I guess I should have saved the bandwidth by not even bothering to make the comment about the COM panel, eh?
Anyone here work at Allegiant?
- Thread starter TheOneMarine
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I guess I should have saved the bandwidth by not even bothering to make the comment about the COM panel, eh?
IrishSheepdog
Sitting in the median
Heh, I liked that post.
I actually love these threads. It's always interesting to guess who may or may not fail their next Class 1 medical exam due to high blood pressure.
jtrain609
Antisocial Monster
I love you.
Velocipede
New Member
Yeah, I officially give up, too.
The problem here is the bile and bitterness of guys who get furloughed is way misdirected.
No matter how many times PCL and I say it, ALPA did not furlough you. USAir/Comair did. Furloughs are a feature of the airline business and if you don't understand that coming in, you're not paying attention.
The whole "Where do I work? Burger King" argument is just as flawed. If you think all you can do is fly or flip burgers, then that's a YOU problem. If you're intelligent enough to earn a pilot's license, there are plenty of things you can do to earn a living besides stabbing your profession in the back.
The problem here is the bile and bitterness of guys who get furloughed is way misdirected.
No matter how many times PCL and I say it, ALPA did not furlough you. USAir/Comair did. Furloughs are a feature of the airline business and if you don't understand that coming in, you're not paying attention.
The whole "Where do I work? Burger King" argument is just as flawed. If you think all you can do is fly or flip burgers, then that's a YOU problem. If you're intelligent enough to earn a pilot's license, there are plenty of things you can do to earn a living besides stabbing your profession in the back.
Polar742
All the responsibility none of the authority
Velo,
Just a few questions so I can get to know you better, and give me a perspective on your opinions.
1) After the military, did you have any gap in employment prior to Alaska?
2) If so, was there a military pension that you had?
3) Did you apply at any other airlines other than Alaska. If so, which ones and what was the outcome?
Thanks. If you answer these, it will give me alot of perspective.
Velocipede
New Member
No.
No pension at that time. I did continue to fly for the reserves and earned a reserve retirement, but the checks don't start coming for a few years yet.
American - rejected. Probalby due to medical history. They were pretty strict back then about family histories of Diabetes.
Delta - rejected. Didn't have 20/20 vision
Northwest - Interview scheduled but cancelled.
USAir - No response to application.
United - rejected. This is the best story of all. My Dad, a United Captain, hand carried my stuff in. They told him I was overqualified (5200 hours, 2000 in DC-9s). :banghead:
Alaska - hired.
What I did NOT do was submit any applications to non-Union airlines, especially ones that were undercutting legacy wages/benefits. I would have pulled my military resignation and stayed in the Navy until I retired.
Polar742
All the responsibility none of the authority
Thanks for the answers. It really does help understand your perspective. I think the last paragraph wasn't needed as your position is abundantly clear.
At least you had the military to fall back on to feed your family and up hold your moral standard.
At least you had the military to fall back on to feed your family and up hold your moral standard.
Velocipede
New Member
The point is EVERYONE has job options. They just might not involve flying. Pilots limit themselves WAY too much.
You want to support your family, get OUT of the cockpit and and take a 9-5 job somewhere.
The bottom line is we're all too lazy because we're used to this lifestyle. So we'd rather work for $95 an hour and insure that everyone else's wages is driven down to our rate.
You want to support your family, get OUT of the cockpit and and take a 9-5 job somewhere.
The bottom line is we're all too lazy because we're used to this lifestyle. So we'd rather work for $95 an hour and insure that everyone else's wages is driven down to our rate.
To make one thing perfectly clear: Working at a non-union carrier and crossing a picket line are two different things.
One may not want to work for a non-union carrier, and that's fine. Whatever.
But crossing a picket line is when there is a strike, and a worker crosses a picket line of striking workers to go to work. (A reprehensible and unacceptable action, IMO.)
The word "scab" has a specific definition, and it WILL NOT be used here to talk about someone who goes to work for a carrier who one doesn't want to work for.
One may not want to work for a non-union carrier, and that's fine. Whatever.
But crossing a picket line is when there is a strike, and a worker crosses a picket line of striking workers to go to work. (A reprehensible and unacceptable action, IMO.)
The word "scab" has a specific definition, and it WILL NOT be used here to talk about someone who goes to work for a carrier who one doesn't want to work for.
That would be a great question for anyone else that is holding themselves to such a high-moral standard. Obviously take out Alaska and insert your current/former employer.
SpiceWeasel
Tre Kronor
So this is why we're able to fly 90 seat jets for $25 bucks an hour. Because you're not worried about it. I have a union pay rate (arbitrated), and I just so happen to be on a 90 seater (configured to 76). Because we have our own deals to worry about. Well.... what about the CRJ1000? the 100 seat jet? What about if they come up with the CRJ2000.... the 200 seat RJ. Unless you mainline guys start to care we regional boys are going to continue to have these airplanes thrown in our lap whether we like it or not. And, if we're going to take a page from the big boys book of "let them worry about it", sure, I'll fly the RJ2000 for my regional union-negotiated wages. I'm not undercutting.... it was a union that allowed it in (both the major and the regional).
JoelT
Well-Known Member
I have always said that working at Pace Airlines taught me the value of a Union because we didn't have one. I'm just glad I made that mistake at the very beginning of my career (23) and not later. After my furlough from flying 737's I went to CALEX and took a pay raise to fly the RJ.
Polar742
All the responsibility none of the authority
That is a fair assessment, and I agree.
The problem is, how does one retrain for a job outside this industry with the schedule of this job? Unless you have a great paying job, you're just making ends meet, so unless you have a significant other with a substantial income, you're stuck. Losing your house and sticking your family on the street isn't an option.
I don't think a non-union shop is the main issue. I think the bigger issue is people that are there don't improve their lot. That is a universal truth. The legacies didn't get the pay, work rules and benefits because of the name on the side of an airplane. They got their lifestyle because pilots, like your dad undoubtedly, fought for them.
Every carrier started out non-union. It can go either direction. You can have a bad deal like Capt. Caucasion working for PACE, or it can spin into the places we admire to work.
I sit at the bottom of a second tier freight carrier's seniority list. I was turned down by two of the top carriers prior to accepting this job. Now I sit and wonder how long will I have the job. As I survey the landscape, I see my options should I get furloughed.
1) Leave flying, eat up my entire lifesavings and retirement while I train for a new career and get established in it. Since, like most pilots, I'm trained for a specific task, and the job market is getting flooded with specialty trained people with experience from layoffs.
2) Work for a union shop carrier that's hiring. That appears to be Great Lakes (17k first year), Mesaba? (20 some K/yr)
3) Non-Union Carriers - Southern ~ 40k first year
- Allegiant
- Emirates ~ 10k/mo
I'll agree that working for a non-union shop is not my #1 option, but if it comes down to feeding my family and keeping my house, I'll choose Allegiant over commuting to DEN to fly a 1900 (no knock to anyone who does it) or moving to the sandbox.
Would I stay there? No, I'd try to get out, but at the same time, I'd try to improve my lot while I'm there. If it involves sticking my neck out to organize, like some of our fellow JC members did at CJC, then so be it.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
That may be your definition, but it's not the dictionary definition:
1scab
Pronunciation:
\ˈskab\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Middle English, of Scandinavian origin; akin to Old Swedish skabbr scab; akin to Old English sceabb scab, Latin scabere to scratch — more at shave
Date:
13th century
1: scabies of domestic animals
2: a crust of hardened blood and serum over a wound
3 a: a contemptible person b (1): a worker who refuses to join a labor union (2): a union member who refuses to strike or returns to work before a strike has ended (3): a worker who accepts employment or replaces a union worker during a strike (4): one who works for less than union wages or on nonunion terms
4: any of various bacterial or fungus diseases of plants characterized by crustaceous spots ; also : one of the spots
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