First Year Pay
- Thread starter Trip7
- Start date
Seggy
Well-Known Member
Trip7
Well-Known Member
holy cow! That would help on students loans quick. What equipment you flying? Is that a really good month or can you do that consistently?
Fly4Pay
New Member
This is VERY situationally dependent. We are hiring folks as fast as we can cram 'em through training--so it's not like they're slow rolling hiring to save money. SO... no one minds if you're grabbing open time like it's going out of style--it allows the company to do business, make money, hire more guys, etc, etc, etc...
BUT.. like Seggy says--if guys are on furlough and you're helping the company keep them there, that ain't cool...
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Well, I hit the line in June, and I was on reserve all but one month after that. My W2 says I made $11K. There ya go. Could I have made more? Only if I wanted to commute from MEM to DTW, but the extra I made woulda been spent on hotel rooms/crashpads. So, if you double that, you're looking at $22K.
When I got hired people were saying "Oh, you probably won't sit reserve at all" and "Reserve in MEM is only a couple of months." Well, 5 months is a few more than a couple. Thing was, until that summer, reserve WAS short. I've said it a hundred times, I'll say it again. If you're planning your budget for over guarantee, you're setting yourself up for a potential headache.
When I got hired people were saying "Oh, you probably won't sit reserve at all" and "Reserve in MEM is only a couple of months." Well, 5 months is a few more than a couple. Thing was, until that summer, reserve WAS short. I've said it a hundred times, I'll say it again. If you're planning your budget for over guarantee, you're setting yourself up for a potential headache.
jtrain609
Antisocial Monster
True dat. I considered mentioning that point, but figured I'd leave it alone and let kellwolf chime in. Express is hiring as many as they can and they still have open time, where Pinnacle in the past stopped hiring and still had open time. You're very right in that it all depends.
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
Maybe I'm all about kicking a guy while he is down, but if you can't staff what you have, drop some flights and park some planes. In my situation, the pilot group (and the training department) has been telling the company for almost a year that they need to kick up their hiring numbers. But the company kept saying that the staffing model was working and everything was ok. Well, all of the sudden we are parking 3 airplanes and can't cover the rest of the flying. There is a thin line between endangering your own career (due to the place just shutting down) and makeing sure that somebody is held accountable for their crappy management skills. Our completion factor was around 80% for a few days during the blend. Good for us I say. Sucks for the passengers though. And if there ISN'T some accountablity then the same thing is going to keep happening.
So while picking up open time when nobody is on the street isn't nearly as bad as doing when there are guys on the street (that deserves a blanket party if you ask me) I still have some issues with it in this particular situation. Especially because the company isn't doing everything they can to attract new pilots.
So while picking up open time when nobody is on the street isn't nearly as bad as doing when there are guys on the street (that deserves a blanket party if you ask me) I still have some issues with it in this particular situation. Especially because the company isn't doing everything they can to attract new pilots.
Seggy
Well-Known Member
Dude, you have to slow down here.
This is called the internet and usually something falls in the middle. If you look at the thread you have had two guys who have been through their first year at Eagle, one who left for another company.
With this, there is a wide variety of each ones pay situation, not calling them liars, but saying, that two guys, were paid differently.
Take that into consideration.
Fly4Pay
New Member
Yeah, yours a little different situation (see... VERY situationally dependent, like I said!
). Your situation is a lot closer to the "furlough" situation than what we have going. Your mgmt appears to be trying to get blood from a turnip, as my folks would say. And in that case, you're right--picking up open time just prolongs the agony.We have open time because we are expanding, and we can't get them hired and trained fast enough (and that's with interviewees coming in just about every day, and most of those getting hired!). If we canx flights, passengers get pissed and go elsewhere. Bad for the company AND bad for us.
ChadW346
New Member
Those that work hard? Regular guys?
You're schedule gets awarded based on seniority, not who wants to work hard and who doesn't. The regional airlines are low cost carriers, therefore they really don't want you over flying your guarantee. Typical lines at Colgan are between 55hrs and 68hrs. If you get lucky and get an 83hr line, that month will be pretty nice.
For example, in May, the company wanted me to achieve 100hrs in the airplane as quickly as possible so that you're not a "green" crew member very long. In May I flew 90hrs and got pay credit for a little over 100.
In June, completely different story. I flew about 55hrs, but spent at least 5-6 days on reserve. This month I have 12 days off with a 62hr line! Ridiculous! I'm going to try like heck to pick up open time, but trust me, they'd rather call someone thats sitting reserve on those days, then pay you over your guarantee.
The airlines are cheap - they aren't going to let you bank over guarantee too often. I had a trip trade denied because it would have put the other guy over guarantee.
I gross $1500 a month. I may pull down $2000 on a good month, but thats with a LOT of flying. When you fly 90-100hrs a month, thats a lot of work and you'll get worn down quickly. In May I was worthless on my off days, didn't even feel like doing anything. There's only so much of that you can take before your body just starts to get unhealthy.
At some carriers, they may just well be over flying the heck out of their guys due to staffing shortages. But I would not base a budget or even a hypothetical situation on over guarantee. You're just going to end up disappointed. Bet on your guarantee, and if you make more, then consider it a nice bonus.
Ok, so I'm confused. From what I am reading, 55 and 62 hours would be under the guarantee that Colgan is advertising. How does that happen?
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
It just means the company is over staffed, and/or you aren't flying on reserve. When lineholders have lines that are well below guarantee like that there are too many pilots. With reserve it's misleading, because technically you were "on call" even though your block time doesn't show it, which to me still signifies you were at work.
It's pretty cool when it happens. You get a bonus either way. If you don't pick up any flying you got paid more to do less work (75 hours pay, 60 hours work).
If there is open time, like we have here, you can also pick up more and not work nearly as much. For example, with a 66 hours of block this month I'll make a minimum of 98 hours credit (pay). So I will fly around 66-70 hours but get paid 98 (it'll be more like 100 once it's all said and done probably).
Had I bid a line that was high credit, say in the mid 90's, I'd actually have to fly those hours in order to get paid for them. F that %*@$, yo. That's way too much work for wheelsup.
For those interested in my 12 month summary:
http://forums.jetcareers.com/416357-post1.html
Hootie
Old Skool
I'm making alot more than what I had expected so far at Skywest. The past six months I think I'm somewhere around 15g with per diem in the equation and NO open time. I was expecting 75-85 hours pay but I've been forced up to 100 hours credit pretty regularly. I also average 11-12 days off a month, I wish I had more but PBS says no. Your mileage may vary.
eagledriver101
New Member
mtsu_av8er
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure about regional pay, but I'm on the $43,680/year program . . . that includes 10 hours of paid sleep per day!!
Wait - I'm second year. I make more.
Nevermind . . .
Wait - I'm second year. I make more.
Nevermind . . .
I'm not sure about regional pay, but I'm on the $43,680/year program . . . that includes 10 hours of paid sleep per day!!
Wait - I'm second year. I make more.
Nevermind . . .
AND... you fly a Baron. Gotta love how that works out. You make more than guys flying around in jets. I have a friend who flew for FLX, and he loved it.
Gotta Q for you. I understand it really is hard to predict, as it changes constantly, but how hard is it to get your choice of base with FLX? I wouldn't mind the MOB run, since it has a long lay over in BTR.
Van_Hoolio
Well-Known Member
My first full month at XJT I got $2,161.49 in pay plus $602.95 in per diem, with 13 days off. Last month it was more like $2,400.19 plus $553.47 with 12 actual days off (13 scheduled), but I don't have the final numbers yet.
This was all pre-tax, pre-bennies, etc. and not take-home pay.
Hey, it's better than I made instructing. Even at $20 an hour, it was rare to bill the 100+ hours I'd need to get close to what I'm making now.
Mike
This was all pre-tax, pre-bennies, etc. and not take-home pay.
Hey, it's better than I made instructing. Even at $20 an hour, it was rare to bill the 100+ hours I'd need to get close to what I'm making now.
Mike
Fly4Pay
New Member
I'm not sure about regional pay, but I'm on the $43,680/year program . . . that includes 10 hours of paid sleep per day!!
And that's just while he's flyin'!!!!! :yup:
zmiller4
Well-Known Member
Wow! That's like 110hrs of pay with 400hrs of per diem...that's working really hard. I never came close to that in SJU...in fact, I never broke guarantee on reserve (even though I had a ton of 12hr+ duty days) and was still at 11 days off then.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
We've got so much open time right now, the company has tossed out paying the FOs 150% to pick it up. Yeah, you read that right. Normally, the company only pays straight pay for open time, hence the reason most people don't pick it up. If I'm gonna work on my day off, I want a little bit more than what I would normally get.
Even now I'm having a hard time picking stuff up. Problem is, scheduling keeps violating the contract. Open time is SUPPOSED to be available for line holders up to 72 hours prior to show time for the trip. They've been assigning the open time to reserve pilots about 4-5 days in advance. What this does is keeps them from paying the 150%, and they use someone they'd probably be paying the same amount for the month anyway. Essentially, they're getting the flying covered for free. What screws them is when someone calls in sick, and they don't have any reserves left. Now they have to find a lineholder to extend. Happened to me last month, but I still had an extension refusal in my pocket. Used that, so they had to keep looking for someone to cover those two flights. They tried to pass it off as a schedule change saying I couldn't refuse it, but I pointed out to them that the "schedule change" had me finishing 4 hours later than my original release time, therefore making it an extension. I feel for the schedulers here. The company really doesn't give them a lot to work with, and then they put pressure on them to fill the holes.
As far as them assigning that open time that I signed up for to a reserve too far ahead of time.....that might burn them, too. There's a 99% probability they're gonna have to pay me for that anyway thanks to the contract greivance process. Another thanks to ALPA there.
As far as the whole reserve thing.....it sucked. Yeah, I got paid for 75 hours the month of November and only flew 12. Unfortunately, first year pay sucks, so 75 hours of pay really isn't all that. It wasn't until I started flying 85-90 hours a month that I could keep my head above water. Now I'm getting 90-95 a month on second year pay (which is moderately better at this airline, but not too much), and I'm almost able to exist past paycheck to paycheck. Downside is, I'll probably only get 75 hours for the month of December since I'll probably time out by then.
Even now I'm having a hard time picking stuff up. Problem is, scheduling keeps violating the contract. Open time is SUPPOSED to be available for line holders up to 72 hours prior to show time for the trip. They've been assigning the open time to reserve pilots about 4-5 days in advance. What this does is keeps them from paying the 150%, and they use someone they'd probably be paying the same amount for the month anyway. Essentially, they're getting the flying covered for free. What screws them is when someone calls in sick, and they don't have any reserves left. Now they have to find a lineholder to extend. Happened to me last month, but I still had an extension refusal in my pocket. Used that, so they had to keep looking for someone to cover those two flights. They tried to pass it off as a schedule change saying I couldn't refuse it, but I pointed out to them that the "schedule change" had me finishing 4 hours later than my original release time, therefore making it an extension. I feel for the schedulers here. The company really doesn't give them a lot to work with, and then they put pressure on them to fill the holes.
As far as them assigning that open time that I signed up for to a reserve too far ahead of time.....that might burn them, too. There's a 99% probability they're gonna have to pay me for that anyway thanks to the contract greivance process. Another thanks to ALPA there.
As far as the whole reserve thing.....it sucked. Yeah, I got paid for 75 hours the month of November and only flew 12. Unfortunately, first year pay sucks, so 75 hours of pay really isn't all that. It wasn't until I started flying 85-90 hours a month that I could keep my head above water. Now I'm getting 90-95 a month on second year pay (which is moderately better at this airline, but not too much), and I'm almost able to exist past paycheck to paycheck. Downside is, I'll probably only get 75 hours for the month of December since I'll probably time out by then.
subpilot
Squawking 7600
That is from an 80hr line at base pay. 10 hours of 120% OT and 10 hours of 150% OT. I have my line built up to 99.5 hours and as soon as I project over 100 hours I call crew scheduling and have a turn taken off my schedule (with pay). With all the weather we have been flying around lately I am getting a trip removed with pay about once every 3-4 work days. You just have to work the system and it is survivable around here.