Virgin America Pilot Pay Increase

Derg said:
So basically what you're saying is that pay should be commensurate with the size of the operation.

In your worldview, there are a lot of overpaid corporate pilots.

"Sorry Hoss, only got on G-IV. That's why we're paying you in Buffalo Wild Wings gift certificates from now on".
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Pay is commensurate with the airline's profitability (#1) and second its revenue generation. The revenue platform of a 700 airplane operation is vastly higher and different than that of a 50 airplane operation. I said nothing of corporate pilots, I distinctly wrote Part 121 passenger airlines.
 
Kingairer said:
I know CC is as popular as Justin Beiber, but virgin did get a raise, which is good, and I don't see their rates being competitively different than other LCCs. I have no idea what their contract looks like beyond the payscales which we all know is important. Lets find some norweigan, err thai, or whatever to beat up on.
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That's my entire point. From the get go, this thread turned into a "these aren't Delta wages!!!!"
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Pay is commensurate with the airline's profitability (#1) and second its revenue generation. The revenue platform of a 700 airplane operation is vastly higher and different than that of a 50 airplane operation. I said nothing of corporate pilots, I distinctly wrote Part 121 passenger airlines.
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What kind of options are you getting in return for building the airline to profitability?
 
ATN_Pilot said:
No they aren't. Your average fare is roughly the same as all of the other major carriers. If your management is incapable of producing results with the same revenue per passenger, then that's their problem. You shouldn't be subsidizing them.
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Both Sun Country and Delta Air Lines fly Boeing 737-800NGs from MSP to JFK. Same route, same exact plane, and more or less same priced tickets. Care to explain the difference in Delta 737 pay and Sun Country 737 pay, both being ALPA carriers? :rolleyes:


A misspelling in an attack about college. Classic.

And no, I'm not worried about that. I'm not interested in taking the massive pay cut. :bounce:
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Simple typo from a phone. Your personal attacks are on par with a high school graduate.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Both Sun Country and Delta Air Lines fly Boeing 737-800NGs from MSP to JFK. Same route, same exact plane, and more or less same priced tickets. Care to explain the difference in Delta 737 pay and Sun Country 737 pay, both being ALPA carriers? :rolleyes:
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One of those companies has been around since the 1920s, and one has been around since the 1980s. Which would you assume has the more mature contract?
 
dasleben said:
One of those companies has been around since the 1920s, and one has been around since the 1980s. Which would you assume has the more mature contract?
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Another post that makes my point. Except for this thread, it should be "One of those companies has been around since the 1920s, and one has been around since 2007."

But the people here aren't saying that. They are stating it's the same equipment flying the same routes, therefore should equal legacy size pay. Regardless of age of airline, and regardless of the small size.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Both Sun Country and Delta Air Lines fly Boeing 737-800NGs from MSP to JFK. Same route, same exact plane, and more or less same priced tickets. Care to explain the difference in Delta 737 pay and Sun Country 737 pay, both being ALPA carriers?
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I get where you're going with that, but Sun Country is an LCC. I'd be very surprised if DL and SY have the same airfare on MSP-JFK, or even close to the same airfare on the majority of tickets. As such, I'd be all the more surprised if MSP's LCC paid the same wages as it's legacy carrier.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Another post that makes my point. Except for this thread, it should be "One of those companies has been around since the 1920s, and one has been around since 2007."

But the people here aren't saying that. They are stating it's the same equipment flying the same routes, therefore should equal legacy size pay. Regardless of age of airline, and regardless of the small size.
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I actually agree with you. I don't know of any company that has started up and gone straight to legacy rates, especially before turning a profit. Nobody here expects that, either. They're just hoping your pilot group will organize and press for better.

Anyway, no need to get up in arms about it. Hell, my company's rates and work rules are junk compared to legacy carriers. We know it, and you can be assured we'll do better in 2016.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Pay is commensurate with the airline's profitability (#1) and second its revenue generation. The revenue platform of a 700 airplane operation is vastly higher and different than that of a 50 airplane operation. I said nothing of corporate pilots, I distinctly wrote Part 121 passenger airlines.
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Oh god, I want to live in THAT world.

Remember who you're trying to preach to. young padawan!
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Both Sun Country and Delta Air Lines fly Boeing 737-800NGs from MSP to JFK. Same route, same exact plane, and more or less same priced tickets. Care to explain the difference in Delta 737 pay and Sun Country 737 pay, both being ALPA carriers? :rolleyes:
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The difference, of course, is that I've never met a Sun Country pilot who considered his pay rates to be acceptable, and they are working hard to improve them in collective bargaining.

Simple typo from a phone. Your personal attacks are on par with a high school graduate.
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I'll keep cashing my pay checks, and you can keep stroking that degree.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Both Sun Country and Delta Air Lines fly Boeing 737-800NGs from MSP to JFK. Same route, same exact plane, and more or less same priced tickets. Care to explain the difference in Delta 737 pay and Sun Country 737 pay, both being ALPA carriers? :rolleyes:

Simple typo from a phone. Your personal attacks are on par with a high school graduate.
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2/24-2/28 MSP-JFK
Sun Country $372
Delta $372

3/24-3/28
Sun Country $372
Delta $372

Dead on.....NWA/DAL has a history of matching the fairs of any Terminal 2 carrier (or anyone for that matter) when invading 'their space'. If Sun Country were to drop JFK, DAL would raise the fairs instantly....But I suppose when you own the vast majority of the gates at MSP you can do that....
 
Derg said:
If you see the red-headed ALPA attorney around Herndon, she makes a delicious turkey chili.
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ES?

Uh....that's gonna be the only thing she is successful at then.
 
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ATN_Pilot said:
Common misconception. Captain Woerth didn't make a judgment call about how much it was lowering the bar. He didn't sign the agreement because the CCAir MEC didn't follow required bargaining policy. ALPA bargaining policy prohibits concessionary bargaining if management refuses to show you the proof that the concessions are necessary for the company to help pull itself out of a hole. Ornstein refused to show the MEC any numbers or other proof to justify his demands, but the MEC negotiated a concessionary agreement anyway. If you don't follow policy, the President can't sign your agreement.
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And yet Moak signed the PSA deal.
 
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