Thinking about buying a 120/140, tips, advice?

KKochan

Well-Known Member
I'm thinking about buying a Cessna 120 or 140 to build time in. I have 270hrs and don't want to go the CFI route at this point in my life. I'd be buying it within a the next month and then flying it all over the country, or as much of it as I can access in that plane.

Any tips or advice? I've already heard to make sure it has the Cleveland brake conversion, and a Scott tailwheel won't hurt. I'd only purchase one that has had an annual within the last 6 months or so, and flies regularly.
 
I'm thinking about buying a Cessna 120 or 140 to build time in. I have 270hrs and don't want to go the CFI route at this point in my life. I'd be buying it within a the next month and then flying it all over the country, or as much of it as I can access in that plane.

Any tips or advice? I've already heard to make sure it has the Cleveland brake conversion, and a Scott tailwheel won't hurt. I'd only purchase one that has had an annual within the last 6 months or so, and flies regularly.

Pretty simple and honest airplane and hard to go wrong, however I wouldn't buy one "that has been annualed". Instead, get a thorough pre-purchase inspection from a good General Aviation IA (preferably the guy/gal who will be doing your maintenance in the future) as part of the due diligence process, then upon purchase they should be able to convert/complete the pre-purchase as a new annual. There are plenty of shady mechanics out there who's annuals aren't much more than a pencil whip. Taking the airplane the shady guy annualed to a good IA and you might find a lot of AD's that haven't been complied with and shoddy stuff that they will require to be fixed before it gets signed off.

The pre-purchase will almost always bring up a few points that can be used to negotiate a lower price (it will pay for itself) and/or have the seller fix them before you take possession, easily saving you 1-2 thousand dollars in the first couple years of ownership. It will also help relieve the stress of your first annual with a new IA. Most IA's I know have more expensive and in-depth "first time" annuals on a new airplane because they take a very deep look and dig into AD history until they are comfortable that the airplane is solid and legal before they'll put their name in the logs... then subsequent inspections are a bit faster and less costly (unless something breaks of course).

For time building and fun flying, I'd try to find a fully painted one. Polishing aluminum airplanes looks neat but is a pain.
 
It's just me, but I wouldn't touch one without an electrical system. Also, mine had a vacuum pump mod so no venturis. Toe brakes are nice and, though you said you don't want to CFI, brakes on the right side are a good selling point for later and will be nice for the CFI's you fly with.

Great little plane, though. Be sure you are comfortable with cross winds before heading out to places where you might not have much choice. Taxi slow.
 
Pretty simple and honest airplane and hard to go wrong, however I wouldn't buy one "that has been annualed". Instead, get a thorough pre-purchase inspection from a good General Aviation IA (preferably the guy/gal who will be doing your maintenance in the future) as part of the due diligence process, then upon purchase they should be able to convert/complete the pre-purchase as a new annual. There are plenty of shady mechanics out there who's annuals aren't much more than a pencil whip. Taking the airplane the shady guy annualed to a good IA and you might find a lot of AD's that haven't been complied with and shoddy stuff that they will require to be fixed before it gets signed off.

The pre-purchase will almost always bring up a few points that can be used to negotiate a lower price (it will pay for itself) and/or have the seller fix them before you take possession, easily saving you 1-2 thousand dollars in the first couple years of ownership. It will also help relieve the stress of your first annual with a new IA. Most IA's I know have more expensive and in-depth "first time" annuals on a new airplane because they take a very deep look and dig into AD history until they are comfortable that the airplane is solid and legal before they'll put their name in the logs... then subsequent inspections are a bit faster and less costly (unless something breaks of course).

For time building and fun flying, I'd try to find a fully painted one. Polishing aluminum airplanes looks neat but is a pain.


Thank you for the advice, that's something I was thinking about, but I'll definitely make sure I have a pre purchase done. There's a very good chance the one I buy wouldn't even be in the same state, is there a good way of looking up reputable IAs in different areas?
 
It's just me, but I wouldn't touch one without an electrical system. Also, mine had a vacuum pump mod so no venturis. Toe brakes are nice and, though you said you don't want to CFI, brakes on the right side are a good selling point for later and will be nice for the CFI's you fly with.

Great little plane, though. Be sure you are comfortable with cross winds before heading out to places where you might not have much choice. Taxi slow.

Yep I want one with an electrical system and a single comm/transponder at the absolute minimum. I've seen several with vacuum pumps/IFR equipped.. I'll keep in mind the toe brakes.

And yes I'll definitely practice a lot in crosswinds etc, I do have a t/w endorsement that I got in a 170, I've heard the 140 is a bit more squirrelly.
 
I've also been told to look into a 150 with a tailwheel conversion. Is there a big difference in cost between maintaining something like a 140 and a 150? The 150 will most likely have better electrical, useful load, and a little more power if the engine hasn't been upgraded in the 140.
 
I've also been told to look into a 150 with a tailwheel conversion. Is there a big difference in cost between maintaining something like a 140 and a 150? The 150 will most likely have better electrical, useful load, and a little more power if the engine hasn't been upgraded in the 140.
I would stay away from that just because airplanes that weren't originally taildraggers tend to be sort of kludgy.
 
There is a guy who has flown one, but I'll be darned if I can remember his name.
Gotcha. I think most 140s have pretty reasonable useful load for a small 2 seater, I'm 165lbs so not too concerned about that. That's maybe the main advantage of the 150 airframe.
 
Get a 172 the insurance will be half as much and unless you're planning some off airport ops I don't know why you'd want a fabric tail dragger except for the extra costs associated.

Faster haul more, cheaper, etc.
 
I have a tiny bit of time in a Cessna 120. We ran out of rudder authority on a crosswind landing, which made things interesting (at KDVO, for @BEEF SUPREME). We also spun it that flight. :D It was a great airplane, but I think if I'm going to own a taildragger it's going to have to be at least a Decathlon or Citabria variant. :)
 
Get a 172 the insurance will be half as much and unless you're planning some off airport ops I don't know why you'd want a fabric tail dragger except for the extra costs associated.

Faster haul more, cheaper, etc.

Yeah, but it's a 172; it's definitely not cheaper to purchase, or operate. I like the 120/140 look, and I like tailwheels. With the kind of non conventional work I want to get into (no airlines), a bunch of tailwheel time could also come in handy. I'm looking to build time, not carry 4 pax, a 3-4gph difference will make a lot of difference over a couple hundred hours.
 
I have a tiny bit of time in a Cessna 120. We ran out of rudder authority on a crosswind landing, which made things interesting (at KDVO, for @BEEF SUPREME). We also spun it that flight. :D It was a great airplane, but I think if I'm going to own a taildragger it's going to have to be at least a Decathlon or Citabria variant. :)

I'd love to own a Decathlon, or anything else aerobatic, but the 120/140 is within my budget. :)
 
I just bought a 140 about 3 months ago and love it. If you can hanger it go for a rag wing and forget the metal wings. They fly better not only because they're lighter, but there's one metallized STC (can't recall which one) that places the metal overlap on a critical spot on the wing and slows it down. I have a cruise prop and can outrun a 150 cruising all day at 110-112mph with the stock C-85. I only had 30 t/w hours and no time in type and got insurance for a slight bit above $600, so its cheap to obtain.

The Cessna 120/140 club forum is a must for any owner. Wealth of knowledge everywhere there.

Stay away from the 150 t/w conversions unless its a David Lowe STC conversion. He essentially makes a 150 into a 140, using their gear legs which is tall enough, unlike the other conversions.


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