Flying for free...Don't do it.

SpiraMirabilis said:
When I was a flight instructor there was another instructor who was part-time, he was a doctor doing it for the fun of it. He never bothered to pick up his paychecks. Hard to ask for more money when people are willing to do your job for free.
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I remember him.... did his mei... I knew it would lead to this.
 
sixoneseven said:
VERY common amongst new Pilots today. Low pay or no pay, they're doing it "for the love of flying"
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Unfortunately "the love of flying" doesn't pay the bills...But maybe dad does so it might work for some. Nevertheless, I just don't understand that mentality.
 
wait, somebody has an insurance company that will cover a pilot with zero time in type and has so little multi time that, he uses the phrase, "at least it is free multi time"?

Dollars to donuts says that Golden Eagle eats him alive.
 
Douglas said:
wait, somebody has an insurance company that will cover a pilot with zero time in type and has so little multi time that, he uses the phrase, "at least it is free multi time"?

Dollars to donuts says that Golden Eagle eats him alive.
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Now, if i can play devil's advocate, if everything goes smoothly, the golden eagle wont tear him up. Fly the V speeds and you're golden. I dont remember which one exactly was labled the "widowmaker" but unless theres an engine failure or an exhaust AD that hasnt been complied with, I dont view the flight as all that difficult.
 
We have had more than a few guys call our flight school asking for MEIs to airline out with the guy and give him his 10-20 hours of instruction on the way back for free. What a deal! LOL.

My idea of a good time isn't sitting next to a guy who isn't qualified to fly the plane in the first place for 20 hours of flying across the country in a plane I don't know, for free.
 
Nothing new here, and it isn't going away. Talk to guys who came up in the mid 90s when you couldn't get in the right seat of a 1900 without 2500 hours and an ATP. Doesn't make it smart, safe, or any other good "s" word, but it'll always be there. As someone said, the key is to make it clear to people that a kid who's trying to "build multi time" isn't the person you want behind the controls of your high dollar investment when things go pear-shaped. Telling the kids they're being dumb isn't going to change their behavior any more than it does when you tell them drinking till you're nearly passed out and driving to the store for another sixer isn't wise.
 
Boris Badenov said:
Nothing new here, and it isn't going away. Talk to guys who came up in the mid 90s when you couldn't get in the right seat of a 1900 without 2500 hours and an ATP. Doesn't make it smart, safe, or any other good "s" word, but it'll always be there. As someone said, the key is to make it clear to people that a kid who's trying to "build multi time" isn't the person you want behind the controls of your high dollar investment when things go pear-shaped. Telling the kids they're being dumb isn't going to change their behavior any more than it does when you tell them drinking till you're nearly passed out and driving to the store for another sixer isn't wise.
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As much as i would like to agree with you, i dont think things will change until the idea of multi being the end all be all changes. Its hard for people to give up expensive multi time that will get them hired on, when airlines dis regard 3000TT and 50 multi, for some kid for 1000TT and 100 multi because for some reason its such a huge difference.
 
*shrug*. If it's not multi it'll be something else. It's a market, just like any other market. Someone is always willing (anxious, actually) to undercut you. The only way you can get by is by convincing your customer that your superior product is worth the extra cost. In my view, anyway.
 
The problem is the lack of perceived value by the end-user.

The success of a flight is binary. Either you make it or you don't. And, despite some pretty bad decision making, most flights make it.

The same forces driving down the cost of labor for pilots drives up confidence/bravado in pilots...the whole "nothing bad happened so it must be okay" mentality. Both outcomes are based on binary results, not the graduated scale of success other professions experience.

I can't remember the post/site, but somebody was telling a pilot he didn't hire that he found somebody who would fly the route for $30,000 instead of $50,000....to which the pilot responded, "better hope you don't encounter $50,000 weather."

Value in safety is a hard sell to individuals...as a system, its easy to spot....

Just my $.03 (inflation)
 
stensonb said:
The problem is the lack of perceived value by the end-user.

The success of a flight is binary. Either you make it or you don't. And, despite some pretty bad decision making, most flights make it.

The same forces driving down the cost of labor for pilots drives up confidence/bravado in pilots...the whole "nothing bad happened so it must be okay" mentality. Both outcomes are based on binary results, not the graduated scale of success other professions experience.

I can't remember the post/site, but somebody was telling a pilot he didn't hire that he found somebody who would fly the route for $30,000 instead of $50,000....to which the pilot responded, "better hope you don't encounter $50,000 weather."

Value in safety is a hard sell to individuals...as a system, its easy to spot....

Just my $.03 (inflation)
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:yup: Awesome, well done sir, X's 2.
 
stensonb said:
somebody was telling a pilot he didn't hire that he found somebody who would fly the route for $30,000 instead of $50,000....to which the pilot responded, "better hope you don't encounter $50,000 weather."
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Somebody ought to make this their sig line.
 
jrh said:
Somebody ought to make this their sig line.
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as much as i would like to say thats true, the last pilot i can think of that encountered $50,000 crashed last year off the coast of FL in a 421. Not bad odds if you wanna save 20 grand.
 
cmill said:
as much as i would like to say thats true, the last pilot i can think of that encountered $50,000 crashed last year off the coast of FL in a 421. Not bad odds if you wanna save 20 grand.
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Maybe it's just late at night, but I don't understand what you're saying or what your point is.
 
jrh said:
Maybe it's just late at night, but I don't understand what you're saying or what your point is.
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Im sure the fault is all mine, but i was talking about the 421 that took off from the dallas area (ADS i believe) that crashed off the west coast of FL in a thunderstorm. I wish i could find the news story, or at least the NTSB prelim, but i dont have the motivation.
 
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