The Great Jumpseat War of 2019

Der_Meister said:
Glad I work for DAL. I feel like this a cyclical thing, the sooner people just try and help one another get to and from work the better it will be for all.

But I have to agree with UAL here, most or the planes regionals fly are owned by the big name on the side of the jet. Just enjoy the ride it's a much more simple life when you do.
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As of now, you’re the only airline giving them priority.
 
BigZ said:
From that SAPA update - either your shop feels it's all kinds of special, or they are walking you into a trap.
It talks about seats in the back and JS agreements - BS, those aren't your seats in the back. JS war is JS war, but start denying SA1s their seats and it's going to open a whole another can of worms.
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That's false. They're referring to jumpseat listings with a seat in the back. Still stupid, but there's enough misinformation going around.
 
JordanD said:
That's false. They're referring to jumpseat listings with a seat in the back. Still stupid, but there's enough misinformation going around.
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And how exactly would UAL/UAX list for those on UAX flights?
I'm either SA0/SA1 on UAL/UAX through wife's bennies or SA8X or whatever it's called when listing for JS. On ZW bennies it was something like SA5 I believe, but I'd imagine rollable to JS without relisting. Soooooooo to me what's written reads only one way.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
"Keep Delta, My Delta"
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The problem with cute phrases is someone can turn it around to be funnier. Around 2008, there were a number of funny “Keep Delta your Delta” stickers afoot.

Acrofox said:
“We have altered the deal. Pray we do not alter it any further.”
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I suspect in a couple of weeks, the regional pilots will be like “We have no choice General Calrissian, our cruisers can’t repel firepower of that magnitude!”
 
Derg said:
Sadly, if SkyWest keeps over-playing their hand, the industry might decide to Comair them.
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I'm not sure I see the parallels in these situations.

My recollection of Comair and its relationship with Delta, vs this situation have very little in common.

Either way, I'd like to think we are all united in ending the defacto B scale the FFD carriers represent and ALPA pilots of United stood so strong against in 85. It's somewhat interesting so many pilots seemingly glee at the concept of another pilot group, spitting management parlance, being "comaired".

The fact is SkyWest is what it is because it's the ultimate choice for mainline management for cheap, responsive non union labor. Call Chip and his boys will lay down for any price. SkyWest owns the jets and the dutifully cheap compliant labor. If St. George were to get a whiff this was actually going to be an issue in contracts they would get SAPA to lie down, right now.

If Kirby really cared, and really thought this was a problem SkyWest would capitulate, and be the first to do so.


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The Skywest and RAH folks need to remember that while EVERYONE suffered after 9/11, you had over 2000 gals and guys with an involuntary furlough or two, a bankrupty, 1113(c) proceedings, a merger, a JCBA, oh, and a SLI. That was JUST on the United side.

While this was going on Skywest and RAH were experiencing success in that time frame. Thankfully things are good and while a memory, folks have moved past the tougher times.

With that, the United folks who have been through this will have zero patience with any BS around the jumpseat or any denials from Skywest and/or RAH. The pilots at those carriers need to realize that.
 
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Cazadores said:
I'm not sure I see the parallels in these situations.

My recollection of Comair and its relationship with Delta, vs this situation have very little in common.

Either way, I'd like to think we are all united in ending the defacto B scale the FFD carriers represent and ALPA pilots of United stood so strong against in 85. It's somewhat interesting so many pilots seemingly glee at the concept of another pilot group, spitting management parlance, being "comaired".

The fact is SkyWest is what it is because it's the ultimate choice for mainline management for cheap, responsive non union labor. Call Chip and his boys will lay down for any price. SkyWest owns the jets and the dutifully cheap compliant labor. If St. George were to get a whiff this was actually going to be an issue in contracts they would get SAPA to lie down, right now.

If Kirby really cared, and really thought this was a problem SkyWest would capitulate, and be the first to do so.


Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
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“If this gets bad Chip will make sure we are all okay.” The most Skywest statement ever made.
 
Doug Masters said:
“If this gets bad Chip will make sure we are all okay.” The most Skywest statement ever made.
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Is that what I said?

It's not, read it again. For comprehension.

Or, toss me another half witted one liner. It might get you some credibility around here these days.

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BigZ said:
And how exactly would UAL/UAX list for those on UAX flights?
I'm either SA0/SA1 on UAL/UAX through wife's bennies or SA8X or whatever it's called when listing for JS. On ZW bennies it was something like SA5 I believe, but I'd imagine rollable to JS without relisting. Soooooooo to me what's written reads only one way.
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Huh? United Express Pilots have united pass benefits.
 
JordanD said:
Huh? United Express Pilots have united pass benefits.
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That's exactly what I said - SA4 or 5, whatever it is. Mainline is SA1 or SA0 when a vacation pass is dropped. I read the SAPA thing as suggesting to deny those, which is why I wrote the original post.
You said nah, that's for a JS listing with a seat in the back - which would make it SA8 or whatever it is OAL list at - why would UAL/UAX list like that?
 
BigZ said:
That's exactly what I said - SA4 or 5, whatever it is. Mainline is SA1 or SA0 when a vacation pass is dropped. I read the SAPA thing as suggesting to deny those, which is why I wrote the original post.
You said nah, that's for a JS listing with a seat in the back - which would make it SA8 or whatever it is OAL list at - why would UAL/UAX list like that?
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Probably referring to other paint? Because they want the jump denied on every paint not just UAX paint.
 
tcco94 said:
Probably referring to other paint? Because they want the jump denied on every paint not just UAX paint.
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Wait, you want me to deny all United mainline, ExpressJet, Air Wisconsin, CommutAir, Trans States and GoJet pilots the jumpseat?

Yes, this is what we are forced to do to avoid violating our own FOM until a proper agreement can be put back in place.

What if there is room in the back? Does this only refer to sitting in the actual jumpseat?

No, as reciprocal jumpseat agreements cover all utilization of jumpseat requests and we no longer have a valid agreement with United mainline, ExpressJet, Air Wisconsin, CommutAir, Trans States and GoJet, this includes any listing request for the jumpseat regardless if there are seats in the back available for all jumpseaters listed.

Does this include non-United branded SkyWest flights?

Yes, because United is unwilling to work with us to correct the FOM violation. We can not carry United mainline, ExpressJet, Air Wisconsin, CommutAir, Trans States or GoJet pilots that would willfully violate longstanding reciprocal jumpseat agreements with us.
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Dunno. Emphasis mine.
 
BigZ said:
Dunno. Emphasis mine.
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Yes but you asked why would UAL/UAX list like that... I was understanding the conversation to be UAL/UAX-E listing for a jump and flow to the back on let's say a Delta OO paint? Not UAL/UAX-E listing for the jump on a UAX flight.... Because you can double list anyways so...or at least gate agents have left my standby and added my jumpseat requesf
 
Just out of curiosity, did OO ever get that jumpseat listing on OO operated Delta flights fixed? The one where it charges a pilot the 200+ fee to ride on their own plane if someone else is listed 1W with seats available?
 
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bLizZuE said:
I do not personally know of any airline that negotiated pass travel.
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We did. And then during BK we lost a bunch of that ability but the Company can't change anything without our permission.

trafficinsight said:
Everybody I've looked up to for years has told me that you stand with your peers in this business, it's literally in my career's DNA, and all of a sudden those folks seem like they were full of crap when they said that.
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In this case peer means ALPA carrier. Notice who signed the thing and who didn't. (Mesa doesn't count due to their leadership right now).
 
JDean3204 said:
Just out of curiosity, did OO ever get that jumpseat listing on OO operated Delta flights fixed? The one where it charges a pilot the 200+ fee to ride on their own plane if someone else is listed 1W with seats available?
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Not to my knowledge. Always nice watching a jet with 41 empty seats push back without you.
 
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