Gulfstream Academy--What am I missing
- Thread starter LoadMasterC141
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FLflyer said:
Forgive my inaccurate summary, FLflyer. I've posted portions of their website below. I'm kinda curious what corporate, regional, or major you fly with presently. Do you even fly? From their site:
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Hours[/FONT][FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Areas of Training[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]80[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Ground School Airline Indoctrination And Operations[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]40[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]CRM (Crew Resource Management) and Airline Briefing[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]80[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Ground School Beech 1900D Systems Integration[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]32[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Frasca 242 Beech 1900D Turboprop Simulator Training[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]4[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Beech 1900D Aircraft Static Session And EFIS Training[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]28[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Full Flight Simulator Level-D Beech 1900D Flight Training[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]8[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Airline Line Observation Jump Seat Flights Beech 1900D[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]250[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Flying Line As Part-121 Paid First Officer At GIA In Beech 1900D[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]522[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]Total Hours Of Training Including 318 Hours OF Turboprop Flight Training[/FONT]
As DE727UPS and Kristie more professionally and much more insightfully (than you) explained, the 250 hours received by a student should be hours built by the efforts of an organization other than a Part 121 service such as GIA. Kinda wonder when - five years down the road - when a GIA grad is flying for someone else like Southwest, Continental, etc. will, in retrospect, the individual believe is was a worthwhile "experience." I am focusing primarily on flight experience.
One downside? Yes, the GIA pilot is approximately $27k more in debt than his peers with the same opportunities perhaps as a CFI who built the same amount of time with student pilots. Would be an interesting analysis to see how those GIA graduates have performed in relation to others.
DE727UPS said:
Oh yes. . .definitely see a lot of negative implication in the form of renting out a job. I understand completely. I don't appreciate the practice. Where I'll take a opposite position is I can't fault a potential pilot doing whatever it takes to be competitive with peers to transition to the "big league." I'm certain you'll hear many say the pilot is doing the same dishonorable thing by buying that time. My point is, if money is not the issue, which it isn't for a select few in the world today, and the position is open, I'd take it and move on as well. After Gulfstream, I STILL have to compete against others for a better aviation position.
Personnally, I'll knock Gulfstream; I'll not chastise the pilot who invest the money trying to do better for themselves.
. . .kinda synonymous with prostitution, right?
desertdog71
Girthy Member
Give me $29,000 and I will pay you $15.00 an hour to act as my FO in a Twin. I'll give you 200 hours as my FO, then you can go apply to the regionals.
Sounds like a spectacular deal to me. Let me know when you are ready to get started.
Sounds like a spectacular deal to me. Let me know when you are ready to get started.
desertdog71
Girthy Member
MFT1Air said:. . .and what will you name YOUR Part 121 organization? At $145 an hour for Gulfstream as an SIC, if I'm receiving PIC time in YOUR twin on the left side, I'll fly with you anytime.
I'll put the hood on, there you go you are now acting PIC.
When can I expect your check?
desertdog71 said:I'll put the hood on, there you go you are now acting PIC.
When can I expect your check?
Today's Saturday. Wait for my lottery ticket to hit, but don't hold your breath.
. But, for $29K, I can go into 1/10th ownership on someone's twin, and fly virtually whenever I want. That's all I have time for presently.. . .but fractional ownership is another thread.
Greetings Guys,
I have been looking at these Gulfstream Training Academy forums for a couple of weeks now and people keep saying that you are paying for your flight time. This is not true, I looked at one of their contracts and it states that you don't pay for your 250 hrs of SIC time. The contract lists the cost of training, not actual flight time. I believe the only time you pay for loggable flight time is when you train in the level-D sim and the 121 checkride. Just thought I would chip in..thanx.
I have been looking at these Gulfstream Training Academy forums for a couple of weeks now and people keep saying that you are paying for your flight time. This is not true, I looked at one of their contracts and it states that you don't pay for your 250 hrs of SIC time. The contract lists the cost of training, not actual flight time. I believe the only time you pay for loggable flight time is when you train in the level-D sim and the 121 checkride. Just thought I would chip in..thanx.
DE727UPS
Well-Known Member
The point is you're paying to rent the seat for 250 hours, one way or another. 121 airlines shouldn't be renting out window seats to timebuilders. That's just wrong.
It's funny how I see things, though, being old school. To me, the concept that Gulfstream came up with to profit from pilots is deplorable. It's just not right. It's funny how, as time goes on and the industry changes, this sort of thing slowly becomes more accepted as no big deal.
It's funny how I see things, though, being old school. To me, the concept that Gulfstream came up with to profit from pilots is deplorable. It's just not right. It's funny how, as time goes on and the industry changes, this sort of thing slowly becomes more accepted as no big deal.
meritflyer
Well-Known Member
I think GIA is sweet!!
meritflyer
Well-Known Member
... just kidding!!
DE727UPS
Well-Known Member
777, you're totally missing the point. People that do the Gulfstream program are hurting the profession. It's an employement practice that's bad for the career. Yeah, the Gulfstream program will get you on at Pinnacle without having to instruct but that doesn't make it okay to prostitute yourself. By the way, instructing will make you into a better pilot than sitting right seat in a 1900 for 250 hours. It's just not me saying this, either. If you've done the research here you'll see that.
If you came here looking to change peoples minds about Gulfstream, it's not gonna happen. If you came here to rationalize yourself into thinking it's okay because we are all full of crap, well, that's certainly up to you. If you came here to research why Gulfstream is so unpopular in the professional pilot community, now you see why.
If you came here looking to change peoples minds about Gulfstream, it's not gonna happen. If you came here to rationalize yourself into thinking it's okay because we are all full of crap, well, that's certainly up to you. If you came here to research why Gulfstream is so unpopular in the professional pilot community, now you see why.
Doug, this is an inside joke yes, but when was the last time you saw your high school English teacher? In the "oh, by the way" category, my 10th grade English teacher flunked me in 10th grade and passed me with a "D" average in 11th grade English and helped severely depress my high school GPA with the grades she gave to me in high school English. I should have scored higher. One afternoon, I challenged her about a grade I received in a composition. She looked me straight in my face and told me to admit to myself I was of limited potential. The second comment about "the best I could become in life would be a janitor of our high school made me hate her for the rest of my life. . .{yes, I strongly considered taking her life that eventful day.}
She left teaching my 12th grade year. She was only 24/25 at the time, but those words have stayed with the both of us throughout our lives.
Each significant event in my life - high school graduation, acceptance into West Point, graduation from college, promotion after promotion in the military, significant awards, to include my Bronze Star, my military retirement, along with my pilot's certificate and a voice recording of the astronauts from the Internation Space Station thanking me for excellent training during their mission. . .I send a copy to her simply to say "thanks for the negativity; I'm happy to have proved you wrong." {Yes, thank goodness for Yahoo "people search" and her unique last name.}
The article I "quoted" above? You should send that to your English teacher, for it was well written. Don't forget to put your airline letterhead on it. . .
PS - Doug and I both love our high school English teachers.
caliginousface
Frank N. Beans
Doug, this is an inside joke yes, but when was the last time you saw your high school English teacher? In the "oh, by the way" category, my 10th grade English teacher flunked me in 10th grade and passed me with a "D" average in 11th grade English and helped severely depress my high school GPA with the grades she gave to me in high school English. I should have scored higher. One afternoon, I challenged her about a grade I received in a composition. She looked me straight in my face and told me to admit to myself I was of limited potential. The second comment about "the best I could become in life would be a janitor of our high school made me hate her for the rest of my life. . .{yes, I strongly considered taking her life that eventful day.}
She left teaching my 12th grade year. She was only 24/25 at the time, but those words have stayed with the both of us throughout our lives.
Each significant event in my life - high school graduation, acceptance into West Point, graduation from college, promotion after promotion in the military, significant awards, to include my Bronze Star, my military retirement, along with my pilot's certificate and a voice recording of the astronauts from the Internation Space Station thanking me for excellent training during their mission. . .I send a copy to her simply to say "thanks for the negativity; I'm happy to have proved you wrong." {Yes, thank goodness for Yahoo "people search" and her unique last name.}
The article I "quoted" above? You should send that to your English teacher, for it was well written. Don't forget to put your airline letterhead on it. . .
PS - Doug and I both love our high school English teachers.
Did the teacher reply back?!
Good story and congrats!
LoadMasterC141
Well-Known Member
In 10th grade, I flunked English with a 100, yes I said 100, average.
Having gone to British schools until the age of 12, I had excelled in English in the U.S. . Now 10th grade was Shakespeare. I aced the tests and got a perfect grade on every essay written.
What I could not handle was coming to class to listen to the severe slaughtering of the great playwright by someone reading aloud at a third grade level. I mean that is all we did: Read Shakespeare aloud in class, and the teacher always picked the kid that could not read.
So anyway, I was flunked and forced to go to summer school because of attendance. To this day I would spit on this arse of a teacher if I ever saw him.
Having gone to British schools until the age of 12, I had excelled in English in the U.S. . Now 10th grade was Shakespeare. I aced the tests and got a perfect grade on every essay written.
What I could not handle was coming to class to listen to the severe slaughtering of the great playwright by someone reading aloud at a third grade level. I mean that is all we did: Read Shakespeare aloud in class, and the teacher always picked the kid that could not read.
So anyway, I was flunked and forced to go to summer school because of attendance. To this day I would spit on this arse of a teacher if I ever saw him.
I did have a fondness for "Othello." I did not however have a fondness for the overall "romanticism" of many of the readings.
727 please define to me " paying your dues" because I have "paid my dues already." Why didn't you post my response over the forum ? I spent a lot of time on it. I would've like to have seen others react to it. Or maybe it would be inappropriate for others to see the point I was trying to make. Please tell me how in past times the industry has suffered due to pilots taking this route-or maybe its due to the rising oil prices, management getting pay raises, or them trying to cut costs by cutting pensions/furloughing, or is it inflation ?
Based on your years of experience and time in the industry, this should be an easy task for you sir. I would like to know which carriers are not hiring guys with SIC time from Gulfstream or any other PFT outfit....be it regional or major. I took a giant risk by switching to this line of work, I know.
Based on your years of experience and time in the industry, this should be an easy task for you sir. I would like to know which carriers are not hiring guys with SIC time from Gulfstream or any other PFT outfit....be it regional or major. I took a giant risk by switching to this line of work, I know.
777-
Welcome to Jetcareers.
Do not pester my users on this topic.
There is a wealth of information available in "Hot Topics" about this subject and you need to take the opportunity to read it.
I'm dying to use another 'yellow card' - don't be that guy.
Welcome to Jetcareers.
Do not pester my users on this topic.
There is a wealth of information available in "Hot Topics" about this subject and you need to take the opportunity to read it.
I'm dying to use another 'yellow card' - don't be that guy.
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