Need Advice: Stay or go?

"Women/men are a dime a dozen. Since she is a "future wife" and not yet a wife, you have no committment to be given ultimatums.....unless you place it on yourself. DO what will make YOU happy, not what will make someone else happy."

I just gotta say WORD UP to that....
 
ElationAviation said:
she gave up the chance to go to a big time med school just to be near him.
Click to expand...

That's not what I got out of the discussion at all:

clipperstall said:
She didn't have to choose me over her dream medical school because luckily for me, she was waitlisted at her top choices. This made OU a no-brainer decision. When I asked her "If you would have gotten into your dream medical school in another state, would you still have chosen OU because of me?" She told me that she didn't know
Click to expand...
 
I hope no one minds a long time lurker adding a different perspective. Some quick background-I'm an ER doctor, 6 years out of residency who has a life long interest in aviation but no experience (does my MS Flight Sim time count? tongue-in-cheek). She may not like the future that your potential aviation career involves, but she needs to look at hers and realize it is not much different. During the first two years of med school she is looking at 8-10 hours of class Monday-Friday followed by another 6-8 hours of studying, 8-10 hours on Sat and Sunday. During her clinical years (years 3 and 4) she is looking at 80 hour work weeks with some variation depending on what rotation she is doing. There is almost no life outside of medicine during medical school. I had a wife and a kid and they felt like strangers. She can do some away rotations (the amount depends on school policy) where she could work at a hospital near where you are. After medical school she is looking at 3-7 years of residency depending on what specialty she wants to go into. She could match into a residency spot at a hospital where you are. Again, she is looking at 80 hour work weeks, more if she decides to do something surgical. 36 hour shifts every 3-5 days. Again, she will not be around much. Now might be the time for her to let you go and pursue your aviation career as you will both have schedules that suck. Maybe you will be able to work your way up to a place where your schedule isn't as bad when she is done with her 7-11+ years of training. As for her life after residency, it is hard to tell you what to expect without knowing what her plans are afterwards. There are some specialities that are family friendly and some that aren't. Either way, I wish you the best of luck with whatever decision you make.
 
Hey Clipper ...

A lot of great points have been made already so I'll attempt to add to the frey !!

Somewhere along the line someone said "Life is about the people you share it with." ... couldn't agree more. I was hating my corporate gig after about 6 years and decided to chase the childhood dream as well .... went all out and finished everything with the exception of the CFI in a really short period of time.

Along the way I really started to read the career change posts more intently and came to the conclusion that maybe I was narrowing down my scope within the aviation world just a little too much by solely focusing on the airlines. (It really did take a long time to realize this !!)

Anyhow... long story short... I've gotten married ... fly around as much as I can...(when the budget committee approves the funds.. :-) Just kidding !!) .... but most importantly sought out a way that worked best for me.

Ultimately I decided to enroll in a PhD program after meeting many professors who have bought their own planes and either just fly for fun ... flight instruct.. some even nabbed a part time corporate gig somewhere.... it seems like the perfect balance between satisfying the flying bug and an enjoyable career with decent benefits and vacation time !!

Granted not everyone is in a position to head down a similar path but the idea is to be open to all the options ... which from the sounds of it you are certainly considering !!

Best of Luck !!
 
Inthedraft said:
I hope no one minds a long time lurker adding a different perspective. Some quick background-I'm an ER doctor, 6 years out of residency who has a life long interest in aviation but no experience (does my MS Flight Sim time count? tongue-in-cheek). She may not like the future that your potential aviation career involves, but she needs to look at hers and realize it is not much different. During the first two years of med school she is looking at 8-10 hours of class Monday-Friday followed by another 6-8 hours of studying, 8-10 hours on Sat and Sunday. During her clinical years (years 3 and 4) she is looking at 80 hour work weeks with some variation depending on what rotation she is doing. There is almost no life outside of medicine during medical school. I had a wife and a kid and they felt like strangers. She can do some away rotations (the amount depends on school policy) where she could work at a hospital near where you are. After medical school she is looking at 3-7 years of residency depending on what specialty she wants to go into. She could match into a residency spot at a hospital where you are. Again, she is looking at 80 hour work weeks, more if she decides to do something surgical. 36 hour shifts every 3-5 days. Again, she will not be around much. Now might be the time for her to let you go and pursue your aviation career as you will both have schedules that suck. Maybe you will be able to work your way up to a place where your schedule isn't as bad when she is done with her 7-11+ years of training. As for her life after residency, it is hard to tell you what to expect without knowing what her plans are afterwards. There are some specialities that are family friendly and some that aren't. Either way, I wish you the best of luck with whatever decision you make.
Click to expand...

Yeah. This seems to coincide with the research I have done about her medical career. Maybe I am way off, but the last four years we have been in a serious long distance relationship. If I stay in my current job, we will definitely be moving in together for at least the four years of her medical school. Even with her hectic study schedule, wouldn't this still be an improvement in the relationship considering I barely (if ever) got to see her before? She seems like she wants to do emergency medicine because of the 8 hour shifts and the lack of being on call. She told me that a family life is more important to her than working like a dog and making tons of money. She also told me that if we got engaged in the next four years, she would try to put in preferences for residency in Oklahoma. While OU doesn't have an emergency medicine residency anymore, Tulsa does.

I have no idea what the future holds on either path. But everyone who has posted has definitely contributed. Hacker, thanks for re-highlighting the fact that she didn't have to CHOOSE me. Although...I truly believe she WOULD have chosen me if it had come down to her dream school and OU.

I want to fly- no doubt about it. I just don't know if it's smart to give up such a stable and beneficial desk job to pursue an airline career. I would like to believe my priorities would never change, but that's just being nieve. One regional pilot told me that even flying the RJ gets old after awhile and becomes yet another way to make money. Is that true for the majority or does that passion for flying still stick around?

This same RJ pilot has been asking me to help him get his foot in the FAA door. He wants to leave because of the strain his career is putting on the family (specifically the time away from home). This makes me think that the grass is greener where I am right now which makes me continue a cycle of unanswered questions and doubt about leaving.

I want to fly and get paid for it. THAT to me is the "dream." But, I also want this relationship to work and to turn into something more. The ONLY difference is this relationship has lasted 5 years and has weathered many storms, and my flying bug bit me when I was 4 years old. I am not sure I can even properly prioritize or weigh these decisions fairly.

Anyone else have thoughts? Regrets? Wish you could have done something different in your career? Wish you would have quit your job to pursue a childhood dream? Realized that family is more important than anything? Realized that personal satisfaction and career happiness is more important?

One more tidbit of information.. It's not that she's necessarily being unsupportive. She told me that she would support me, just not in a romantic relationship any more. She told me she is being selfish and she doesn't want me to go to the airlines because she wants does not want that lifestyle for herself for the rest of her life. This makes me believe that she also won't become a medical workahaulic. Either way, I felt like defending her side today. Ask me again tomorrow and my story might just change.

clipperstall
 
clipperstall said:
She told me that she would support me, just not in a romantic relationship any more. She told me she is being selfish and she doesn't want me to go to the airlines because she wants does not want that lifestyle for herself for the rest of her life.
Click to expand...

Again, do you want to live your life and dreams for her, or do you want to live them for you? Ultimatums are BS and just a form of control; especially when you aren't otherwise formally committed to this person.

The pure fact of the matter that you need to unscrew yourself and face, is that you can't have both things you want. She's made that selfishly clear. And if you keep her, you won't have the dream you want.
 
my 2 cents.... when i was your age i was married with 4 kids...... i do regret getting so serious so young.... live your life! follow your dreams!!... and if your relationship was ment to be it will be no matter where you live...also alot of couples make the best out of traveling spouses i.e. military couples, pro basketball, baseball and anyother sport you can think of. lord willling you have plently of years left to settle down.. I like the idea about buying a plane if you go to regionals or not... also cant your suga mama go to med school anywhere in the world. the whole world needs doctors...
 
I don't see what's unreasonable about an ultimatum in a relationship. If she doesn't want to live the life of the spouse of an airline pilot, isn't it not only fair but approrpriate to say so NOW rather than later? IMHO, it takes a lot more guts to say "Hey, this is what I want in life, and if you're not on board, it's not going to work" than it does to say "Oh I love you no matter what!" Love may or may not be conditional, but partnerships most decidedly are.

So the choice is monkey suit or doctor spouse. My ballot is marked!
 
clipperstall said:
Did I miss anything from my list?
Click to expand...

You said "security", but that includes a lot. There are a great many medical issues that can end a flying career that won't be much more than a speed bump in the job you have. At your age, that doesn't seem important. About 15 to 20 years from now you're going to hit the age where that nagging worry about being able to make your next flight physical is going to be there. Believe me, I've known guys who have kept quiet about chest pains for years rather than seek medical attention. One other thing under the heading of security is retirement age. Assuming your health holds out, you're still going to hit a wall at age 65 as a pilot. With your current job, at least you'll have the option of continuing or retiring. Again, right now, at your age, that doesn't seem important. But, 40 years from now when you hit that point, the world will quite likely be a much different place than it is today. You may very much want to or need to stay in a good paying job rather than being forced to retire.

One suggestion I would offer. Talk with your parents. They have your best interest at heart and they know you better than any of us do. Don't lay the burden of the decision on them, but just ask them for their thoughts. Unlike your current girlfriend, they aren't going to abandon you no matter what you do.
 
Boris Badenov said:
I don't see what's unreasonable about an ultimatum in a relationship. If she doesn't want to live the life of the spouse of an airline pilot, isn't it not only fair but approrpriate to say so NOW rather than later? IMHO, it takes a lot more guts to say "Hey, this is what I want in life, and if you're not on board, it's not going to work" than it does to say "Oh I love you no matter what!" Love may or may not be conditional, but partnerships most decidedly are.

So the choice is monkey suit or doctor spouse. My ballot is marked!
Click to expand...

To clarify, I'm referring to an ultimatum as a seeming control measure. Definitely, being honest with the partner is a must. If she doesn't want to do something or live a certain way, thats certainly her choice. As he's not married to her, he has some decisions to make. Im with the thought of "if its meant to work, it will". If one never even gives their attainable dream(s) a shot, they'll only resent it later.
 
MikeD said:
If one never even gives their attainable dream(s) a shot, they'll only resent it later.
Click to expand...

You're going to have regrets whatever you do. It's part of being an adult human being. Another part of being an adult human being is being able to listen to the experiences of others and being able to quash irrational urges, however burning. I say again, no one has ever been made Happy (in the intransitive sense) by being a pilot. Anyone who is thinking of leaving a six figure, government-secure job to go fly for a regional airline is ipso facto totally insane, woman-issues aside.
 
Boris Badenov said:
You're going to have regrets whatever you do. It's part of being an adult human being. Another part of being an adult human being is being able to listen to the experiences of others and being able to quash irrational urges, however burning. I say again, no one has ever been made Happy (in the intransitive sense) by being a pilot. Anyone who is thinking of leaving a six figure, government-secure job to go fly for a regional airline is ipso facto totally insane, woman-issues aside.
Click to expand...

Thats what I mean. Its a choice he's going to have to make. I personally wouldn't bother with a regional job while counting on a sugar mama. :)

Now, nice corporate job?
 
Let's put it this way:

When I was younger, I really wanted to play in the NHL. I LOVE hockey... I play hockey, I watch hockey, I read about hockey, I work out for hockey, I play hockey video games. Even to this day, I go to an NHL game and think, "Wow, it'd be so cool to play on a big stage like this." However, in reality, I probably wouldn't want to deal with everything that comes with being a pro hockey player. Lots of travel, training, gym time, strict nutrition, practices, injuries, etc.. Right now, if I want to play hockey, I pay my $10 and go play. If I'm not feeling up to it, I stay home and play hockey online. If I was in the NHL, I wouldn't have that luxury. I'd need to be at practice on time, at the game on time, even if I didn't want to skate that day. Although, I would be getting paid lots of money to play hockey, which is definitely a plus!

The same could be said for flying. Some people are willing to make the sacrifices to get paid to fly. They don't have to shell out their own money to rent a plane. Plus, if you make it to the big time, you can make a very good living. However, you have to realize that there will be days you don't want to fly, but you can't say, "eh, I'll stay home today and play Ace Combat 6 instead." Also, just like the NHL, some will make it to the "show," while others may not. Often, it's not even dependent on skill, but rather timing and luck. There have been many, many pro hockey players who made their careers in the minors. Same can be said for pilots in the regionals. There are just too many pilots... and too many hockey players... trying to get into a position with limited spaces available.
 
Consider making a spreadsheet of the money you honestly expect to make by pursuing the regional airline job. Be realistic about upgrade times and furloughs. Then make a column next to that of the money you expect to make on your current pay scale, or any other career you might be considering. Compare the difference and think about what you would most want to spend that money on. Is it flying an RJ? Is it owning your own airplane? Perhaps it's taking ridiculously luxurious vacations with your future wife, or investing for an early retirement. Money spent on one thing cannot be spent on another.
 
ElationAviation said:
Someone here who isn't in a relationship would probably say go for the career switch.
Click to expand...

That's not necessarily true. Plenty of people have supportive spouses who would rather see someone achieve their goal than be stuck in a cubicle. My point with all this is that being in aviation might be a catalyst that accelerates the end of a relationship, but it won't be the reason it ends. Us guys in the military have seen this time and time again with deployments. The deployment didn't end the relationship, but it certainly sped up any issues that may have been there to begin with. The strong ones will survive, and come out better for it. The weak ones will end that much quicker. Do what makes you happy. For all you know, she may stick with you. She may not. It's good that she is being honest that she doesn't want the airline life for her, but why should you be forced to take a way of life that you don't want either? If you can compromise, great! good relationships compromise from both sides. But if she is unwilling to budge, this will lead to problems down the road, I guarantee it.
 
Many good points made!

Here is one from someone who flew for a living (Cargo) and now sits at a desk (for the past two years).

When I was flying cargo (age 23), I loved it, it was a great time but hours sucked. It was 13.4 hour duty day 5 days a week for most of the time I was at that company. The more you worked the more you were paid type of job.

Reasons for quitting I wanted more stability due to getting married (she did not at all make me choose, she knew what she was getting into and we went to college 6 hours apart and dated all through college), I had bought a house, and it was also in the middle of the recession when the job opportunities for a pilot were becoming less and less every day, from what it seemed. I had two class dates canceled from two other companies before I made it to that company. Losing my job was always in the back of my mind, as it is for many pilots during the recession and the age 65 rule. So an opportunity came along to sit behind a desk and work normal hours make an ok salary and be stable. I decided to take this
opportunity and see what it would be like.

I know how you feel behind a desk looking out the window, if you are lucky enough to have one near you. Every day you get up at the exact same time go through the motions: make the lunch, get dressed, get in the car (knowing exactly what time you will arrive at work after taking a look at the clock on the dash). Get out of the car, walk to the desk, sit behind the desk and push paper after paper to what seems a never ending pile etc....(sometimes changing the screen saver will make you happy for about 10 minutes until you have scanned the entire picture out of pure boredom).

Tip (if you drink tons of water you will need many bathroom breaks which makes for an excuse to get up)

I also fly on the side but with juggling work, home life, part time job, and flying with students doesn't amount to much flight time.

I know it is tough to swallow going from making money to no money. But when you have no kids, no debt, and a boring job that you hate there is no better time to give it a
try. I am not going to touch the relationship stuff but I will say my wife supports me and I support her in the decisions (it’s not always easy)
I am the same age in a similar situation and I know plenty of guys who are happy with their life as a pilot. So shrug off the complainers and get to work flying, if that is what you want to do. You have to make it work for you.
I will tell you this: I miss the punching out of the top of the clouds on a cold winter’s morning to see sun rise, which people on the ground haven’t seen in 4 days, as the ice is being blown from the boots.
I have watched many people quite flying and come to the place I work. They have their reasons, as I am sure they are good ones. I have seen both sides to this argument and I
choose flying as I am returning as soon as possible!
 
HangerBum said:
I miss the punching out of the top of the clouds on a cold winter’s morning to see sun rise, which people on the ground haven’t seen in 4 days, as the ice is being blown from the boots
Click to expand...

That's the juice. The juice, it turns out, is weak. I've scared myself six ways from Sunday in an airplane. I've dealt with plenty of Weather, and a few bitchy passengers, and a few broken airplanes. The only thing I'd like to do again is fly an MU-2 in terrible weather for a company that takes maintenance Seriously with-a-capital-S. Those jobs are gone, they're a memory. And there's nothing romantic about being gone 20 days a month and managing an autopilot, or (worse) an SIC with delusions of grandeur. There's also no real future in it. Wow, you've got six types and you're 60 and you're divorced and fat and you're looking for the line to get in to die. That's your future. Well, actually, that's my future. Be an adult and put childish things aside. Live your life with regrets (there will always be regrets) and be Man enough to Own them. Real, no kidding adults don't become pilots anymore. If you want verification of that Fact, jetcareers.com has more than enough information to set you straight. Grow up, because if you don't, you'll wind up like the rest of us.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top