German Wings A320 crashed

This was compiled by Boeing and put on Airliners.net. A list of fatal crashes by aircraft type per 1 million flights. While the Airbus does have more crashes than the 737NG, note that the Airbus entered service in I think 88 and the 737NG in 97 IIRC. That's almost 10 years of a gap in service. You can tell, CRM worked. Except with the MD-11. I had no idea the accident rates were that high on it...

729x.jpg
 
There seems to be a misunderstanding about depression and suicide among some here. If this was in fact depression, I have no doubt another person, anyone, in the cockpit would have stopped this tragedy.

When a depressed person decides to commit suicide, they do it because they feel they have no way out. I don't think a single person who has ever committed suicide has done so because they want to die (save for terrorists and others killing themselves for a cause of some kind). They feel trapped in a situation that is in a constant downward spiral. Every day feels worse than the last and at some point you cross a threshold where the release of death outweighs the pain of living. But if there was some way to ease the pain, the idea of suicide would be taken off the table. I read a story about a person who was going to jump from a bridge and in his suicide note, he said if a single person smiled to him on the way to the bridge, he would not kill himself. No one smiled.

If there had been another person in that cockpit, as there was for the whole flight up until that point, I am certain the FO would not have chosen to crash that plane.

All that being said, choosing to kill yourself while murdering a plane full of innocent people is BS and this bastard deserves to burn in the fires of hell.
 
This was compiled by Boeing and put on Airliners.net. A list of fatal crashes by aircraft type per 1 million flights. While the Airbus does have more crashes than the 737NG, note that the Airbus entered service in I think 88 and the 737NG in 97 IIRC. That's almost 10 years of a gap in service. You can tell, CRM worked. Except with the MD-11. I had no idea the accident rates were that high on it...

729x.jpg
The scientific mind in me HAS to say this. It's not because I disagree, but.....

"You can tell, CRM worked." No, you can't. There is nothing in that graph that shows CRM has worked.

I'm not saying CRM hasn't worked, because we know it has, but there is nothing at all in the image posted that can lead to that conclusion with the data given. Science, it works, but only if you use it correctly, and statistics is a bitch.
 
Remember, the television news media are "entertainers" not "investigators" and screaming passengers makes for a more salacious story than the captain screaming "The door is jammed can you hear me?" in German through the door.
Good point... Ahhhhh so annoying that I fell for it!!! I hate when the media talks about aviation and usually recognize that 99% of what they say is BS. I learned yesterday on TV that the CA stepping out of the cockpit to use the lav or get a drink isn't out of the ordinary...the autopilot is on and the 'co-pilot' is monitoring the autopilot, that's what he's there for. omg lol

One of the things that annoys me on the news is that you can totally tell the anchor is reading a teleprompter and has no clue what he's saying means. I mean -WE- can tell, but non-aviation people can't I don't think. I could read you something about molecular geometry and someone else who has no clue what it is either would think I know what I'm talking about, but someone who actually does would totally be able to tell that I don't :) Ya feel me?

Anyway, sorry to buy in and sound stupid:eek:
 
Good point... Ahhhhh so annoying that I fell for it!!! I hate when the media talks about aviation and usually recognize that 99% of what they say is BS. I learned yesterday on TV that the CA stepping out of the cockpit to use the lav or get a drink isn't out of the ordinary...the autopilot is on and the 'co-pilot' is monitoring the autopilot, that's what he's there for. omg lol

One of the things that annoys me on the news is that you can totally tell the anchor is reading a teleprompter and has no clue what he's saying means. I mean -WE- can tell, but non-aviation people can't I don't think. I could read you something about molecular geometry and someone else who has no clue what it is either would think I know what I'm talking about, but someone who actually does would totally be able to tell that I don't :) Ya feel me?

Anyway, sorry to buy in and sound stupid:eek:

No don't be sorry, that was more of a side note than it was a correction.

Rage on bro! :)
 
Also screaming passengers.
Sadly yes, I am aware of that.

So many "if only" and "I wish" scenarios going through everyone's mind.
I feel so badly for those who lost their loved ones, friends and family members. All the children and the infants especially with no chance to become adults.......also makes one very angry and frustrated. None of this had to happen. It could have been handled differently if he had only been able to know/see/understand this and has gotten a deeper intervention of some sort. I don't know. Depression and mental/emotional issues are so difficult to make reason from, especially in someone that we do not know and do not even know exactly what his issues were and none of us are trained psychiatrists. Often people are also able to mask and hide what they are feeling experiencing to a great degree as well, until the time finally comes when they just cannot and snap. I just wish he had gotten some help before this, sought help or if he was given the option for help, taken it. I guess everyone is feeling this way right about now. Maybe everyone cannot be saved. Maybe everyone does not want help or is not in a state of mind to believe that things can get better, that their situation can change for the better and they hide what is going on internally. For them, they feel they have no hope and this is beyond sad. It's bad enough he decided to ruin/end his own life, but no one, for no reason on earth, has the right to make that decision for others. It's difficult to imagine such a state of mind that does not see/understand this in some way and has become that desperate/hopeless and spun out of control.

If he did indeed have some mental/emotional issues while still in school/flight training, I have questions about why he was then allowed to continue/return, if he was properly diagnosed at that time and if he got the proper help that he needed and if not, then why? Should he have been monitored/followed more closely during his career? What is the system in that the doctor did not report this final incident to his employer, if it was so serious that he had to be immediately grounded? It is apparent now, that he could not be trusted to report the grounding himself. So I also wonder what his doctor's culpability in this matter is and who he reported this to, if anyone or how quickly. I don't know what their checks and balances are, nor how they work. It is sounding more and more as though he should have not been allowed to be a commercial pilot in the first place or even have a medical cert to be able to fly. With how strict, heavily monitored, thorough and strenuous Lufthansa's training seems to be, I don't know why or how this one man slipped through the cracks. Lufthansa will need to answer for this and explain this to the families and in a court of law obviously.

On a side note, I have not watched one news outlet here in this country nor read one account in any American news outlet here on this incident. I have been only reading/watching German and French press entities and one UK source and I looked at one source in Spain. I have no idea with every single incident such as this, why so many here watch CNN or MSNBC or whatever and then complain for pages about how terrible the reporting is. Why this is anything new or surprising? It makes no sense to me. It's been my practice for many years to watch and read foreign press sources, foreign journalists and various foreign entities with credible websites 90% of the time. It usually leads to doing more research and learning more about a subject as well. I guess many people do what is convenient, but credible, factual/true, insightful, educated and non biased journalism/reporting, faded away in this nation decades ago. There are better sources and better choices available. We all have the same technology and should be using it.
 
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Good point... Ahhhhh so annoying that I fell for it!!! I hate when the media talks about aviation and usually recognize that 99% of what they say is BS. I learned yesterday on TV that the CA stepping out of the cockpit to use the lav or get a drink isn't out of the ordinary...the autopilot is on and the 'co-pilot' is monitoring the autopilot, that's what he's there for. omg lol

One of the things that annoys me on the news is that you can totally tell the anchor is reading a teleprompter and has no clue what he's saying means. I mean -WE- can tell, but non-aviation people can't I don't think. I could read you something about molecular geometry and someone else who has no clue what it is either would think I know what I'm talking about, but someone who actually does would totally be able to tell that I don't :) Ya feel me?

Anyway, sorry to buy in and sound stupid:eek:

What??! You don't think they carefully review their news stories before reporting them??

 
Remember, the television news media are "entertainers" not "investigators" and screaming passengers makes for a more salacious story than the captain screaming "The door is jammed can you hear me?" in German through the door.

Nah, that can't be. They are honest, good, upstanding people.
 
What??! You don't think they carefully review their news stories before reporting them??



In all fairness, that was just one affiliate that reported that... but yeah. It was pretty amazing that ended up on the air as everyone was still in the somewhat similar frame of mind with that crash as with now.
 
Anybody want to bet the FAA will set up some requirement for our primary care docs automatically forward all new reports to the FAA or our AME? It'd overwhelm the FAA staff and convince AME's to get out of the business or charge double for a medical because of all the extra work. I bet on the AME option because it wouldn't impact the FAA's budget as much.
 
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