fholbert
Mod's - Please don't edit my posts!
That must have been some Christmas Dinner.
Oh Delta X
- Thread starter Cherokee_Cruiser
- Start date
That must have been some Christmas Dinner.
🦈💜
Well-Known Member
Technically speaking, "No association with gender" would be "agender," which is a subset of nonbinary.
Non-binary means that someone doesn't identify as strictly male or female. Interestingly enough, this is a concept that is well-understood (and respected) by many indigenous cultures, as is "transgender," "gay," and so on. Most non-binary people I've talked to about it have no interest in "being a guy," or "being a girl." They are just themselves, and don't feel a pull towards the tropes of "girl" or "boy." You can think of it as being atheist in a country with two strict religions—you have, say, catholic friends and protestant friends, but you're not comfortable pretending to be either.
From my earliest childhood memories, I knew I wasn't a boy. It wasn't that I didn't like running and roughhousing, or climbing trees*. It was a deep and absolute discomfort with being divided into the "male" side. That never changed until I got online and was able to be myself a little, but it was still there when I'd interact with people in person. Making phone calls was miserable, to the point where I still absolutely hate doing it. Going in to meet new people face to face lead to something akin to social anxiety, and it sometimes took a while to steel myself up to do it. At work, I took comfort in being an identity. Most of the people I worked with literally never saw me, and if they did, they would only see an icon I'd choose, along with my unix operator handle/username.
That feeling literally never changed until I transitioned. As soon as I did that, I was comfortable talking with people, meeting new people, and actually being my whole self. Rather than trying to engage in the social patter of my gender as assigned at birth, I could just be myself.
As of the end of last year, I am completely comfortable in my own body for the first time in my life.
The only "choice" was whether to be myself, or take the social and physical path of least resistance and hide who I am.
It's about who you are, not who you're attracted to. And for nonbinary folks, they know that they're not gender binary. Again, back to my stupid religion analogy. You're in line at some government building, and you have to get in line with either the catholics or the protestants. You have to wear clothes that identify you as one or the other, and if you wear elements of both, or neither, people decry that you're just seeking attention. But you don't want to participate. Or perhaps you're muslim, or buddhist, or pagan.
But the form says "Catholic" or "Protestant."
It's not a perfect analogy, as there's an element of choice to most religions, but it's the best I can come up with at the moment. (that I haven't already used here)
-Fox
* Ok, so here's the deal. This is a sidebar, and I'd prefer it not get more attention than the main point, but I want to say it anyway. Guys may not realize this, but many girls also like doing that kind of stuff (physical roughhousing), and many boys don't. Social gender bias starts at such a young age that its effects seem almost natural, but only in the past half century have we started examining how oppressive it can be to be raised female in a traditional patriarchy.
It might seem, from a male perspective, like the battle is won and equal rights are a thing that exist.
But they're not.
We're still a very, very long way from there. If you guys could see the various groups I'm in where women talk privately about dealing with overtly sexist behavior (corporate operators pulling trips from women pilots because the passenger refuses being flown by a woman, discussions on the flight deck that are blatantly horrible, women being literally told "We don't hire women as pilots" ... not in 1983, but in 2021, the repeated phrase "Another empty kitchen," disparaging rants—to women—about how women lack the skill to fly, and the constant, unwanted, increasingly aggressive sexual advances ...) you might begin to understand. These aren't rare occurrences—they happen almost every day. And the oft-repeated advice? "Just smile, be polite, and bear it. Women before you have had to put up with that and worse to get to where we are today, and if you make a scene you risk being written off. Don't bother reporting it, as it's just your word against his." This is advice from women to women. It's not the only thing said, but it's common enough that the sentiment is at least 40% prevalent. And that's what they do. Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it's not there.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
Lol, just an average black family holiday get together. My bf is Italian and he says he loves going to our family get togethers. He says they're all loud, expressive, fun and very entertaining. He says we should get a movie made about us. Vs. when he goes home. He says his family all hates each other, are fake, guilts and manipulates each other, barely talks. Smiles in your face and talks crap about each other. And holds in their feelings. He's from the UP, the trailer park part of Michigan.
Richman
JC’s Resident Curmudgeon
I sympathize. Dating is one giant PITA.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
Always has been, hard and awkward. But thank God I'm off the market. I couldn't imagine being single today, with all the dating/sex apps. As for Joe, he seems fine just being left alone to himself. But he says that he feels so much intense pressure from friends and his brothers, parents to be social.
fholbert
Mod's - Please don't edit my posts!
I was single until I was 37 and loved dating.
Take them to dinner in the airplane, catch the setting sun on one leg. You're a rock star!
Pilot Fighter
Well-Known Member
I'm just going to start calling folks by their SSN to be safe.
