that than go to some regional that I have no interest in working at.

Now what could change that? Me and my wife having a kid would probably throw me back into the game in short order, or not getting into law/graduate school; but any of those options are probably 2 years off, and I could well be recalled at Express before that happens, so I've got some time.

Either way, I'm unwilling to sell myself short, and I am in fact the person you're trying to make fun of in your post.

I'm not trying to make fun of anyone. Just pointing at that Velocipede's post is a bit hypocritical. He advocates people protecting his union job at their own personal expense and probably doesn't give any thought towards what he could do to alleviate their financial pain.

As for your reason's for not going to Skywest, I just don't know what to say. Always known as one of the better regional jobs with good top end pay and QOL. You've allowed yourself to be swayed by people who won't lift a finger to help you in your time of need. ALPA doesn't look out for their furloughed pilots. They may make pretenses, but when it comes down to it they do nothing of substance.

If ALPA were a strong national union with it's entire membership's welfare in mind it would mandate priority hiring of any furloughed or displaced ALPA pilot prior to anyone else, without exception, as part of all contracts with it's member carriers. That would be something of substance.

There are many more things they could do as a national union, but don't. I know, I spent almost 13 years on furlough as an ALPA member. It's been very educational and leads to my complete and total disdain for ALPA as a "union".



Typhoonpilot

 

[Velocipede]

You remind me of Colonel Travis and his line at the Alamo. :rawk:

Yep. And that's the stuff legends are made of. Moral courage in the face of adversity.

Oh, that's rich. So, let me get this straight. If somebody is out of work and no union carriers are presently hiring you would advocate them not taking a job at a non-union carrier? Instead preferring that they remain unemployed? Even when that job could lead them to the necessary qualifications to get hired at a union carrier later down the road?

Absolutely. Because there are plenty of ways to make a living OTHER than aviation. And plenty of ways to get qualifications...like flying night freight.

<edited>

Personally I have never contemplated APPLYING to, much less working for a non-Union carrier. I guess that's just because I have personal standards that I won't sell for something so crass as money. And substandard money at that.

<edited>

 

[typhoonpilot]

Resorting to a personal attack instead of engaging in intelligent debate. Care to answer any of my questions?

Oh, and which time building night freight companies are unionized?


TP

 

[Velocipede]

There are many more things they could do as a national union, but don't. I know, I spent almost 13 years on furlough as an ALPA member. It's been very educational and leads to my complete and total disdain for ALPA as a "union".

Ahh. The real bottom line. You got furloughed and blame ALPA. We get it now.

Not the Company who furloughed you. Certainly not yourself for choosing a poor Company.

ALPA, the guys who obviously made all the management decisions for the guys who furloughed you. Here's a couple differing opinons for you to consider:

Well then in fairness I'll say again: I left my non-union company and made/make much more with my union company from day one.

I chose not to, because I had zero interest in working at a non union regional airline, to say nothing of working at a non union major one day. I went to the company with the highest pay rate, the best work rules, etc. etc. ...Either way, I'm unwilling to sell myself short, and I am in fact the person you're trying to make fun of in your post.

There you have it, Ty. A couple posters who are unwilling to sell themselves for money. Men with the courage of their convictions. Men who would never consider crossing a picket line OR stabbing their professional peers in the back.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Ahh. The real bottom line. You got furloughed and blame ALPA. We get it now. = Sorry, wrong. I don't blame ALPA for my furlough, but I do blame them for the way they handle pilots who are furloughed.

Not the Company who furloughed you. Certainly not yourself for choosing a poor Company. = Again sorry, wrong. USAirways was one of the premier legacy jobs at the time that I was hired. Best narrow body pay rates in the industry; best rigs; best work atmosphere; and best pension.

ALPA, the guys who obviously made all the management decisions for the guys who furloughed you. Here's a couple differing opinons for you to consider:





There you have it, Ty. A couple posters who are unwilling to sell themselves for money. Men with the courage of their convictions. Men who would never consider crossing a picket line OR stabbing their professional peers in the back.

So now you want to equate someone who works for a non-union company the same as a scab. That's a bit of a stretch don't you think? Instead of answering the majority of my questions you want to engage in character assasination.

You're right, I go out of my way to stab my peers in the back. I've spent the last 6 years helping pilots from the USA get hired at Emirates and giving them job leads for other airlines with rewarding career potential. Most of those are displaced ALPA pilots who aren't getting the help they should get from their national union. My hands are bloodied, I admit it.

So just keep up with the character assasination. I'm sure some will believe it and be swayed by your rhetoric, but those who take some time to understand will see that you're still just avoiding my questions.


Typhoonpilot

 

[jtrain609]

I'm not trying to make fun of anyone. Just pointing at that Velocipede's post is a bit hypocritical. He advocates people protecting his union job at their own personal expense and probably doesn't give any thought towards what he could do to alleviate their financial pain.

As for your reason's for not going to Skywest, I just don't know what to say. Always known as one of the better regional jobs with good top end pay and QOL. You've allowed yourself to be swayed by people who won't lift a finger to help you in your time of need. ALPA doesn't look out for their furloughed pilots. They may make pretenses, but when it comes down to it they do nothing of substance.

If ALPA were a strong national union with it's entire membership's welfare in mind it would mandate priority hiring of any furloughed or displaced ALPA pilot prior to anyone else, without exception, as part of all contracts with it's member carriers. That would be something of substance.

There are many more things they could do as a national union, but don't. I know, I spent almost 13 years on furlough as an ALPA member. It's been very educational and leads to my complete and total disdain for ALPA as a "union".



Typhoonpilot

You know what to say, eh? I do.

I have opinions and convictions and I haven't sold them out. I chose not to. I refuse to go to a company, any company, where I believe I'll be selling out those around me for my own personal gain.

There was a guy at the freight company I worked for who said that people either have integrity or they don't. I agree with that very much, and following through with what you believe in, even when it's not popular, shows integrity. If I was to simply sell myself short and go to a company that I thought was undercutting the people around me, then what in the world do I have? A few more dollars in my pocket, maybe, but no personal integrity. If I were to simply sell myself out like that, I don't care about the extra dollars in my pocket; I'd be a pretty worthless sack of crap if you ask me.

I'll take the furlough, thank you very much.

 

[derg]

Alright folks, everyone reach down to the COM panel, turn the "ego" rheostat counterclockwise and turn the "constructive dialogue" rheostat clockwise.

Else the thread is going to get timed out, you'll all get angry and call me a poopyhead and I'll just keep sipping my espresso like nothing ever happened.

 

[typhoonpilot]

Alright folks, everyone reach down to the COM panel, turn the "ego" rheostat counterclockwise and turn the "constructive dialogue" rheostat clockwise.

Else the thread is going to get timed out, you'll all get angry and call me a poopyhead and I'll just keep sipping my espresso like nothing ever happened.

Sounds good.

So back to Allegiant. Growing and profitable company that is currently hiring. Current time to upgrade at 2 years. 4th year pilots makes over $100K/year. Fifteen days off per month on average and home almost every night. Any better jobs at unionized carriers that are hiring right now?



TP

 

[zmiller4]

Yes. Next question!

If Skywest folks are selling themselves short, what are guys at places like Pinnacle doing?

 

[jtrain609]

If Skywest folks are selling themselves short, what are guys at places like Pinnacle doing?

Hopefully getting a better contract here soon. I'd wait and see what happens with that before bashing em too much.

Mesa, on the other hand, is fair game.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

If Skywest folks are selling themselves short, what are guys at places like Pinnacle doing?

Fighting for the betterment of their profession.

 

[kellwolf]

Here's the way I see it: Allegiant has a base in a city both my wife and I want to live. If I stay at Pinnacle for 5-10 years and continue living in Memphis, I'm gonna go nuts. My wife wants to move back to Orlando so bad, we talk about it every week. Most of the time 2-3 times a week. Allegiant would give me a HUGE QoL boost over commuting to MEM on FedEx or NWA. Would even give me a boost over commuting to ATL if I switched bases.

So, there are people saying I should choose a union regional over my family? Sorry, not buying that. Call me an "industry destroyer" if you like. I'd be okay with it since I'd still be happily married. Yeah, Velo. Sometimes you have to draw a line. My line is drawn in the "Union vs family" battle. Family's gonna win. If working at Allegiant gives me more time to spend with my kid and the ability to live where my wife wants to live.....good.

 

[SmoothLanderJ]

Here's the way I see it: Allegiant has a base in a city both my wife and I want to live. If I stay at Pinnacle for 5-10 years and continue living in Memphis, I'm gonna go nuts. My wife wants to move back to Orlando so bad, we talk about it every week. Most of the time 2-3 times a week. Allegiant would give me a HUGE QoL boost over commuting to MEM on FedEx or NWA. Would even give me a boost over commuting to ATL if I switched bases.

So, there are people saying I should choose a union regional over my family? Sorry, not buying that. Call me an "industry destroyer" if you like. I'd be okay with it since I'd still be happily married. Yeah, Velo. Sometimes you have to draw a line. My line is drawn in the "Union vs family" battle. Family's gonna win. If working at Allegiant gives me more time to spend with my kid and the ability to live where my wife wants to live.....good.

Tell ya one thing Kell...I pretty much exclusively take Fed Ex to work. The last 3 times I flew up I was the only one on the Airbus ( the fly an MD-10 in the morning too). We talked about it before but Fed Ex makes the MCO to MEM commute pretty easy. Well it has been for me thus far anyway. Now, Allegiant out of SFB? Home every night, and two year upgrade, doesnt sound too bad I guess...

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Doesn't sound too bad?

This is an embarrassment to the profession.