Iran AF F-4/F-5/F-14

[MikeD]

But where there are people killing each other, there are people killing each other for money. Bank on it.

In the wars I fought in, I was working for whichever D.C. lobby of whichever Military Industrial Complex corporation drove us into the war, by whichever politicians they had in their pockets in congress through donations. I just didn't know it at the time.

 

[Boris Badenov]

I just didn't know it at the time.

In fairness to you and your co-belligerents, that makes rather a huge difference. In my reckoning, anyway.

I mean, not that there's necessarily anything wrong with Mercwork! At least some of it. Spanish Civil War? Biafran conflict? Rhodesian Brush War? Scoundrels after my own heart. As I alluded to above, the idea of delivering crates of AKs of questionable workmanship to a bunch of dudes with a pair of pants, a rightful grudge against certain types of Power, and a Dream makes me feel all warm and toasty.

Need someone to transport explodey things to fling at high velocity towards Mugabe and his thugs, for example? I'm your man!

 

[Pilot Fighter]

"My father's in the army. He wants me to join, but I can't work for that corporation, so what I've been doing lately is kick-boxing, which is a new sport...as far as career longevity, I don't really know. I cant figure it all out tonight, sir, so I'm just gonna hang with your daughter."

 

[Boris Badenov]

"My father's in the army. He wants me to join, but I can't work for that corporation, so what I've been doing lately is kick-boxing, which is a new sport...as far as career longevity, I don't really know. I cant figure it all out tonight, sir, so I'm just gonna hang with your daughter."

In that spirit, and bringing all back to Unions (everyone's favorite subject): NO SCABS.

 

[MikeD]

As I alluded to above, the idea of delivering crates of AKs of questionable workmanship to a bunch of dudes with a pair of pants, a rightful grudge against certain types of Power, and a Dream makes me feel all warm and toasty.

Delivering what's otherwise known as "hard rice".

 

[Boris Badenov]

Delivering what's otherwise known as "hard rice".

Hell on the teeth, I'm told.

 

[Hacker15e]

The Iranians scored 100+ kills in the F-14 Tomcat,

Just for the sake of objectivity, note that this number is author Tom Cooper's claim, which has not been peer reviewed (to put it mildly). There are serious questions about the validity of this number and the research Cooper conducted to arrive at it.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

Their F-4 parts and support came from the Israelis and Turks, brokered by us, and brought to you by the Iran Contra affair. All the Iranians had to do was pay the cash directly to the Contra's group in Nicaragua, since the US Congress forbade the Reagan Administration from doing so.

...there's this place in Chino...

 

[Cessnaflyer]

Very cool to see. It's like watching an Iranian version of Top Gun.

@MikeD Do you know if they ever changed tactics from what they learned from US training?

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

Pretty cool video. Some interesting things, besides just the aircraft:

1. IRIAF is like a 1980s USAF, tactics-wise, aircrew equipment-wise, the older HGU-33 helmets, the colorful helmet decorations, etc. Effective, but you can easily see both the dated but heavy USAF influence. If one didn't know any better, these guys carry themselves in nearly every way like USAF pilots/WSOs, since that heritage is still how they are trained and is still passed down......because it works. They do nearly everything the USAF did in that era and with those aircraft, including day/night aerial refueling from both their KC-707s as well as their one-of-a-kind KC-747s.

2. The old-school ordnance. The reworked AIM-54 Phoenix on the Tomcats, the Electro-Optical A/B model AGM-65 Mavericks on the F-4s as well as the AIM-9J/P models. Mk-82 bombs with Snakeye high drag kits (no longer used by USAF, ballute kits used instead). And very interesting are the modifications, such as the 4-abreast Mk-82s carried on the two forward AIM-54 Phoenix fuselage racks by an F-14 taxiing out. The aft-facing video of the F-4s doing a laydown of Mk-82SEs in ripple/single and ripple/pairs on targets, is still pretty cool......

3. The F-4Es with the US-style sharkmouth's on them.

@MikeD Got a few questions for you. The Maverick is an air to ground weapon? Isn't that something you would carry on an A10? How would that work with the F4? I imagine the F4 would be a better interceptor?

Also it looked like there were some targets engaged. A train with about a dozen or more cars was visible, along with a row of houses, the drag bombs were going out but the video did not show any of the aftermath. That didn't seem like your average target practice B reel. Whats up with that?

 

[Boyington]

Very cool to see. It's like watching an Iranian version of Top Gun.

@MikeD Do you know if they ever changed tactics from what they learned from US training?

I really expected to see a shirtless volleyball game about halfway in.

 

[SeanD]

This is the only plane the Iranians need.

 

[Hacker15e]

 

[MikeD]

@MikeD Got a few questions for you. The Maverick is an air to ground weapon? Isn't that something you would carry on an A10? How would that work with the F4? I imagine the F4 would be a better interceptor?

Also it looked like there were some targets engaged. A train with about a dozen or more cars was visible, along with a row of houses, the drag bombs were going out but the video did not show any of the aftermath. That didn't seem like your average target practice B reel. Whats up with that?

The Maverick was carried and still is, by a number of aircraft. F-4s are a fighter-bomber and can configure for both missions. Google AGM-65 and F-4, and you'll see tons of pictures of USAF F-4s carring AGM-65s.

The film clips were somewhat short and may not have shown the full effects; good combat footage however.

 

[MikeD]

Very cool to see. It's like watching an Iranian version of Top Gun.

@MikeD Do you know if they ever changed tactics from what they learned from US training?

Their tactics have been pretty standard-80s USAF; effective, just dated. Very likely they've come up woth some of their own too, but their baseline is us, and how they were trained originally. Iranian pilots used to go to USAF UPT at a number of bases here in the USA.

 

[Boris Badenov]

This is the only plane the Iranians need.

You forgot the best part:

 

[Pilot Fighter]

You forgot the best part:

Is that a dodecaphonic stereo?

 

[bunk22]

Just for the sake of objectivity, note that this number is author Tom Cooper's claim, which has not been peer reviewed (to put it mildly). There are serious questions about the validity of this number and the research Cooper conducted to arrive at it.

...and yet, no one has, done the research except Tom Cooper. I hear a lot of claims to the contrary without an ounce of research to back it up their claims. Until someone does, he is the source. His Iran-Iraq Air War book has his sources listed, hundreds of them. So until someone actually does the research, claiming his work isn't valid holds no validity. I've seen numbers quoted from as little as 30 kills to 156, it's all over the place. He has a detailed list, often with pilot names, backed by sources. His book is decent as far as that goes. Hard to read otherwise.

 

[SeanD]

Is that a dodecaphonic stereo?

No its a Blaupunct

 

[Hacker15e]

So until someone actually does the research, claiming his work isn't valid holds no validity.

The absence of contrary data is not the same as validation of a claim. No serious historian would ever form a hypothesis based purely on anecdotal data from personal interviews, and then publish it as fact with no supporting data. It is perfectly valid to question Cooper's numbers given that there is precisely zero independently verifiable evidence of the data he used to arrive at it.

I don't know Cooper personally, but a very good friend of mine is a well respected, widely published aviation journalist and author over in the UK. He, and some of his other well-known and respected author colleagues I've spoken with, have questions about other (verifiable) things Cooper has written, thus that doubt extends into his work on the Iranian combat claims.