good idea to fly with 777 captain?

What is this profession coming to when a guy with 250 total hours and a 17K course is more marketable to an airline than someone who busted their butts to get a college education, busted their butts getting some CFI ratings, then busted their butts some more flying around in a cessna. I admit the CFIing wasnt for me. But once I started doing it, it wasn't so bad. And I am learning more and more each day. Like people have said earlier, no offense but I think people come on these forums to hear only what they wanna hear and everything else goes into one ear and out the other. And people wonder why pilots get paid like crap.
 
I agree to NOT do an RJ program, and I hate to read about yet another flight program promising the world, and look at those rates! Also, if the person doesn't want to be a CFI, I would rather them NOT be a CFI. Yes, they would learn more about flying from teaching, but that last thing we need is yet another CFI that doesn't want to be one. I have already flown with a few of those, and the industry doesn't need them either!
 
Sometimes you guys act like the “right” way is clear. Well dammit its’ not. What do you expect this guy to do now? Run away from the money he has spent, rebuking the devil RJ course for all to see? Perhaps not the best path, it is A path to the airlines and I am sure it is not a gravy train educational experience for him.

Not long ago I was standing in a posh Bellagio suite, attending a networking event sponsored by this website, talking to an airline recruiter. I had no intentions of getting any offers, being a low-timer, but wanted to ask a few questions; where to instruct, how much multi, etc….

After explaining my plans, how long I figured I would need to instruct for, this recruiter told me to get my Commercial ME and they would hook me up with a 10-week FSA program. The recruiters told this to just about everyone there that did not have the minimums. They even took some helicopter guy, with lots of experience, and actually sent him to the 5-week version(Jack).

I sent an email to the recruiter shortly after coming home from Vegas, as directed, and never got a reply, so I really do not know how much of the program they were actually going to pay for.

This is the program.
http://www.flightsafetyacademy.com/career/support/Advanced_Airline_Track.pdf
The costs have not been updated, but I believe it is the same thing the poor guy who started this thread is speaking of.

In comparison to other RJ courses, like one at ATP, this is NOT just an RJ course to me. At least look through it before commenting please. 10 weeks versus 7 days seems quite different. There is also 3 weeks of refresher training and evaluation beforehand I believe.

I do understand the benefit of instructing. I was an instructor for my crew position in the AF. It helps solidify knowledge levels by teaching others. However, people these days are teaching for 2-3 months. I will have over 300 hours by the time I get all my ratings. It should not take me long to achieve decent enough time to be able to solicit a meeting with the airlines I would like to work for. In that time, I will be teaching people how to fly Cessna’s and Light Twins. At this point, I wonder if 44 hours in a full motion ERJ sim would not help more than a few months instructing. I really don’t know though.
 
LoadMasterC141 said:
After explaining my plans, how long I figured I would need to instruct for, this recruiter told me to get my Commercial ME and they would hook me up with a 10-week FSA program. The recruiters told this to just about everyone there that did not have the minimums. They even took some helicopter guy, with lots of experience, and actually sent him to the 5-week version(Jack).
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I think the big difference with Jack was (and please correct me if I'm wrong), but the company was footing the bill for that training.
 
LoadMasterC141 said:
At this point, I wonder if 44 hours in a full motion ERJ sim would not help more than a few months instructing. I really don’t know though.
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I will tell you that when you get out of the student seat and into the CFI seat your view changes in a second. All of a sudden you don't have the flight instructor there as a security blanket, and the person next to you may make a mistake that could kill you. There is a lot to be said, just for that.
 
Ian J said:
I think the big difference with Jack was (and please correct me if I'm wrong), but the company was footing the bill for that training.
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Yup.

I don't understand why some people feel it's necessary to pay for something the company should be paying you for.

If I got a job offer and they told me, oh, by the way, for the first few weeks of your employment with us, you're going to work for free and by the way, you're going to pay for the training as well I'd tell them to take a long walk off a short pier.

But I see some people acting as if it's a good thing to be paying a company money for training that the employer should be providing free to you and cutting you a check to attend!
 
bumblebee said:
All of a sudden you don't have the flight instructor there as a security blanket, and the person next to you may make a mistake that could kill you. There is a lot to be said, just for that.
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Or you could do ALOT of solo flight where the person that could kill you is.... well YOU! ;)
 
HP N826AW said:
From someone who is completing their degree and working at the same time, I recommend finishing your degree before getting to an airline. It's such a pain in the butt and will make the first few years at a regional less enjoyable. When everyone is non-reving to visit new places, you'll be stuck writing papers. It sucks big time.

I'm going to get my CFI ratings because I want to work as an instructor or check airman at whatever airline I fly for. I would also like to become a DPE later on down the road.
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the new jb!
 
One of the themes of this thread might be that if you are good enough, and have appropriate experience, a company pays for your training. What does paying for it yourself say about you?
 
Maximillian_Jenius said:
...c'mon guys, lets take the emotion out of all of this. Hacker15's and Bumblebee's post have both been the best in this thread.

The guy comes on here asking for help, and we as a forum of aviators collectively jumps down his throat.

This is an educational site, and we are using more emotion in this thread and trying to educate him by way of a blunt 2x4.

Not cool in my opinion.

We might abhor programs such as this but we as a site need to find a more kinder and gentler medium in which to educate, and not bash.

Furthermore, some people will want to do things there way no matter what, so sometimes it's far better to live and let live. Its his money, he can do what he wants.

But you can at least rest better having told him that there are other options.

We can do better as a site, people, this thread is almost FI-ish in replies.

Lets educate, and not retaliate.
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Somewhat disagree, Max.

If you saw somebody about to jump off a bridge... and they ask you if it's a good idea, wouldn't you shout "DON'T DO IT!" or would you just think "okay...if that's what you want to do."

I think that's the spirit with which most of us responded. Not to "jump down his throat", but to simply say "STOP!....You don't have to do that!!"

After all, a lot of us have been on that bridge and wondered which way to go. ;)

Just my take.

R2F
 
One caveat here: I was all over the deal the recruiter mentioned because it came across as if they were indeed footing the bill. However, I never did find out what the actual case was. I certainly would not pay the 17k myself, but again, I don't see this as an average RJ course either.
 
intern_mike said:
No 4 year degree. I dropped out of international business end of my junior year. It wasn't for me. I do plan on completing my degree in the next 2 years. still trying to decide in what though.
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Sounds like you are getting the cart a bit ahead of the horse..

Get your degree..

No, there is no reason for you to get a ride with a 777 Captain, as he cannot help you without the degree.. You'd be wasting his and your time.. If you plan on picking up your degree, yes, most definitely take a ride around the patch with him...

Planning on finishing it in 2 years and having no idea what the degree will be in doesn't sound like very well laid plans and you know what they say about "best laid plans..."

Now, there are lots of guys that pick it up while being at a regional, but from what lil' I know of you from this thread ( which isn't much ) so far, it appears anything that requires hard work and time rather than "give it to me now" IE: CFIing and a degree.. Doesn't seem to be "for you.."

I could be waaaaay off base here, but that is how it seems..

"Why didn't you get your CFI?"
"Ahh, it just wasn't for me..."

"Why didn't you get your degree??"
"Ahh, degree's... they are not for me, man..."

Sounds like you need to figure out exactly what you want to do and formulate a plan..

1. To go past the regional level a degree is a must... (everyone knows a guy who knows a girl who has a nephew who met a kid who dated this girl who's uncle knew a guy who rode the bus with a dude who had a kid who's T-ball coach used to be a 777 Captain for United...) Get the degree..

2. Skip the $17K of RJ uselessness and learn to fly a plane.. Pick up the CFI stuff..

I feel so bad for the kids in this business who have never done ANY pleasure flying.. I flew with a captain the other day.. He got his private, went to Gulfstream :rolleyes: and then came to 9E.. The guys never had wheels touch grass.. He's never been inverted.. He's never done a split S... He's never flown down a river at water level... He's never... He's never......

Those are the reasons I got into flying.. I fly at an airline to afford those things...
 
Tram said:
No, there is no reason for you to get a ride with a 777 Captain, as he cannot help you without the degree.. You'd be wasting his and your time.. If you plan on picking up your degree, yes, most definitely take a ride around the patch with him...
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It's Mike's relative. He's not going for the flight to brown nose with him for a job. It's for pleasure.
 
Hacker15e said:
It's Mike's relative. He's not going for the flight to brown nose with him for a job. It's for pleasure.
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Well..

intern_mike said:
I have a relative that is a 777 captain for United. Anyway, my dad told me that he would like to go flying with me sometime, and that he would make a good reference on a resume.
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Maybe not brown nosing, but the resume boost won't help without a degree...
 
Maximillian_Jenius said:
...c'mon guys, lets take the emotion out of all of this. Hacker15's and Bumblebee's post have both been the best in this thread.

The guy comes on here asking for help, and we as a forum of aviators collectively jumps down his throat.

This is an educational site, and we are using more emotion in this thread and trying to educate him by way of a blunt 2x4.

Not cool in my opinion.
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Exactamundo.

Offer insight, help or guidance. But if you need to display your phallic fortitude, get a lift kit for your pick up! :)
 
Doug Taylor said:
Exactamundo.

Offer insight, help or guidance. But if you need to display your phallic fortitude, get a lift kit for your pick up! :)
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as the wife would say, "Nice truck, too bad about your d++k":rawk:


By the way I PM'd Mike with my phone so we could chat if he wanted. . . nothing so far.:buck:
 
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