zmiller4
Well-Known Member
Watch out, his team of lawyers might just hunt you down and threaten to sue for that comment.
And then will call the judge biased unless it's a carnie handed mango man like him.
EgyptAir 804 Missing
- Thread starter Pilot121
- Start date
And then will call the judge biased unless it's a carnie handed mango man like him.
Avgirl
Well-Known Member
ComplexHiAv8r
Well-Known Member
The mango man is from Kailua, HI.Avgirl said:Never heard the term mango man...first time for everything.
Avgirl
Well-Known Member
Oh, I see. Here I thought they were going to start passing out smoothies at the campaign stops. Food is always persuasive.
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
Are they even looking for this plane anymore?
Avgirl
Well-Known Member
I sure hope so. I just don't understand how it is taking so long.
Cptnchia
Dissatisfied Customer
It was only a NB with "those furreners" on it, and looking like it's not "turrerer" related, so it's not news worthy here.
Hell, Trump even managed to knock Kayne and Kim off the front page!
RDoug
Well-Known Member
Resurrecting this blast from the past for this article:
Traces of explosives found on remains of victims in Egyptair MS804 crash
Traces of explosives found on remains of victims in Egyptair MS804 crash
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
I don't trust the Egyptian authorities ever since daNile of Egypt 990 and refusing to acknowledge Metrojet was blown up. Pieces scattered everywhere for miles and miles and it's "we have no evidence of inflight breakup."
They'll save the national honor first. Everything else (including truth) comes well after - if at all.
In the case of Egypt 990, never.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
Yup:
"
Two Western sources briefed on the investigation expressed reservations about the explosives findings and said a technical cause remained the most likely.
One of the sources said the traces of explosives reportedly found appeared to be identical to samples previously held in stock, whereas there would usually be tiny forensic differences. "
"
Two Western sources briefed on the investigation expressed reservations about the explosives findings and said a technical cause remained the most likely.
One of the sources said the traces of explosives reportedly found appeared to be identical to samples previously held in stock, whereas there would usually be tiny forensic differences. "
A Life Aloft
Well-Known Member
You think that the French would want to readily admit that any type of explosive device may have been loaded onto the aircraft at one of their airports? Oh hell no.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
Opinion piece, but this nails it too:
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...804-why-is-egypt-sitting-on-key-evidence.html
EgyptAir Flight 804: Why Is Egypt Sitting on Key Evidence?
They have had all the black box data and much more for six months and yet their new assertion that explosive traces were found on victims has no supporting analysis.
Once more Egyptian officials have managed to add mystery rather than light to an air crash investigation. The country’s Civil Aviation Ministry said Thursday that traces of explosive have been found on some victims of EgyptAir Flight 804 that dived into the Mediterranean Sea on May 19 this year.
The officials said that they are now launching a criminal investigation into the disaster, which killed 66 people.
This obviously implies an act of terrorism – that a bomb had been planted on board the Airbus A320.
But the brief announcement is an extraordinarily inadequate step in publicly addressing questions of what happened to the flight. The Egyptians must have a great deal more evidence than is revealed by this one statement; they have had six months in which to examine the airplane’s two black boxes, the cockpit voice recorder and flight data recorder.
As well as having retrieved bodies from the crash site deep in the Mediterranean they also have a visual record of the condition of the airplane’s wreckage, and a detailed map of the debris field.
And they also have crucial evidence from seven failure messages sent automatically from the Airbus in the final seconds before it entered its death spiral.
In the case of this disaster the deep sea search for the wreckage was unusually swift and successful, pinpointing the airplane’s position, at a depth of around 9,000 feet, retrieving the flight recorders, making a visual record of key airplane parts, retrieving bodies and completing the mapping of all of the debris all within less than a month of the crash.
This operation, led by the Mauritius-based company DeepOceanSearch, yielded a faster and far more comprehensive picture of the physical condition of the airplane and the invaluable flight recorder data than anyone could have expected. Nothing has been seen like it in previous over-the-water disasters.
And yet only silence has followed.
Contrast this with the case of Air France Flight 447 that disappeared over the southern Atlantic Ocean in 2009. That tragedy happened on June 1 and only a month later, on July 2, French investigators were able to release a preliminary report based only on the evidence gathered from floating debris, 50 bodies and a similar burst of automatic failure messages.
Not only that, but the report was able to give a clear indication of what had caused the disaster, a shutdown of the airplane’s computerized flight controls as a result of a flawed instrument – and this was confirmed two years later when the wreck was located.
So in this case, during those six months that have elapsed since the evidence was retrieved from the Mediterranean, the Egyptians must have been able to fully interrogate the evidence in order to understand what happened – and there are really only two possibilities given the speed of the disaster, an act of terrorism or a technical failure.
We already know from those seven automatic failure messages that a rapid cascade of events played a part in the airplane’s fate. The first two messages indicated an electrical problem in the cockpit window de-icing system. The next was a warning of smoke in the forward toilet immediately behind the cockpit. There was a third warning of a further cockpit window electrical failure and then, far more serious, of a failure of the Flight Control Unit.
What had happened was that the airplane’s electronic “brain” – computers directing its control systems – had for some reason been fried. And the final message, inevitably following that failure, was of the flight controls themselves going crazy – which would explain why air traffic controllers in Greece noted a violent and sudden departure from the Airbus’s cruise altitude of 37,000, feet and a subsequent spiral downwards.
It all happened so fast that the pilots were unable to send a Mayday message.
The other salient missing message in this catastrophe is of any claim by a terrorist group to have been responsible.
The Airbus’s routes in the previous hours had taken it from Asmara, Eritrea, to Cairo, from Cairo to Tunis and from Tunis the Charles de Gaulle airport in Paris.
It’s obvious that any suggestion of foul play immediately turns attention to this route – where could a bomb have been planted without being detected?
The warning of smoke in the forward toilet could indicate a location where a relatively small explosion could be devastating. Not only is it immediately behind the flight deck, but it is also above the electronics bay, where the plane’s brain is vulnerable to a blast from above.
This is, however, difficult to reconcile with the Egyptian announcement of explosive residue found on bodies. (The human remains retrieved during the underwater operations were examined first aboard the ship by medical professionals and then stored in a refrigerator unit.) A small and expertly planted explosive in a toilet would not generate the kind of blast that could leave a trace on passengers seated in the cabin – if the explosion were that powerful it would have ripped open the cabin and that would have been sufficient to cause sudden decompression, whereas the failure messages clearly show that the decisive damage was in the electronics bay.
(On the other hand, if residue was actually on the bodies of the pilots, this would confirm a more targeted explosion, and possibly why there was no Mayday call.)
None of this kind of speculation would be necessary if the Egyptians were confident enough in their evidence to release a preliminary report of the complete forensic analysis they have made.
In fact, they have not even been willing to release the bodies of those who died. France repeatedly has asked that the cadavers be repatriated, repeating the request to the Egyptians again on Thursday, and offering once again to help in the investigation.
Through these long months of confusion and obfuscation, the families of the French victims have grown quite bitter. Stéphane Gicquel, head of a French organization representing the survivors of terrorist attacks and catastrophic accidents, called the Egyptian statement a “manipulation,” a falsification or twisting of the information.
“There is nothing to support the idea of a terrorist trail. It’s extorsion on the part of the Egyptian authorities to make this hypothesis credible and protect EgyptAir by pushing the responsibility back onto Paris.”
The Bureau of Investigations and Analysis (BEA), which did such extraordinary work in the Air France 447 case, greeted the news out of Cairo with circumspection, to say the least: “In the absence of detailed information about the conditions under which samples were taken and the measures that lead to the detection of traces of explosive, the BEA considers that it is not possible at this stage to draw conclusions about the origin of the accident.”
This is another disturbing example of the lack of transparency, contradictory statements and general confusion shown by Egyptian officials following the crash of a Russian-owned Airbus over the Sinai Peninsula in October 2015.
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...804-why-is-egypt-sitting-on-key-evidence.html
EgyptAir Flight 804: Why Is Egypt Sitting on Key Evidence?
They have had all the black box data and much more for six months and yet their new assertion that explosive traces were found on victims has no supporting analysis.
Once more Egyptian officials have managed to add mystery rather than light to an air crash investigation. The country’s Civil Aviation Ministry said Thursday that traces of explosive have been found on some victims of EgyptAir Flight 804 that dived into the Mediterranean Sea on May 19 this year.
The officials said that they are now launching a criminal investigation into the disaster, which killed 66 people.
This obviously implies an act of terrorism – that a bomb had been planted on board the Airbus A320.
But the brief announcement is an extraordinarily inadequate step in publicly addressing questions of what happened to the flight. The Egyptians must have a great deal more evidence than is revealed by this one statement; they have had six months in which to examine the airplane’s two black boxes, the cockpit voice recorder and flight data recorder.
As well as having retrieved bodies from the crash site deep in the Mediterranean they also have a visual record of the condition of the airplane’s wreckage, and a detailed map of the debris field.
And they also have crucial evidence from seven failure messages sent automatically from the Airbus in the final seconds before it entered its death spiral.
In the case of this disaster the deep sea search for the wreckage was unusually swift and successful, pinpointing the airplane’s position, at a depth of around 9,000 feet, retrieving the flight recorders, making a visual record of key airplane parts, retrieving bodies and completing the mapping of all of the debris all within less than a month of the crash.
This operation, led by the Mauritius-based company DeepOceanSearch, yielded a faster and far more comprehensive picture of the physical condition of the airplane and the invaluable flight recorder data than anyone could have expected. Nothing has been seen like it in previous over-the-water disasters.
And yet only silence has followed.
Contrast this with the case of Air France Flight 447 that disappeared over the southern Atlantic Ocean in 2009. That tragedy happened on June 1 and only a month later, on July 2, French investigators were able to release a preliminary report based only on the evidence gathered from floating debris, 50 bodies and a similar burst of automatic failure messages.
Not only that, but the report was able to give a clear indication of what had caused the disaster, a shutdown of the airplane’s computerized flight controls as a result of a flawed instrument – and this was confirmed two years later when the wreck was located.
So in this case, during those six months that have elapsed since the evidence was retrieved from the Mediterranean, the Egyptians must have been able to fully interrogate the evidence in order to understand what happened – and there are really only two possibilities given the speed of the disaster, an act of terrorism or a technical failure.
We already know from those seven automatic failure messages that a rapid cascade of events played a part in the airplane’s fate. The first two messages indicated an electrical problem in the cockpit window de-icing system. The next was a warning of smoke in the forward toilet immediately behind the cockpit. There was a third warning of a further cockpit window electrical failure and then, far more serious, of a failure of the Flight Control Unit.
What had happened was that the airplane’s electronic “brain” – computers directing its control systems – had for some reason been fried. And the final message, inevitably following that failure, was of the flight controls themselves going crazy – which would explain why air traffic controllers in Greece noted a violent and sudden departure from the Airbus’s cruise altitude of 37,000, feet and a subsequent spiral downwards.
It all happened so fast that the pilots were unable to send a Mayday message.
The other salient missing message in this catastrophe is of any claim by a terrorist group to have been responsible.
The Airbus’s routes in the previous hours had taken it from Asmara, Eritrea, to Cairo, from Cairo to Tunis and from Tunis the Charles de Gaulle airport in Paris.
It’s obvious that any suggestion of foul play immediately turns attention to this route – where could a bomb have been planted without being detected?
The warning of smoke in the forward toilet could indicate a location where a relatively small explosion could be devastating. Not only is it immediately behind the flight deck, but it is also above the electronics bay, where the plane’s brain is vulnerable to a blast from above.
This is, however, difficult to reconcile with the Egyptian announcement of explosive residue found on bodies. (The human remains retrieved during the underwater operations were examined first aboard the ship by medical professionals and then stored in a refrigerator unit.) A small and expertly planted explosive in a toilet would not generate the kind of blast that could leave a trace on passengers seated in the cabin – if the explosion were that powerful it would have ripped open the cabin and that would have been sufficient to cause sudden decompression, whereas the failure messages clearly show that the decisive damage was in the electronics bay.
(On the other hand, if residue was actually on the bodies of the pilots, this would confirm a more targeted explosion, and possibly why there was no Mayday call.)
None of this kind of speculation would be necessary if the Egyptians were confident enough in their evidence to release a preliminary report of the complete forensic analysis they have made.
In fact, they have not even been willing to release the bodies of those who died. France repeatedly has asked that the cadavers be repatriated, repeating the request to the Egyptians again on Thursday, and offering once again to help in the investigation.
Through these long months of confusion and obfuscation, the families of the French victims have grown quite bitter. Stéphane Gicquel, head of a French organization representing the survivors of terrorist attacks and catastrophic accidents, called the Egyptian statement a “manipulation,” a falsification or twisting of the information.
“There is nothing to support the idea of a terrorist trail. It’s extorsion on the part of the Egyptian authorities to make this hypothesis credible and protect EgyptAir by pushing the responsibility back onto Paris.”
The Bureau of Investigations and Analysis (BEA), which did such extraordinary work in the Air France 447 case, greeted the news out of Cairo with circumspection, to say the least: “In the absence of detailed information about the conditions under which samples were taken and the measures that lead to the detection of traces of explosive, the BEA considers that it is not possible at this stage to draw conclusions about the origin of the accident.”
This is another disturbing example of the lack of transparency, contradictory statements and general confusion shown by Egyptian officials following the crash of a Russian-owned Airbus over the Sinai Peninsula in October 2015.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
6 months later and haven't repatriated the bodies. No CVR transcript release. No FDR data analysis released.
You can't trust the Egyptian aviation authorities, time and time again without fail. Egypt Air 990 was suicide (NTSB) and according to the Egyptians it was a elevator/control failure.
MetroJet didn't get blown out of the sky, because there's no evidence of an inflight breakup - Egyptians . Flash Airlines 737 crash was inconclusive - but offered 4 theories. The west nailed it down to spatial disorientation.
You can't trust the Egyptian aviation authorities, time and time again without fail. Egypt Air 990 was suicide (NTSB) and according to the Egyptians it was a elevator/control failure.
MetroJet didn't get blown out of the sky, because there's no evidence of an inflight breakup - Egyptians . Flash Airlines 737 crash was inconclusive - but offered 4 theories. The west nailed it down to spatial disorientation.
NovemberEcho
Dergs favorite member
What's one more plague to Egyptians?
touch-n-go
Well-Known Member
Wow! Looks like they are saying cigarette smoking by one of the pilots in the cockpit, caused a fire, due to a leaky oxygen mask in the cockpit, which brought down EgyptAir 804. In classical Egyptian fashion, the Egyptian officials want to deny the findings just like they did with 990. I will never fly on Egypt air as they never seem to want to admit any fault with any of their accidents and hence never fix their issues...
www.dailymail.co.uk
'Pilot's cigarette sparked blaze on EgyptAir jet that crashed in 2016'
Flight MS804 was bound from Paris's Charles de Gaulle airport to Cairo, but plunged into the sea between Crete and the northern coast of Egypt after disappearing from radars on May 19, 2016.
GypsyPilot
Mohawk Town
Egypt seems like an absolute dump. These guys were documenting the food scene in Egypt, and went through hell due to all of the government stooges in that country:
ChasenSFO
hen teaser
Seriously? So this is where the last 2 decades have gotten Egypt, right back where they started with MSR990. I'd rather have Pakistan's approach of just openly not bothering to investigate some accidents over putting families through an 8 year wait for this...
It has shocked me since both this accident and the Metrojet A321 bombings how very little we have heard about the 2 events and the safety of Egyptian Airlines and airports...and, you know, the fact a bomb got on a plane at freggin CDG in 2016.
Disgraceful.
It has shocked me since both this accident and the Metrojet A321 bombings how very little we have heard about the 2 events and the safety of Egyptian Airlines and airports...and, you know, the fact a bomb got on a plane at freggin CDG in 2016.
Disgraceful.
NovemberEcho
Dergs favorite member
reddit threads about tourism in Egypt are always entertaining. I’d love to see the pyramids but Egypt just doesn’t sound like it’s worth the hassle, especially if you’re a woman.