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All dragon~
My only issue—and it may not apply in this case—is with people who aren't fulfilling their dream but instead are fulfilling someone else's.
~Foxy
Teen dies attempting to fly around the world
- Thread starter fast89pony
- Start date
My only issue—and it may not apply in this case—is with people who aren't fulfilling their dream but instead are fulfilling someone else's.
~Foxy
gulfstreampiper
Well-Known Member
There isn't one pilot who didn't have a dream when he was a kid, and you are gonna criticize this one for chasing his? Plus you make it sound like he did this alone. His dad(who I know personally) was with him and is a highly experienced pilot. Just so you know, he wasn't doing this as a "stunt" The whole purpose was to raise money for The Citizens Foundation which builds and operates schools in Pakistan for underprivileged children.Life cut short just to set some arbitrary record. Personally, I think this youngest pilot to .... Bravo Sierra should be heavily discouraged. "Hey - let's take a new pilot, send them around the world, and give them the ultimate in 'get there 'itis'. Jesus Christ - if you really want to kill a kid, just give them an ATV already.
http://flyaroundtheworldin30days.com/
killbilly
Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
Clearly you don't know frank or his posting history.
Boris Badenov
This is no laughing matter.
Knock or don't knock, totally your call. But going back to the moon, or in to space, etc. is very likely to result in real knowledge. Being the youngest person to fly "around the world" (which is an arbitrary designation, btw, unless he flew a perfect Great Circle) is more like climbing the 7 summits (also pretty much arbitrary) or wingsuiting, or what have you. And there we reach the point of personal preference...I think it would be a lot more interesting and powerful for me, personally, to see the top of k2 or whatever than to monitor the autopilot for hour after grueling hour of watching the air go by. I don't knock the ambition, but I certainly don't understand it, and I have a sneaking suspicion that it was motivated more by some absurd notion of putting one's name in a book somewhere than by a genuine exploratory urge. In any case, ultimately, it's none of my business. Sorry the kid and his dad died. I'd feel pretty stupid if I'd died trying to do something thousands (probably tens of thousands, if not more) of people do every year, but that's just me.
Like...youngest person to reach ski to the South Pole? Youngest person to free climb El Capitan? Youngest winner of the Tourist Trophy? Youngest winner of the Dakar Rally? (etc etc etc). Yeah, awesome. Actually, awesome whether you're 15 or 50.
But youngest person to operate an aviation appliance across some extremely long, albeit totally arbitrary, distance? I mean, cool enough, I guess, but not, to my mind at least, something to die over.
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
First off, anytime someone does something they otherwise enjoy doing for "charity", they're not doing it for the charity - they're using the charity to justify them doing it. I used to do Pilots N' Paws missions years ago. I loved doing it because it gave me a mission - but I would have been flying regardless. The charity wasn't the reason for my flying, just a way to justify it and write it off my taxes, and have some fun. It's not like these triathletes running for leukemia/lymphoma are only doing events because of this - it just gives them a sense of purpose to associate with what they're already doing. When someone wears a shirt in a marathon that says "I run for Boston!" that's complete BS - you were running anyways and now you're trying to justify the time and energy to others by saying you're running for some cause (that you're not actually raising money for, or benefiting in any way, but that's besides the point).
Second, I was a teenage pilot myself with dreams. None of those dreams was worth dying for. "He died doing what he loved" is a rationalization for old men who've lived full lives - it's complete horse * when applied to a child.
I get the idea that there's risk in anything - including flying in general. But taking someone who couldn't have been a licensed pilot for more than two years and giving then an ultimatum to make it around the world in a single in 30-days? Well that goes against everything I know about general aviation safety and responsible flight planning. If the dad hadn't died in the accident, I would have otherwise suggested he should be publicly flogged for supporting this, but that's just me.
ChasenSFO
hen teaser
Tsk tsk the turn this thread has taken. What ever happened to doing things because they're awesome? How many of us are ever going to travel the world in one go? See it all from a small plane, how amazing that would all look and how much fun it would be to arrive in places you've never even heard of. Doing that at age 17 would be one hell of an adventure, and to get to do it all with his Dad would be one hell of an awesome experience they'd always look back on.
In this case, I get the feeling the father likely had a heavy influence on the 17 year old kid's decision. But in general, when people want to break records like this, I'd argue it's more for them than it is caring what any of us think. Personal accomplishments are big to some people, myself included, and they're not things that you do for bragging rights to others. I can totally see the appeal in this trip had it gone right. Since they did emergency training before the trip, they knew there was a chance they wouldn't make it. I'm not going to debate about who had the final say on how worthwhile the risk was, but again, that isn't up to us to determine for these two. I may think something is worth risking life and limb for that you wouldn't cross the street for, it is just a matter of perspective. At the end of the day, we can judge people who die trying to accomplish a goal like this, or we can just assume that since they went for it, they were willing to take the risk. I'm much more impressed with a 17 year old kid who died trying to be the youngest person to fly around the world than I am with a 47 year old basement dweller who has no motivation in life and will live another 30 years.
Just sayin'.
In this case, I get the feeling the father likely had a heavy influence on the 17 year old kid's decision. But in general, when people want to break records like this, I'd argue it's more for them than it is caring what any of us think. Personal accomplishments are big to some people, myself included, and they're not things that you do for bragging rights to others. I can totally see the appeal in this trip had it gone right. Since they did emergency training before the trip, they knew there was a chance they wouldn't make it. I'm not going to debate about who had the final say on how worthwhile the risk was, but again, that isn't up to us to determine for these two. I may think something is worth risking life and limb for that you wouldn't cross the street for, it is just a matter of perspective. At the end of the day, we can judge people who die trying to accomplish a goal like this, or we can just assume that since they went for it, they were willing to take the risk. I'm much more impressed with a 17 year old kid who died trying to be the youngest person to fly around the world than I am with a 47 year old basement dweller who has no motivation in life and will live another 30 years.
Just sayin'.
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
You know what else is awesome? Sex with a partner. Your first year in college. Meeting the love of your life and marrying them. Seeing your children born. Getting to a place in your career where you can help others begin theirs.
Not saying this kid would have done all of these things, but if I end up in a basement at 47, at least I'll have scratched these off of my bucket list. There is nothing worth dying for at 17, short of some heroic act that saves lives.
Just flying an airplane in general is awesome. Trying to be the youngest around the world in 30-days is just being greedy, in my humble opinion. There's risk and then there's unnecessary risk. I suppose each person has to come up with their own calculation on that, but I think we can agree that the risk turned out too great here.
Vector4Food
This job would be easier without all the airplanes
Goonie
Never say die
really?
nocturnalaviator
Family Man
What is this love of your life, marriage and kids thing that you speak of?! Foreign to me..
Great job to the kid for wanting to go after his dreams. RIP
Boris Badenov
This is no laughing matter.
It's certainly interesting who's wearing what number of stripes, in light of the "whose dream is it, anyway" discussion above.
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
I imagine the plane is at the bottom of the pacific, but it would be interesting if that video recording was rolling and they could get the memory card out of it.
mrivc211
Well-Known Member
Out of respect for the 2 of them, why don't we refrain from making these types of comments.
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
I think it's a worthy question to ask. Nobody is pissing on any graves by posing the question of how a father/son dynamic works in a crew environment.
WestIndian425
Well-Known Member
The difference in perspective is quite surprising and not surprising at the same time.
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
Interesting article here:
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/07/2...ng-world-flight-record-killed-in-plane-crash/
"Babar Suleman had long dreamed of flying around the world. He and his son decided to make the adventure a fundraiser for the Citizens Foundation, which has built 1,000 schools in Pakistan."
And from here: http://aroundtheworld4edu.weebly.com/meet-the-pilots.html
Babar Suleman was born and raised in Pakistan, where he attended the Pakistani Air Force training academy in Sarghoda. Though he ultimately did not join the Pakistani air force, his dream to fly stayed with him. He went to Engineering school and, in the early 80s, obtained a Masters Degree from the University of Wisconsin. In 2007, he finally achieved his goal of learning to fly. There was one aspect of that goal though, that he had yet to accomplish: flying around the world. He decided to finally put that dream into action in January of 2014 when he began to put plans into motion . This summer, he will be the first Pakistani-American to fly around the world.
No disrespect intended. Sad situation and terrible event for their family and friends. I sincerely hope rescuers are able to locate the Father. The wreckage has been reported as found, some of it recovered and there is pinging from a black box which has not been located yet. The search resumed this morning.
The Dad has a large number of friends over on the Beech forum that I belong to (he was a member there as well and had been for several years, but I didn't really know him) and everyone is understandably pretty distraught. He was very well liked and respected. Just sorry that their adventure had to end this way. He had been posting/chronicling about their flight together over there as well. His Dad was very proud of his son getting his license.
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/07/2...ng-world-flight-record-killed-in-plane-crash/
"Babar Suleman had long dreamed of flying around the world. He and his son decided to make the adventure a fundraiser for the Citizens Foundation, which has built 1,000 schools in Pakistan."
And from here: http://aroundtheworld4edu.weebly.com/meet-the-pilots.html
Babar Suleman was born and raised in Pakistan, where he attended the Pakistani Air Force training academy in Sarghoda. Though he ultimately did not join the Pakistani air force, his dream to fly stayed with him. He went to Engineering school and, in the early 80s, obtained a Masters Degree from the University of Wisconsin. In 2007, he finally achieved his goal of learning to fly. There was one aspect of that goal though, that he had yet to accomplish: flying around the world. He decided to finally put that dream into action in January of 2014 when he began to put plans into motion . This summer, he will be the first Pakistani-American to fly around the world.
No disrespect intended. Sad situation and terrible event for their family and friends. I sincerely hope rescuers are able to locate the Father. The wreckage has been reported as found, some of it recovered and there is pinging from a black box which has not been located yet. The search resumed this morning.
The Dad has a large number of friends over on the Beech forum that I belong to (he was a member there as well and had been for several years, but I didn't really know him) and everyone is understandably pretty distraught. He was very well liked and respected. Just sorry that their adventure had to end this way. He had been posting/chronicling about their flight together over there as well. His Dad was very proud of his son getting his license.
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I am not disrespecting the dead - not at all. My prayers go with the two aboard and their family. As with all accidents, this one provides a lesson for us all, but we first have to look. Those who don't learn from the past...well, we all know how that ends.
There was early conjecture about CRM with Asiana 214. That crash again demonstrated that respect of elders in Asian cultures - age, flight hours, tenure at the airline, years in the industry - can sometimes outweigh modern CRM practices and contribute to accidents. How many threads and posts have we had here discussing that accident?
There was early conjecture about CRM with Asiana 214. That crash again demonstrated that respect of elders in Asian cultures - age, flight hours, tenure at the airline, years in the industry - can sometimes outweigh modern CRM practices and contribute to accidents. How many threads and posts have we had here discussing that accident?
DubyaDawg
Well-Known Member
Just heard Fox News is about to interview Amelia Rose Earhart on the subject... I don't know how it's gonna go but for whatever reason that makes me really angry. Maybe she's trying to regain some publicity after people started to realize that the 19 year old that successfully made the flight actually solo was a more impressing accomplishment than hers. Rant over, sorry. It sounds like the father/son in this instance wanted to fly around the world for the sake of doing it, and less for the record. If that's the case I wonder why they wouldn't have just used a twin engine vs the Bonanza?
