First Day

[guido161st]

Well it depends on your time and effort. What do you want out of it? Fast, Cheap, quality, Etc. I would recommend Angel Air in Chandler, or Accelerated flight crew training (they are all twins) But you need to see what you want out of it. How frequently are you willing to fly? If you want something intense like Pan Am, then any school is fine. Just fly 5 days a week and do a lot of studying. You will spend less and progress just as fast as the guys at Pan Am if not faster. Try finding a freelance instructor, that's even cheaper. You can work around your schedule very easy. Good Luck

 

[braniff]

thanks for all the great information about PANAM, however, I'm still concerned about the content of individuals opinions...........
I've been researhing flight schools for at least one to two years now. Finally, I've decided to attend PANAM this summer. I've been contacting PANAM for at least a good 6 months. I've always been treated with professionalism and most of all informative aviaton knowledge (9/11 concerns to job placement). My counselor told me that PANAM does have many females in their program, which it was nice to here this is really true too. Also, from my understanding aviation has and never will be a perfect world. The reason I'm picking them, it's not a factory and everybody seems real........
The money issue is a big concern of mine as well but I know it will pay off in the end (10 years from now). HA. I do want to attend a school that is airline prep and realistic to the airlines. My counselor said, that I should not treat my training as school but like the job at the airlines. She said, if I can't follow the anal rules of the uniform (required blacks socks -- not to wear white/decal on shirts showing through)and even the attitude vs. good flying skills and being on time, that I would never make it through the interviews stressfull interagation.

 

[dakovich]

yeah, the uniform issue i don't see as a very big deal. why not act professional and look the part even at this early stage of learning. this isn't college or high school, we don't need to express ourselves through fashion here, what we need is professional discipline all the way from attitude to attire. it makes sense to me. even with the dress code and what not the campus in Fort Pierce is by no means an uptight "all business" kindda place. its a very serious environment, but everyone is pretty laid back. you'll meet a lot of good friends, and hopfully have a good time while you learn. i know i have, and i know i'll continue to as my training goes on.

another little thing i might mention, pertaining to some of the problems i've heard about waiting for checkrides and wasting time and situations like that. turns out to avoid problems like this the school is training us under a part61 umbrella while maintaing a part141 curriculm. part141 being more stringent in design. guess there were a few problems with a limited number of 141 check ride certified instructors or something. supposedly these 141 guys would have to disappear in a sense for 3 months or whatever while they routinly were recertified themselves by the FAA. so, when this happened there ended up being a bottle neck of sorts when it came to the # of students needing a check ride and the availability of certifed check ride instructors. something wierd along those lines. either, way...the school is still 141 compliant and certified, we just abide by some less restrictive criteria when it comes to odd situations like the one i was trying to explain. we still have our 141 instructors but if something happens, another instructor can step in to replace so time isn't wasted for the students. thats how it was explained to us, if it sounds confusing just call and ask about it. don't quote me on the specifics, its just how i interpreted it to be. basicaly a way to keep check ride instructors in steady supply for student demand.

okay, gonna go try to remember how to fly. practicing forward slips today and power off landings. real cool stuff, get to learn how to make the plane fall out of the sky real quick in a controlled manor. its really cool. by the way, what a weekend! its funny cause around here everywhere you go, you run into a pilot. you get to now your instuctors and classmates on a level outside of school. they get to be friends, not just teachers...thats important in this business, not to mention life. enough philosophy, i'll try to write more later...our solo flights are cominh up real soon, aught to be some good stroies.

 

[PurduePilot]

Thanks, Dakovich for posting all the information about Pam Am.

I'm still on the fence about going. I've heard compelling arguements on both sides of the issue.

Keep it coming with the daily journal, if you have time!

 

[dakovich]

well, this week is my check ride for my solo flight. supposed to be soloing next week. pretty excited, i'm so ready to just go and fly alone and know i have full authority and resposability for the aircraft. kindda like cutting the umbilical(sp.?) cord. i'll really be glad when ground school is over, it takes up sooooo much time. but its mandated by the FAA so we have to take it. flying has been going real well, been really windy the past couple weeks so i'm learning to land in heavy cross wind conditions. never really learned to land on a normal day, but give me a pure 15kt x-wind and i'm golden. to tell you the truth, the only thing i'm really worried about is my radio comm. skills. thery're getting better but its the most intimidating thing to me. i'm going to focus a lot on my airport taxiway map so i know the place like the back of my hand. pays off when the tower gives you 3 directions to take while taxiing..."left on bravo right on charlie, another left on delta and hold short 14, make a u turn and parallel park it behind the Tiki retaurant". aagghhhhh!

oh, seems to be Phx. campus is getting pelted by some very unsat. former students. i've posted a reply on one of the posts. these guys are wicked bitter. guess i would be to if what they say happened to me. we really don't here much about the other campus, most we here is about the sims because thats where we'll be sent for ACE. supposed to have a Canadair sim up and running soon for us to use. anyway, all i can say is i see nothing in Florida that resembles what those few are saying about the Phx. campus. i'm going to mention something to one of the upper guys here in FLorida and see what he says. maybe i'll get a better perspective on things in the west.

 

[flybimmer]

Ahh...the Tiki. Are you living there yet???

Try the Flight Deck across the airport. It's pretty good, too...

 

[Citation X]

Good luck on your 1st solo, Dak...

Don't rely on that GPS too much, many students have no idea what to do if it stops working.

If it doesn't look good, GO AROUND.

Good luck!

 

[Raskal]

Hey Dakovich,

First, best of luck on your stagecheck...I'm sure you'll do fine. And when it comes to comms, don't worry about it, it'll come. Definitely DO NOT get dependent upon the GPS! As a matter of fact, get in the habit of turning if off or completely ignoring it for the time being. The first thing the FAA examiner is going to do is turn it off. You don't need it now, it's nice but outside of what you need to learn.

One thing, I am really curious about this "part 61 in a 141" thing. 61 requires more flight hours, additional x country requirements among other things. This translates to greater costs to you. 141 has mandatory stagechecks and ground hours, which it sounds like you have. Which is it? Don't let them feed you a line, either the program is 141 or it isn't! You could be talking about a lot of $$! In 61 NO ground instruction is required, in 141 it is, which is the reason for less flight hours required. I wouldn't let this slip by.

 

[guido161st]

Good Luck Dakovich-

Raskal- you are right on the minimums for 61 and 141, however 99 percent of the people do not finish their ratings within the minimums. DO NOT base your choice on saving money cause one is less hours. In my opinion 61 is by far better. You get a little more leeway for the syllabus. You don't have to wait around to finish the strict syllabus that 141 has. Good Luck

 

[dakovich]

well, sorry i've been gone so long. reached a point where everything got really busy at school. out of the original 9 in our class 7 of us are completing our stage 3 checks. its the stage right before our private rides, so you can imagine how crazy its gotten. they've been pushin really hard for us to get this all done. supposed to start our time building this week...and finish by our instrunment ground school on the 15th. don't ask me how we're supposed to start and finish a 2 week time build (35 hours)program by the 15th. its got me a little confused. i'll try and get back to you on how that works out. might overlap instrunment ground and time building. otherwise things haven't been to bad. just busy, study study study. little controversy with the whole time building thing. we were supposed to finish our private, have a couple days off, and get two weeks for time building. also, we were all kindda hoping for a day or two to study for our private faa check, but it seems thats not going to happen. we're all kindda just pushin through. which, i guess is with the whole fast program thing. little too rushed if you ask me. but, i digress and do what has to be done.

on a personal note. my 2000 jetta brake system took a crap last friday. took it to local vw, yup, $800.00 to fix! ahhhhh! i'm a pilot, i don't have $800. so, with no help from the local dealer, called vw and they said they'd pay for the parts, which was about $700 of the total. vw is cool, they were really easy going about helping me. did i mention it took the whole weekend for the dealer to locate my car on the lot. but no biggy, only paying $36 a day for a renter. anyway, so they get it fixed and i go to get it. guy points it out, gives me the key and i walk to my car and check this crap...moe foes somehow hit my passenger side door with something, probably another car. dented the hell out of it, big scuff...and you could tell they had tried to buff it out and bang out the dent. ok, no biggie, but the s.o.b.'s didn't even tell me about it. had to bring it up to them. so they admitted it wasn't there when it came in and to bring it back monday to the body shop. sorry to vent my personal crap but that really made me mad.

 

[dakovich]

things are going better than a week or two ago. they all of a sudden told us we were going to start instrunment ground school on April 15th and that we all had to have our PPL by then. originally we weren't supposed to start that until May, so they basically wanted us to cut 2 weeks off of our PPL and do it faster, and then do our time-building during instrunment ground school. all of which made no sense and was completely stressing everyone out. it wasn't fun there for a while. but, turns out none of us are on the class list for that ground school, so maybe that situation has been avoided. we'll see in the morning though. most of us are waiting for our FAA check ride for PPL, i should be up tuesday for that. been studying 24/7 for it. anyway, things are good except for the above mentioned snafu from the administration. i'm sure i'll be seeing you around campus, its a lot of work but its so fun to do this stuff.

 

[perpetual]

Wow, you are already getting ready for you PPL check ride?

What has it been ... about a month or so since you started right?

It seems so Quick that all this is happening, as you have posted.

I keep seeing all the negitives posted about Pan Am,... so far None have really amounted to anything according to your posts. There are the exceptional change of routine that you are saying, but otherwise everything still seems kosher correct?

When I get there, yea will look you up hehe

Okay, as aways .. let us know anything that comes up, and thanks in advance

 

[perpetual]

Heya Dack,.. Seen that you are on, wish that the chatroom was back up and running. Anyhow, What is everything like over there at Fort Pierce?

How is everything comming along?

Im supposed to start May 7th... Time is drawing near, how goes everything there and how are you doing with your training thusfar?

 

[dakovich]

yeah, we all really fit an 8 week course into 6 weeks and they want us to do our time building (supposed to be 2 weeks) in one week. time building in a week isn't really that bad, but the ppl is kindda tough to squeeze in.

turns out they put us into the ground school for instrunment today. kindda really gay actually. we have this 5 week class, from 1-4pm. have to study for that (first test is thursday), we all have to somehow study for and pass the FAA PPL examination, and we all have to fit in the time building in there somewhere. talk about a plate full of work! no relax time, none at all. kindda crappy of them to even suggest we try and jam all this in together, but we truge on and do it.

makes no sense though when we can't even begin to fly instrunment flights until we finish our PPL and then finish our 35 hours of time building. so thats like at least 2 weeks away. so we get this class, and have no flight experience to back it up.

guess i'm bitter because i planned everything around our original curriculum and i bought a plane ticket home for when we were supposed to have a week off. well, there goes $100 on that.

well, even though i bitch about it, everything is going somewhat smoothly. not to much else to complain about, just real frustrating when we bust our asses to get this far and then the uppers say we have to do it even faster. you can see how money dictates how things run here, it shows sometimes. but, if any of us really wnated to wait till next month for our Instrunment class we could complain and wait to take it. we just all really want to stay together in our training so we don't say too much. we'll see if we stay in the class. who knows

 

[perpetual]

Dak! wow,.. tut mir leid mien freude. That sounds crazy, and very "Accellerated". I see that things are starting to get hectic there.

Not in a bad way, but in a sort of rushed way, which could almost be bad but not fully? hmm.

I really dont see why they would have you rushing into an entirely differnt RATING! when your not complete on your First! I see what you are saying about it being kinda lame.

As far as extra time is concerened, are you talking about the weekends as well being consumed by classes?

When DO you get to study/review for next class/procedure that you are to learn the next day?

What is your schedule like now? Do they still have you starting at 7am and ending at night, or are you starting to see sudden changes in schedules?

You sound like you are extremely able, and willing to press on and overcome anything, and any BS that may come your way. Im with you 100%, but if you or the others in your Group feel that they are being "Rushed" in a way that would prohibit retention of skill/knowledge and therefore possibly bring a saftey issue to light, then I think you/your group should raise the BS flag.

Hmmmm. I know not how things are run there, but Hopefully Things can only get Better, and not take a step back.

Im sorry to hear about the Change of plans about missing your flight, I wasnt even aware that there was a "Scheduled" time off as far as multiple days are concerned while attending.

Okay, Thanks for the update, Keep em comming time permitting, and Good luck, your on your way to getting there, just alotta little bumps in the road it seems right now.

 

[Citation X]

Originally posted by dakovich:
turns out they put us into the ground school for instrunment today. kindda really gay actually. we have this 5 week class, from 1-4pm. have to study for that (first test is thursday), we all have to somehow study for and pass the FAA PPL examination, and we all have to fit in the time building in there somewhere. talk about a plate full of work! no relax time, none at all. kindda crappy of them to even suggest we try and jam all this in together, but we truge on and do it.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">kindda really gay??????????????

NO, it's PAN AM and another attempt to get your money faster, father, and for sure.

 

[dakovich]

well, this situation is a little stressful...but it does make some sense. we are all steps from being PPL rated and only a week from finishing our time building after that. so, considering that the whole first week or so of this ground school is review of our PPL stuff its not that bad. don't get me wrong, its still alot of stuff, but its doable. we do have the option to drop the class and wait till next month, but after starting it it seems like we might as well do it. i wish i could've had some time to finish everything prior, but i also want to get out of here and start CFIing or doin whatever is next for me. so, i suck it up and just do it.

and yes, it is a way for them to make cash. they get to fill a class with twice as many students as before (still only 15 guys) and they only have to pay one instructor to do it. but they still offer the instrunment course next month, so that kindda kills the argument that they are trying to make two classes into one and save money. big thing is they get to fill the seats of the aircraft very steadilly for the next 8 weeks...that makes the owners very happy, and it makes the administartors look very good.

in their defense, i would do the same thing they did...it makes sense from their standpoint. we were worried that we would have to do a schedule like so:

0700-0800:BREIF
0800-1300:FLIGHTS
1300-1600:GROUND SCHOOL
1600-?:MORE FLIGHT TIME

turns out we will only have the morning brief, fly once between 0800 and 1300, and then finish with ground school 1300-1600. after that its "free" time. so its not to horrible. the big whoo haa is that they sprung this on us at the last minute really. we all had planned for instrunment next month, finish our other stuff between now and then, and maybe have half a week off before we started instrunment. instead we got the situation we are in now. it just throws a whole bunch more variables into an already tense and sensitive equation...biggest being studying for our FAA check ride.

by the way, we are 0 for 3 on the FAA check ride. one guy unsated for paper work reasons(kindda a fluke really, not his fault), and two fialed orals and didn't take the test. these examiners are very very very strict here. i know i read someones post somewhere on here about their check ride somewhere else, and theya did all these things sloppy or wrong but they still passed...man, not here. you have to be sharp, they are really tough. i guess i'll know better when i go for mine, and i'll let ya know how it went.

 

[**DONOTDELETE**]

Well it seems Dak is getting a little taste of Pan Am's changes as well. Too bad. I guarantee if you stay at Pan Am long enough these things will happen to you. Look at the context in which these things are happening: you're a paying customer and you're not gaining anything by Pan Am rushing you through their lame ground schools. There is no reason for Pan Am to do these things. I'm as guilty as anyone for having stayed on with this place. I've managed to turn my back time and time again and i'm growing more and more bitter; however, at this point I'm to far along to pull out.
Dak, good call on staying with your group. You should all speak as one (you may even get someone's attention)! Perpetual, make sure you're ready for great training aircraft, nice facilities and all the Scheisse that comes with it.

 

[dakovich]

I PASSED MY PRIVATE EXAM!!!!! doc says my itch is just temporary!...but really, i passed my oral and flight exam today. soooo glad its over. i'll wirte later and tell ya'll whats it was like.

 

[d_gelling]

Congratulations