Is my training and time building plan unrealistic?

[arhenders]

Hey Everyone,

First time poster, long-time reader. I'm looking for advice on a plan I've worked up for a career change. Ultimately, my goal is to fly passengers or cargo, however, I was devastated by the new 1500 hr ATP rule. I can understand raising the bar from 250 hrs, but 6x the previous?

Regardless, below is a plan I've worked up to quickly acquire hours. Let me know your criticism and if I'm way off from reality. (Example, far too much time weighted on one airframe, etc). Currently, I have 5 hours under instruction for PPL. Haha

150, VFR, IFR, ME, Commercial Training (under instruction)
100-300, CFI
100, ME PIC XC IFR
1000 hr, purchase Cessna 152 or Piper Cherokee for time building, mostly IFR XC.(I understand the financial implications of aircraft ownership)

From what I've researched, this plan is the best balance of training, quick time building and limiting financial impact.

Thanks

 

[Itchy]

If you have the ability to buy an aircraft from the start, sounds good. However, there are many pitfalls to aircraft ownership, and of course, many different types. Your plan hinges GREATLY on finding the right help in acquiring the aircraft, finding an excellent instructor that is willing to work with you in your airplane, an excellent maintenance facility, etc.

Keep in mind resourceful, flexible (i.e., ability to move), cheerful and outgoing types have been known to get the right seat in a citation or something with very low times, perhaps negating the need to buy your own time. This will take longer, but the resume will look nicer too. Many, many ways to form the plan!

From what I can tell, unless you are in a big metro area, finding a dedicated instructor who has the time to instruct in your airplane may be the tricky part. If absolute speed is your goal, and you have deep pockets, the plan as you put it is pretty valid. Go to a pilot factory, knock out the ratings, get an airplane and enjoy the country. You would have to be fairly well heeled to knock that out. But it would be an adventure.

 

[arhenders]

I would much prefer to time build on someone else's dime. So I guess the 1500 hr rule only applies to airlines?

I'm a conservative fellow so I tend to write luck out of the equation. I am resourceful and flexible. Cheerful and outgoing can only be determined by an outsider.

Buying an aircraft is a big step, I've been reading all sorts of scenarios on the subject. My actuarial analysis indicates if I'm attempting to log 1000 hrs, it will pay off, per hr, with a buffer.

 

[drunkenbeagle]

I would much prefer to time build on someone else's dime. So I guess the 1500 hr rule only applies to airlines?

Correct. Does not apply to any other commercial flying.

Buying an aircraft is a big step, I've been reading all sorts of scenarios on the subject. My actuarial analysis indicates if I'm attempting to log 1000 hrs, it will pay off, per hr, with a buffer.

Having someone else pay you will always work out better. After flying a fair sample of flying both personally owned and operated-by-business aircraft, I would highly recommend AT LEAST getting a PPL & Instrument rating before even considering buying an airplane. It is great owning an airplane, but it is also a big responsibility keeping it airworthy, and even being able to tell if it is airworthy. Which is all the more difficult when you don't know much about flying them (yet).

 

[jgheggie]

Having someone else pay you will always work out better. After flying a fair sample of flying both personally owned and operated-by-business aircraft, I would highly recommend AT LEAST getting a PPL & Instrument rating before even considering buying an airplane. It is great owning an airplane, but it is also a big responsibility keeping it airworthy, and even being able to tell if it is airworthy. Which is all the more difficult when you don't know much about flying them (yet).

I agree

I would at least get a ppl and make for certain this is what you want to do prior to spending the money on an aircraft. The business of aircraft "flipping" isn't that good one. So you don't want to buy one just to find out you don't like it and then go through the trouble of selling it without a loss.

And as almost everyone will say...get your CFI. Then you can get paid to instruct and build hours and enjoy the ride to 1500hrs.

I can speak from experience...it's tough to get an entry level job with only 250 hrs and a commercial cert with no CFI. I'm still looking! Ha.

 

[arhenders]

I would at least get a ppl and make for certain this is what you want to do prior to spending the money on an aircraft. The business of aircraft "flipping" isn't that good one. So you don't want to buy one just to find out you don't like it and then go through the trouble of selling it without a loss.

And as almost everyone will say...get your CFI. Then you can get paid to instruct and build hours and enjoy the ride to 1500hrs.

I can speak from experience...it's tough to get an entry level job with only 250 hrs and a commercial cert with no CFI. I'm still looking! Ha.

I would def do the PPL on a rental craft. I'm glad to hear there are options when it comes making money earlier in the process. I want to do some CFI work as its great for the resume and free hours, however, I'm not too keen on that being a full-time gig. Thanks, everyone for the advice.

. Getting paid is definitely a top priority.

 

[jgheggie]

I would def do the PPL on a rental craft. I'm glad to hear there are options when it comes making money earlier in the process. I want to do some CFI work as its great for the resume and free hours, however, I'm not too keen on that being a full-time gig. Thanks, everyone for the advice.

. Getting paid is definitely a top priority.

Cfi jobs don't just give you free hours and a good résumé. They can also help you progress in your career. Often times, a pilots first job after being a cfi is with someone he met during instructing. You make a LOT of contacts and friends. Heck, the cfi that does you standardization when you first get hired might become a pilot for an airline. Then when you meet the minimums he can write a letter of recommendation and boom...your golden!

Just keep an open mind going into aviation. Plans are good...but often times they change rapidly. The industry can (and has) literally change over night.

 

[drunkenbeagle]

I want to do some CFI work as its great for the resume and free hours, however, I'm not too keen on that being a full-time gig.

Most instructors are part-time. Full timers tend to be either retired from something else, or waiting for an air line to call....

 

[philiplane]

Most instructors are part-time. Full timers tend to be either retired from something else, or waiting for an air line to call....

There are full time instructors who have waiting lists and make over $100k. Of course, they are professionals serving their clients, not time builders hoping to make the jump to their first starvation wage job at a regional airline. The main difference between the two types is attitude. A good instructor can do very well, make his own schedule, and never be worried about his seniority number, mergers, bankruptcies, etc. My guess is that type of instructor is only one in a thousand, or less.

 

[Delta Fox]

Feel free to PM me. I'm at 600 hrs. and have done most of my time in an aircraft I purchased with my friend/instructor/airline pilot. Including my private. I can give you ideas of costs and issues to expect. good luck

 

[Delta Fox]

Here's what to expect if you purchase/operate an older 1960s-70s C-172 for training.

Avg. Operation Costs per hour (150 hrs/yr)

Overhaul $10,000 1800hrs = $5.56
Pitot-Static $400 300hrs = $1.33
Annual $700 150 hrs = $4.67
Parts $1300 150 hrs = $8.67
Oil $8.00 2 hrs = $4.00
Cleaners $150 150 hrs = $1.00
Payment $2264 150 hrs = $15.09
insurance $575 150 hrs = $3.83

Total $44.15/hr x 150 hrs per yr = $6622
Fuel ($5.50 @ 8 gal/hr) $44.00 x 150 = $6600

Total cost per year $13222.50

(expect insurance to be at least twice as much until you hit 250 hrs)




And yes, your fixed costs will go down if you fly it more. But don't expect it to get much cheaper. The more you fly it, the more parts will require maintenance. And, when you have to pay $1,000 for an STC'd part (which is required if you aren't flying an experimental) it will eat up your fuel and training budget, and you'll end up flying less.

Also, add in costs for instructor (avg $45/hr) and materials (charts, ipad, books), as well as written tests ($150-$250 for each test) and checkrides ($250-$500 per ride).

The upside of owning your own aircraft is that you will know everything about the systems and legal requirements of that aircraft. Especially if you do most of the work yourself or with mechanics (which the above budget assumes). You also get to take it on trips where you want, when you want, giving you the opportunity to get a full general aviation experience, and the time you get will be legit, outside of the training environment. I started actually logging hundreds of hours of AMT time I was around mechanics so much.

The downside is your training gets interrupted when unexpected issues come up with the aircraft. Often times, instead of studying for a checkride you are wrenching on an airplane. And, not being at a school, you aren't on a school loan, so when you get a big maintenance bill, you have to go back to your day job and save up to get back on track. Good freelance instructors can also be difficult to find, especially with the airlines hiring again. And you won't know how good your instructor is until you try another one (highly reccomended).

Good luck, and keep the dirty side down.

DF