SO, Did Eagle pilots win the lottery today?

kellwolf said:
Careful with this one. You need to see the EXACT contract language down to the wording and the crossed Ts and dotted Is. Sometimes what management promises is there is obscured and clouded by contract language with enough loopholes to trip everyone up. Even if the pilots do "go with the plane" is there language in there to guarantee a CA stays a CA? Loose enough language, and a 20 year CA could find themselves a new hire FO at the new company....but, hey, they went with the airplane, right?
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I agree. We only see the surface of this wording. Honestly I have been around the BIG CORPORATION/BIG UNION thing most of my 20ish years of working life. I know (IMO) You cannot really trust either of them! I'm not in the "we won" camp myself. I'm in the lets wait and see camp.
 
Can anyone explain how this is this different--in terms of both language and how it will be implemented--from the last time Eagle got a flow through?

I'd just be very wary of any huge change like this, especially considering how big a fiasco the last flow through worked out to be. Has any airline merger, sale, divesture, etc really worked out well for any pilot group in the long run?
 
mooneyguy said:
What about our 50 seat CRJ700? It's still just a 50 seat jet...oh but it has first class:whatever:
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I had no idea they were 50 seaters. Thats kind of messed up.


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N519AT said:
I had no idea they were 50 seaters. Thats kind of messed up.


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Honestly I may be wrong on the total number, but I was told by a couple people from within the company that they indeed did remove seats because AA. Basically aa wont allow 70! except for the atr. Again, this is just what I have been told.
 
mooneyguy said:
Honestly I may be wrong on the total number, but I was told by a couple people from within the company that they indeed did remove seats because AA. Basically aa wont allow 70! except for the atr. Again, this is just what I have been told.
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They were 70 seaters before so I don't think it had anything to do with scope.
 
You guys need to worry about one thing that everyone seems to be missing.

PROFITABILITY.

AMR is not profitable, you slide into Chap 11 and good bye to all hopes and dreams. I don't mean to be such a downer but everyone is worried about k-z and no one is willing to talk about the elephant in the room.

I would be more worried about BK at this point than who I'm flying for in 10 years.
 
subpilot said:
They were 70 seaters before so I don't think it had anything to do with scope.
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The 70 seats were ok because they were flown by Eagle and were exempt from the scope restrictions. Now that Eagle may no longer be "Eagle... a WO of AMR" they would no longer be exempt and become in violation of the scope clause.
 
BobDDuck said:
The 70 seats were ok because they were flown by Eagle and were exempt from the scope restrictions. Now that Eagle may no longer be "Eagle... a WO of AMR" they would no longer be exempt and become in violation of the scope clause.
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You nailed it. They started reconfiguring the crj's over a year ago so they had to have known they were going to divest us way back then.
 
zmiller4 said:
Can anyone explain how this is this different--in terms of both language and how it will be implemented--from the last time Eagle got a flow through?

I'd just be very wary of any huge change like this, especially considering how big a fiasco the last flow through worked out to be. Has any airline merger, sale, divesture, etc really worked out well for any pilot group in the long run?
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The last agreement was a 4 party agreement, AA, AE, ALPA, APA..

This one is a 3 party agreement, AA, AE, ALPA.. no APA to worry about messing with it, NO flowback! From what I've heard from the MEC it was the APA that caused so many problems with the last one.. well that and 9-11

I guess that is the main difference. That and there is no seniority # issued like before and no captain requirement, time to captain requirement or seat locks, just preferential hiring with no interview..

From our teleconference today.. looks like even if we are sold or merged in the future, we still keep our rights to those jobs at AA. The only way for us to lose them is if Eagle is completely liquidated.

In other news, with our divestiture it looks like AA wants the most flexible Air service agreement possible they can get away with while not pissing off the shareholders and SEC too much .. they want the ability to start farming out our flying ASAP.. and our ATR's will likely all be parked by 2014 (a 14% reduction for us).. I see shrinkage in our future.. hopefully the flow is faster than the parking/transfer of flying...
 
zmiller4 said:
Can anyone explain how this is this different--in terms of both language and how it will be implemented--from the last time Eagle got a flow through?

I'd just be very wary of any huge change like this, especially considering how big a fiasco the last flow through worked out to be. Has any airline merger, sale, divesture, etc really worked out well for any pilot group in the long run?
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No flowbacks or resulting displacements. Just Eagle pilots moving up over time.
 
Doug Taylor said:
Doesn't AA have a diaper load of furloughed pilots?
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Outside of the guys that bypassed then no the last AA pilot should be back in a few months. The last TWA pilot by the end of the year and the last numbered Eagle pilot by mid next year.
 
The union yesterday told us the latest numbers are around 900 still on furlough and about a 20% acceptance rate.
 
RPM said:
AA is "expecting" to be through the whole list by November..
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Thats not really true. The first Eagle guy goes over in November, these guys were given AA seniority numbers when they finished IOE in the Jet so they are mixed in with AA furloughs. According to the APA estimate the last AA furlouhg should be recalled in March. Then there are 154 eagle guys at the bottom, then possibly hiring after that.
 
crashmbern said:
Thats not really true. The first Eagle guy goes over in November, these guys were given AA seniority numbers when they finished IOE in the Jet so they are mixed in with AA furloughs. According to the APA estimate the last AA furlouhg should be recalled in March. Then there are 154 eagle guys at the bottom, then possibly hiring after that.
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Ahh.. so many #'s lately.. 244's, 824's, 154's, 25%'s 35%'s, recalls, defers, FTDT, limitations, paycomp.. I get confused. lol
 
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