PNCL Files Chapter 11

I don't know Todd. You're playing for a different team now. Southwest isn't ALPA, they are a part of CAPA.

I'm not a SWAPA member yet, Don.

You just got a raise. And I'd compare my useless CAPA airline W2 with any maxed out AirTran guy.

Actually, the only pay raises that I've received have come from my ALPA negotiated contract. I won't be getting SWA pay rates until January 2015. But regardless, CAPA has nothing to do with pay rates. That's the local union's issue. SWAPA has been relatively effective in that area. But it has nothing to do with CAPA (which SWAPA was considering leaving just last year, by the way).

I got no problem with you being ALPA loyal and all that. But there is no call for dissing the other unions as you always do. I'd be much more in favor of us all working together.

I'd love for us all to work together.....under one big union. I don't care whether we call it ALPA, the APA, the IPA, or whatever else, but it needs to be one big union. All of these disparate unions doing their own thing is harmful to the profession.

Check the link above. CAPA is doing their best to reverse the cargo cutout. The IPA is suing the FAA. You can laugh at that, and I'm sure you will, but it makes me feel like my dues money is going for something that makes me feel proud in that it's the right thing. Might not get anywhere but at least we tried it and made the statement.

What makes you feel better isn't what gets things done. The IPA's lawsuit has several pretty serious possible consequences. It won't accomplish anything, but has real potential to make things worse.
 
Pete's a MSP 200 CA, not MEM. He's pretty much a loose cannon, but I have to kinda back him on some of the ISL points. Which brings me to the "one list" thing. I'm not mad at the Colgan guys. They're getting the shaft, and the -200 guys are getting the shaft. The guys protected by the Bloch award? The -900 guys. For example, if I get displaced from my -200 CA seat, I can only bid -200 FO even though I have the seniority to hold -900 CA in pretty much every base. Why? Bloch award. The -200 is above the quota, so anyone can bid the CA seat. The -900 is on the fence, but will be under the quota for a looooong time thanks to the 16 -900s getting parked in January. So, you're going to have -900 CAs senior to -200 CAs that got displaced back to -200 FO. Based on what I've seen since the ISL, I don't see our "union" fighting to change this. Why? Most are ex-Mesaba. Now, that being said, if the tables were turned (as in quotas were skewed for the Pinnacle guys and it was a 9E run MEC), I'm sure our "union" leaders at 9E would do the same thing. The problem we're running into isn't we don't have one list, it's that we're not unified as one pilot group because mentally it's still 3. There are loyalties there extended way further than a year. The Colgan guys AND the 9E guys will be locked out of -900 CA positions. The Bloch award covers displacements. You can only displace into a position you can a) hold with your seniority and b) isn't protected by a quota. We saw this in 11-09. There were guys displaced that could have held Saab, Q400 or CRJ-900 slots. They didn't get them because of the quotas. The fair thing to do would be to attempt to get the quotas removed, and everyone holds what their seniority can hold. I don't think anyone (including Bloch) saw the entire Colgan operation going away in a year when the ISL came out.

If the company offered severance packages to try to get some the higher seniority guys out, I think you'd have a lot of takers. Depending on when they were offered, I'd probably jump on one.

The other question is what happens to the guys still waiting on training from 11-09? The SMART thing would be to just hold off on the rest of 11-09 until they figure out who is going where. The company doesn't have a good track record on doing the "smart" thing, especially when it comes to training. That's a HUGE part of how we got into this mess: mis-managed training and excess costs associated with it. The smart thing would be to combine training facilities since we're only going to have -900s and -200s in the future and just use the Eagan, MN facility. The company has deep roots in MEM and would likely just keep running two training facilities rather than give up on Flight Safety in MEM.

I'm one of the lucky ones. Odds are in favor of my being gone by the end of the year, hopefully before this train wreck reaches my seniority.
 
If the company offered severance packages to try to get some the higher seniority guys out, I think you'd have a lot of takers. Depending on when they were offered, I'd probably jump on one.

That is a real good idea. Let some of the real senior CAs walk out, creates some movement, helps reduce the number of furloughs.

The other question is what happens to the guys still waiting on training from 11-09? The SMART thing would be to just hold off on the rest of 11-09 until they figure out who is going where. The company doesn't have a good track record on doing the "smart" thing, especially when it comes to training. That's a HUGE part of how we got into this mess: mis-managed training and excess costs associated with it. The smart thing would be to combine training facilities since we're only going to have -900s and -200s in the future and just use the Eagan, MN facility. The company has deep roots in MEM and would likely just keep running two training facilities rather than give up on Flight Safety in MEM.

They said on the call last night that the company plans on finishing 11-09 as there are only just a few classes yet. Not really sure I understand this way of thinking. You already have pilots just sitting around right now and more to come as they start to draw down the Saabs and Q400s next month. Why even run additional Q classes just to have that pilot either displaced or given a furlough notice while in training on an airframe that is going away?
 
At least someone in congress seems to get it....
YUNsH.jpg
 
That is a real good idea. Let some of the real senior CAs walk out, creates some movement, helps reduce the number of furloughs.



They said on the call last night that the company plans on finishing 11-09 as there are only just a few classes yet. Not really sure I understand this way of thinking. You already have pilots just sitting around right now and more to come as they start to draw down the Saabs and Q400s next month. Why even run additional Q classes just to have that pilot either displaced or given a furlough notice while in training on an airframe that is going away?
they will have to cover flying as senior people displace/ bid/ leave.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
I'd like to point out, all of them are Democrats. Know who your friends are, guys, and vote appropriately.

Pilot Partisan.

33% ALPA-PAC contributions went to Republicans.

You see that presentation this week? ;)
 
they will have to cover flying as senior people displace/ bid/ leave.


Then they have no grounds for complaining about training costs. It makes no sense to spend all that $$$ training someone for a position they'll be in for 30-45 days only to have to re-spend all that $$$ training them on a new position. Use reserves to cover it. If you don't have the reserves, cancel the flight. It's not like we're getting the flying back at this point anyway. The did this to themselves. First, they wanted the labor groups to fix their f up when they bit off more training costs than they could handle. Now they're getting a bankruptcy court to do it. This is the company that displaced guys from CA to FO for a WEEK. We had a guy up in JFK that was a JFK CA for a couple of weeks, displaced to MEM FO for a week, then went right back to upgrade training for JFK CA again. THIS is what is costing us so much money. Why couldn't they just leave him in the CA position? We're not THAT short on FOs. MEM FOs on reserve were sitting around BEGGING to fly. Same up in JFK. It's mismanagement of resources and nothing else.
 
they will have to cover flying as senior people displace/ bid/ leave.

So... use and effective date and class dates that are beyond the drawdown dates of the airframes and don't try and do everything at once.

Their inefficiency is going to end up hurting the pilot group in the long run.
 
Additional information about the picketing event next week:
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

INFORMATIONAL PICKETING EVENT: WEDNESDAY (11APR) @ 1030 CDT
The PCL MEC will be holding a picketing event at the Pinnacle Airlines Corp. headquarters in Memphis, TN. Here are the details:
WHO: All Pinnacle pilots in good standing are invited to attend during their time off from work.

WHAT: We will conduct informational picketing to protest and draw attention to the massive payroll failures the Pinnacle pilot group has experienced.

WHERE: We will gather at the Courtyard Memphis Downtown located at 75 Jefferson Avenue.

ATTIRE: We request that all pilots dress in uniform for this event:
Short sleeve shirts, epaulets, and blue or black pants
WHEN: This event will take place next week on Wednesday, April 11th. Pre-Picketing will start at 1030 CDT at the King Cotton Ballroom located on the second floor (directly above the lobby area) of the Courtyard Memphis Downtown
.
Mandatory Pre-Picket Briefing: 1030 to 1155 CDT at the Courtyard Memphis Downtown
Picketing Event: 1200 to 1400 CDT near Pinnacle Airlines Corp. headquarters located at the One Commerce Square Building.
Post-Picketing Rally: 1410 to 1600 CDT at the Courtyard Memphis Downtown
 
Return to lessor? Haha.

Gear didn't come down in IAH.
 

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