Why I don't give out buddy passes.

[mastermags]

Rail travel is completely awesome in Europe -- I found it extremely convenient...but they also have a century of infrastructure, development, and culture to back it up. It works great for them.

We would have to drop HUGE coin to build that infrastructure we don't have in the US, and even then most "car culture" Americans wouldn't use it.

Half century old really. I think if we did have the infrastructure it would be a huge success in many areas of the country. Maybe not so much in the deep south or the barren midwest, but definately on the east coast/ west coast and perhaps along Lake Michigan's shore.

 

[MQAAord]

Rail makes sense in places like the mid-Atlantic/northeast corridors. It will be the only way I travel to NY/NJ/PA from DC in the near future.

Yes. For the NE corridor, and even in CA it would be great. I used to ride the El in Chicago all the time, was a LOT easier than trying to park downtown. I loved it! And I'd gladly ride a commuter rail system in IND if it would ever get going... Relying on rail for cross-country and/or long-distance travel in the U.S. though is limited by many factors, including distance, infrastructure, geography/topography, and money.

 

[Itchy]

Rail travel is completely awesome in Europe -- I found it extremely convenient...but they also have a century of infrastructure, development, and culture to back it up. It works great for them.

We would have to drop HUGE coin to build that infrastructure we don't have in the US, and even then most "car culture" Americans wouldn't use it.

They would if gas shot up a couple hundred percent. And sooner or (probably) later, it will.

 

[mastermags]

Down here in ATL we do whatever we can to keep the rail network out; the latest transit vote was a clear and resounding 'NO'. People would rather deal with two hours of commuting to work a day sitting in their cars than spending an extra penny of tax money to have a decent transportation system. Sad and ironic considering this town was originally built on railroads.

 

[killbilly]

Down here in ATL we do whatever we can to keep the rail network out; the latest transit vote was a clear and resounding 'NO'. People would rather deal with two hours of commuting to work a day sitting in their cars than spending an extra penny of tax money to have a decent transportation system. Sad and ironic considering this town was originally built on railroads.

I've always been told - obviously no proof - that the reason ATL has limited transit is because the wealthier white suburbs (Cobb County, I'm looking at you) do not want easy public transit access from the poorer (read: black) parts of ATL.

I used to think this was a specious argument, but I've been told the same thing here in DC about Metro access into Georgetown. <shrug>

 

[amjon]

Not only is AmTrak expensive, but the schedules don't help.

For years, I tried to take the train from Philly to New Mexico to visit parents. Never succeeded.

First you take the train to Chicago. Gets in at 6 am (IF on time. < 25%). Then you take the train from Chicago westward. It leaves at 6 pm. Not much better on-time record.

Now, I love visiting Chicago - lots to do. But traveling to see elderly relatives, I don't want to lose 2 days each way.

The major problems with railroad are they are expensive (despite being government subsidized) and it takes WAY too long to get anywhere. Jump on a plane for $200 round trip you can get from Florida to NY in under 3 hours. Same thing on a train would probably be well over $300 (haven't price it lately, so just guessing by what I did look up years ago) and take almost a day (which would make it completely unfeasible for a weekend trip).

 

[derg]

Light rail in scottsdale.

Oh we don't want THOSE people coming into tony Scottsdale.

"Hey man! Instead of driving this stolen car to rob that house, les go green and just take the metro"


Sent from my TRS-80

 

[killbilly]

Light rail in scottsdale.

Oh we don't want THOSE people coming into tony Scottsdale.

"Hey man! Instead of driving this stolen car to rob that house, les go green and just take the metro"


Sent from my TRS-80

See post 125.

I think we're talking about two different threads though. Bulk, mid-haul, high-speed rail is feasible in this country and it bloody well SHOULD be done, in my opinion.

Light commuter rail should also be done, but it's a different set of needs.

 

[killbilly]

The major problems with railroad are they are expensive (despite being government subsidized) and it takes WAY too long to get anywhere. Jump on a plane for $200 round trip you can get from Florida to NY in under 3 hours. Same thing on a train would probably be well over $300 (haven't price it lately, so just guessing by what I did look up years ago) and take almost a day (which would make it completely unfeasible for a weekend trip).

Except that it costs the airline way the hell more than $200 to provide you that fare from FL to NY. This is precisely the problem with air travel, in my opinion. Until the airlines start charging appropriate fares for their products, you're going to have this exact situation, pilots are going to be paid crap wages, and the airlines will feel no stigma for routinely declaring BK.

Doesn't anyone else find it rather insane that rail tickets and airline tickets can sell for the same amount but have vastly different cost bases? If you factor in capacity-per-trip (seat miles, I guess) I think rail positively SMOKES air.

I know rail fares are subsidized, too. But they shouldn't be.

-b

 

[Hacker15e]

Given the vast distances that are in parts of the country, the US is actually a fantastic place for TGV or maglev style high speed rail that would go 300 mph.

I just don't think that Americans would adopt it quickly enough for it to ever stay in business, given the investment. Uncle Sam could do it and subsidize it for a decade, but he really can't afford it.

 

[Cptnchia]

I've always been told - obviously no proof - that the reason ATL has limited transit is because the wealthier white suburbs (Cobb County, I'm looking at you) do not want easy public transit access from the poorer (read: black) parts of ATL.

I used to think this was a specious argument, but I've been told the same thing here in DC about Metro access into Georgetown. <shrug>

Yeah, I lived in Cobb Co. It is the truth. Now, Cobb Co. did institute their own mass transit bus system, which links to the MARTA bus system but they refuse to allow the rail system into the county.

 

[jskibo]

Given the vast distances that are in parts of the country, the US is actually a fantastic place for TGV or maglev style high speed rail that would go 300 mph.

I just don't think that Americans would adopt it quickly enough for it to ever stay in business, given the investment. Uncle Sam could do it and subsidize it for a decade, but he really can't afford it.

Costly to purchase new Right Of Way for new rail lines if existing can't be upgraded.

Then, of course, you have to worry about intruding on the nesting ground of the Purple Dung Beetle (Or the Geico Lizard) and ruining that environment.

 

[scooter2525]

Light rail in scottsdale.

Oh we don't want THOSE people coming into tony Scottsdale.

"Hey man! Instead of driving this stolen car to rob that house, les go green and just take the metro"


Sent from my TRS-80

Funny you post that. The town I'm from a few years ago had light rail installed from downtown Sacramento. Their were concerns of homeless people making their way up into the middle class areas. Haven't heard it being a problem...

 

[🦈💜]

And once same sex couples are allowed to marry, I predict the "marriage industrial complex" is going to be the next big thing.

Right up there with Brazil.

~Fox

 

[mastermags]

I've always been told - obviously no proof - that the reason ATL has limited transit is because the wealthier white suburbs (Cobb County, I'm looking at you) do not want easy public transit access from the poorer (read: black) parts of ATL.

I used to think this was a specious argument, but I've been told the same thing here in DC about Metro access into Georgetown. <shrug>

I've heard that as well and it's complete hogwash. I'd personally like to reciprocate and keep all those suburban dwellers out of the city, clogging up our roads, polluting the air, and overall driving like morons.

 

[🦈💜]

People laugh at the high speed rail plan in CA but I think it's brilliant if you look at the major population centers and the topography.

The only problem is "Why the heck would I want to go there?!" ;>

~Fox

 

[killbilly]

I've heard that as well and it's complete hogwash. I'd personally like to reciprocate and keep all those suburban dwellers out of the city, clogging up our roads, polluting the air, and overall driving like morons.

If you mean keep the personalized-license-plate-northern-VA-mafia out of DC, I'm with you.

But I don't think it's hogwash. Maybe for Georgetown, but not Atlanta.

 

[Itchy]

The major problems with railroad are they are expensive (despite being government subsidized) and it takes WAY too long to get anywhere. Jump on a plane for $200 round trip you can get from Florida to NY in under 3 hours. Same thing on a train would probably be well over $300 (haven't price it lately, so just guessing by what I did look up years ago) and take almost a day (which would make it completely unfeasible for a weekend trip).

I'd just like to find a $200 round trip airfare ticket anywhere these days. Have not seen them in a while, certainly anytime I need them.

 

[ChasenSFO]

What the hell happened to this thread. LOL.

 

[🦈💜]

I've always been told - obviously no proof - that the reason ATL has limited transit is because the wealthier white suburbs (Cobb County, I'm looking at you) do not want easy public transit access from the poorer (read: black) parts of ATL.

Give me leave to doubt that it's actually racial in nature and I'll certainly agree with that statement--the affluent seem to perpetually be at war with "the effluent". The culture of wealth in this country is so very broken that it boggles my mind. When the poor people vote for the politicians who are rabidly anti-poor because they themselves expect to someday be rich, you know that there's something very broken about the mentality of a populace; there's a horrible cultural shame, a stigma on poverty that runs to the very core of our cultural identity that never used to be there. We don't identify our poor as "the working class" anymore -- they're now cast as parasitic elements. Lazy, shiftless, feeding off the "work" of the upper middle class and the taxes of the rich, the faex are beneath notice or care; we tolerate them as long as we can't see or smell them and don't have to put up with or think about them in any way.

In reality, the plurality of these people work multiple jobs to support their families, they struggle to make a life for themselves, and they eat up the pap we feed them. They don't wish to see themselves as the faex; they're often lured into the pervasive American mentality that things will always get better*, and thus they see themselves as working hard, firmly enroute to a membership in the middle class, and often want to separate themselves as much as they can from the "dregs" around them. The sad reality is that the work and stress often leave them with no mental space or time in the day to find a way out of their situation, and they'll never see how wide the gap is between where they are and where they hope/dream/expect to be.

But, ah.. I digress.

~Fox
(* This is a mentality that's not necessarily endemic to humanity, but something that I think is potentially one of the most positive traits of a society. Irrespective of the harm it can cause people when they come to the realization that it isn't true, or when they lack it, I feel it to be one of the strongest character traits of an advancing culture.)