Murdoughnut
Well sized member
Ahh ... now I get what you were talking about in your other thread Airdale - you were right 
Moved out of Calpcapts JS thread
- Thread starter Velocipede
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Velocipede
New Member
Re: How jumpseating is supposed to work
Actually, if you read that thread, I just pointed out that XJT had 44 airplanes they needed to find work for. And those who can't read good got wrapped around the axle.
Actually, if you read that thread, I just pointed out that XJT had 44 airplanes they needed to find work for. And those who can't read good got wrapped around the axle.
Velocipede
New Member
Re: How jumpseating is supposed to work
This commentary reflects an excruciatingly poor understanding of how Railway Labor Act contracts work.
Do some research before you launch your simplistic "answers" on us, please.
This commentary reflects an excruciatingly poor understanding of how Railway Labor Act contracts work.
Do some research before you launch your simplistic "answers" on us, please.
Van_Hoolio
Well-Known Member
Oh. I'm still waiting for you to name one EAS route served by a RJ though.
Velocipede
New Member
Re: How jumpseating is supposed to work
Regionals who lowball pay and benefits pull down the wages and benefits for other regional pilots. You can't compare apples to oranges.
A320 operators who lowball narrowbody Major airline pay lower the bar for Narrowbody airframe operators. They have no effect on regional pay.
Now, if you want to address jetBlue paying $72 an hour for Ejets while Horizon pays $120 an hour for 70 seat RJs, then you can make the argument that jetBlue is undercutting Regional pay as well.
You take them on your jumpseat. I won't.
Regionals who lowball pay and benefits pull down the wages and benefits for other regional pilots. You can't compare apples to oranges.
A320 operators who lowball narrowbody Major airline pay lower the bar for Narrowbody airframe operators. They have no effect on regional pay.
Now, if you want to address jetBlue paying $72 an hour for Ejets while Horizon pays $120 an hour for 70 seat RJs, then you can make the argument that jetBlue is undercutting Regional pay as well.
You take them on your jumpseat. I won't.
pilot602
If specified, this will replace the title that
Re: How jumpseating is supposed to work
Still don't see any self help going on here on your part - but lots of "simple" blame going around all directed at the wrong people.
JetBlue didn't massacre thse contracts - management and, in some part, their own pilot groups did.
Still don't see any self help going on here on your part - but lots of "simple" blame going around all directed at the wrong people.
JetBlue didn't massacre thse contracts - management and, in some part, their own pilot groups did.
autiger10
New Member
After reading this thread, I'm starting to have second thoughts on footing $50,000 training debt to have the opportunity to eventually work with a guy that is all around pissed off and has issues with everything about life. If I wanted that, I could have just stayed in the Army and gone back to Iraq yet again - talking about some ill people, spend a little time over there.
Airdale
Well-Known Member
Ah...don't let one guy ruin your attitude. Misery loves company and they usually try to recruit new members. 95% of the folks you fly with are pleasant. But then again it depends on which company you work for. Low morale = cranky pilots. Good morale= happy pilots.
Velocipede
New Member
Re: How jumpseating is supposed to work
Again, no clue about the conditions and landmarks that must be met before pilots can engage in self-help is manifestly obvious on your part.
Of course they didn't. They established the pay/benefits level that legacy managements matched. And they were proud to do it. You should have heard them trumpeting how great their airline is/was on other boards during their first two years.
For that reason, and others, they have no business asking Legacy pilots for favors.
Again, no clue about the conditions and landmarks that must be met before pilots can engage in self-help is manifestly obvious on your part.
Of course they didn't. They established the pay/benefits level that legacy managements matched. And they were proud to do it. You should have heard them trumpeting how great their airline is/was on other boards during their first two years.
For that reason, and others, they have no business asking Legacy pilots for favors.
Velocipede
New Member
But then again it depends on which company you work for. Low moral = cranky pilots. Good moral = happy pilots.
What does morality have to do with anything? Unless of course you meant morale. Looks like I'm trying to reason with another product of American public school education...
mtsu_av8er
Well-Known Member
Wow.
That's exactly what I said when I got back from taking my little tyke to the ENT doc this morning and found this thread.
Sad.
BEvaristo
Well-Known Member
I'm just a lowly PPL and probably have no business chiming in with this thread, but I'm a little naive about the whole thing and how it works.
I understand that the Captain has discretion about who he/she allows in the JS. If Airline A has a JS Agreement with Airline X, Y and Z, and pilot from Airline Y wants a ride on Airline A but said Airline A Captain has a personal agenda he's carrying out, doesn't that violate the JS Agreement between said Airlines? In retaliation, a Captain from Airline Y that has heard about this denies previously agreed upon privileges to pilot from Airline A. Then won't this whole thing turn into a battle between the airlines to the point that JS Agreements are rescinded?
I understand that the Captain has discretion about who he/she allows in the JS. If Airline A has a JS Agreement with Airline X, Y and Z, and pilot from Airline Y wants a ride on Airline A but said Airline A Captain has a personal agenda he's carrying out, doesn't that violate the JS Agreement between said Airlines? In retaliation, a Captain from Airline Y that has heard about this denies previously agreed upon privileges to pilot from Airline A. Then won't this whole thing turn into a battle between the airlines to the point that JS Agreements are rescinded?
Sprint100
Well-Known Member
MTSU, that there is an example of what people do when they don't have anything to say pertaining to the subject at hand:laff:
tprops4me
Well-Known Member
Re: How jumpseating is supposed to work
Let me see if I am comprehending this. Regional guys are welcome, because they do not undercut you, but Gojets made your list? Virgin America has yet to get off the ground, but already they have ruined the industry. Skybus has not been flying for but a month, and already they have brought you down. Therefore JetBlue has single handedly brought destroyed the airlines that once were. That is one powerful airline there. Scabs will be scabs. Nothing we can do about that except educate. If this site has taught me one thing, it is to never scab.
Let me see if I am comprehending this. Regional guys are welcome, because they do not undercut you, but Gojets made your list? Virgin America has yet to get off the ground, but already they have ruined the industry. Skybus has not been flying for but a month, and already they have brought you down. Therefore JetBlue has single handedly brought destroyed the airlines that once were. That is one powerful airline there. Scabs will be scabs. Nothing we can do about that except educate. If this site has taught me one thing, it is to never scab.
Airdale
Well-Known Member
You know I'll edit this myself out of respect for Doug and Kristie, as I consider this an extension of their living room.
I didn't realize we were being "graded" on our spelling.
My apologies.
You know what guys, I'm seeing too much name calling going on here. I've got a flight in a few minutes, otherwise I'd go back through this mess and maybe hand out a few warnings, but since I don't have time here is a general note to all:
Keep it professional!
That is all.
Keep it professional!
That is all.
Baronman
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure where you see that a Horizon guy gets 120/hr on a 70seater and a jetBlue guy gets 70/hr on their EJET.
Just eyeballing the pay rate, the jetBlue 5th year captain gets $87/hr to 70 hours then time and a half over 70 hrs so a typical 90hr line probably makes about 92/hr.
5th Year Horizon shows $80/hr....
I'm not saying either is phenomenal but I don't know where you got your numbers from, or is it your dislike for jetBlue that skews it all?
Either way...I enjoyed CalCaptains story and I can totally relate, I had a similar story the last week where there was one seat left and we gave it to the junior guy who had to be there the earliest. The other guy and myself agreed to take the later flight (we weren't in much of a rush).
Just eyeballing the pay rate, the jetBlue 5th year captain gets $87/hr to 70 hours then time and a half over 70 hrs so a typical 90hr line probably makes about 92/hr.
5th Year Horizon shows $80/hr....
I'm not saying either is phenomenal but I don't know where you got your numbers from, or is it your dislike for jetBlue that skews it all?
Either way...I enjoyed CalCaptains story and I can totally relate, I had a similar story the last week where there was one seat left and we gave it to the junior guy who had to be there the earliest. The other guy and myself agreed to take the later flight (we weren't in much of a rush).
OldTownPilot
Well-Known Member
ALPA (the ones that lobbied HARD for jumpseating) States that a JS rider should not be denied unless safety of flight is compromised. I.e. not to be used as a personal pissing tool. JS wars NEVER have a winner. Scabs are understandable, BUT it is childish to deny a fellow pilot that your airline has a reciprocal agreement with.
Its obvious that velocipede does not commute.
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