SWA a stepping stone airline

[FlyingAccountant]

What’s the problem with WN? Pay? Or is it to go fly bigger jets to better places?

 

[trafficinsight]

I don't care where other people choose to work.

The company has to attract talent but if that talent isn't planning on staying it really doesn't bother me.

 

[🦈💜]

you know, I would've stayed long-term. But screw them.

 

[Chief Captain]

The music beginning to stop? Find a seat time?

My guess is that fewer people are leaving because of the recently announced AIP. Stuff always gets leaked early.

 

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Our retirements are starting to go up and don’t stop for another 9 years. But the hiring that happened over last 2 years was more getting airlines back to levels pre Covid from buyouts and retirements and some added growth. But yeah we’ve even said our hiring now will start to slow down (still going to be a lot of hiring if you compare to 2018-2019). Music stopping in this industry with what’s about to go down though seems unlikely. Baring a black swan but even with a black swan the airlines are losing a LOT of people here this decade and early next.

It’s not just the hiring. It’s the fact that Jan 2014 to present your shop has hired ~55-60% of its seniority list, at an avg age around 37.



Yeah, there’s a lot of hiring but when it comes to DL and UA, anyone starting 2024 is on the back side of the curve behind thousands and thousands of young guys.

 

[Maximilian_Jenius]

It’s not just the hiring. It’s the fact that Jan 2014 to present your shop has hired ~55-60% of its seniority list, at an avg age around 37.



Yeah, there’s a lot of hiring but when it comes to DL and UA, anyone starting 2024 is on the back side of the curve behind thousands and thousands of young guys.

I think that the difference in this case when comparing DL vs. UA, is that UA just started really ramping up pilot hiring since 2022. But since then has already hired like 5k pilots and I believe is already at 16k pilots.

 

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

I think that the difference in this case when comparing DL vs. UA, is that UA just started really ramping up pilot hiring since 2022. But since then has already hired like 5k pilots and I believe is already at 16k pilots.

Yeah but I think United has had a hiring spree of a sort since 2013.

 

[Skåning]

I think that the difference in this case when comparing DL vs. UA, is that UA just started really ramping up pilot hiring since 2022. But since then has already hired like 5k pilots and I believe is already at 16k pilots.

Welcome back! How's training going?

 

[Maximilian_Jenius]

Welcome back! How's training going?

National DPE shortage has made getting my instructor ratings difficult, its been near impossible to get a DPE for my ride. My checkrides have been canceled like 2x's by DPE's, because they got more money doing rides at pilot mills. The last one I canceled due to the DPE upping his fee from $1500 to $2400. I called the FSDO, they apparently don't do CFI rides anymore and they referred me back to the national DPE list. So, I'm going out of state to get my CFI and CFII done together, with a school that has in-house DPE's.

 

[arkflyr]

I called the FSDO, they apparently don't do CFI rides anymore and they referred me back to the national DPE list. So, I'm going out of state to get my CFI and CFII done together, with a school that has in-house DPE's.

First off welcome back, second this is going to make me sound like old man river but back in my day we had to do our CFI with the FSDO, they didn't want DPE's doing it. It was the only free checkride I took back then and they made us earn it.

Finally I need to get into the DPE racket, holy cow $2400 for a checkride?

 

[SFCC/UND]

What’s the problem with WN? Pay? Or is it to go fly bigger jets to better places?

Probably feels like a regional to them? Flying a 737 a couple legs a day.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

First off welcome back, second this is going to make me sound like old man river but back in my day we had to do our CFI with the FSDO, they didn't want DPE's doing it. It was the only free checkride I took back then and they made us earn it.

Finally I need to get into the DPE racket, holy cow $2400 for a checkride?

I tried during the pandemic. Didn’t make it very far. They said I didn’t have enough recency of experience as a CFI.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

Probably feels like a regional to them? Flying a 737 a couple legs a day.

Wah.

 

[arkflyr]

I tried during the pandemic. Didn’t make it very far. They said I didn’t have enough recency of experience as a CFI.

I'd be screwed, haven't instructed since '05.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I'd be screwed, haven't instructed since '05.

The last time I signed anyone off for a checkride was in 1995.

 

[tcco94]

It’s not just the hiring. It’s the fact that Jan 2014 to present your shop has hired ~55-60% of its seniority list, at an avg age around 37.



Yeah, there’s a lot of hiring but when it comes to DL and UA, anyone starting 2024 is on the back side of the curve behind thousands and thousands of young guys.

You’re not wrong there either. But there is still an exodus about to happen to the top still. Sure your senior days at the end won’t be as glorious as those of us hired 2014-2020 but you’ll still have movement up to 2032.

 

[tcco94]

Wah.

I don’t get this personally. If someone applied to United from SWA and said yeah I don’t particularly like this type of flying for the rest of my career, would you look at them and say they are a crybaby? Lol

Sometimes with SWA I just don’t get it. Feels like you’re all in on that LUV stuff or you’re not and trying to just fly an airplane and move on from that company.

 

[ZapBrannigan]

I don’t get this personally. If someone applied to United from SWA and said yeah I don’t particularly like this type of flying for the rest of my career, would you look at them and say they are a crybaby? Lol

Sometimes with SWA I just don’t get it. Feels like you’re all in on that LUV stuff or you’re not and trying to just fly an airplane and move on from that company.

Nah I don't have any problem with that. I'm the last person who would give somebody a hard time for job hopping.

The irrational hatred/dislike of the 737 to the point that people make career decisions to avoid that airplane is the thing that I can't wrap my head around.

My generation was never like that. We took the first gig that came along and if it was a Jurassic era DC9 then great! We were happy to fly it.

If you're making life altering career decisions just to avoid the 737... then yeah. You're a toddler.

 

[CoffeeIcePapers]

My generation was never like that. We took the first gig that came along and if it was a Jurassic era DC9 then great! We were happy to fly it.

This is because you had no choice.

If you're making life altering career decisions just to avoid the 737... then yeah. You're a toddler.

I don't know, the prospect of spending a 30+ year career in the 737 flying doing the type of flying you guys do is pretty daunting. I think there's more to it than just that, though.

 

[tcco94]

Nah I don't have any problem with that. I'm the last person who would give somebody a hard time for job hopping.

The irrational hatred/dislike of the 737 to the point that people make career decisions to avoid that airplane is the thing that I can't wrap my head around.

My generation was never like that. We took the first gig that came along and if it was a Jurassic era DC9 then great! We were happy to fly it.

If you're making life altering career decisions just to avoid the 737... then yeah. You're a toddler.

I can see your point. A plane is a plane. It’s definitely a different generation now where the expectation of what you’ll fly is already set when they are out flying Cessna’s. I haven’t been in this industry that long myself but I was stoked to fly a CRJ200. Now I will listen to people complain about having to fly an E175. When we got that at my regional it was like a whole different airline, everyone loved it.