Don't Snap Roll A Hawker

[hook_dupin]

Of the over 70 types in my logbook, I have aileron rolled most of them, completely around, 360 degrees. To aerobatic types, a roll goes all the way around....

Ok. Simply put: that's horrible judgement. The only types you should be doing this in are certificated aerobatic aircraft.

I used to not think that way. I used to think "Oh Bob Hoover demonstrated barrel rolls in a Beech while pouring coffee. These maneuvers are incredibly benign." Well, not everybody agrees with that sentiment and their ability to destroy your career is quite high. Someone could easily argue that what you are doing is putting the aircraft in an attitude not necessary for normal flight (part of the 91.303 definition for "aerobatic") . The reward of successfully accomplishing a barrel roll in a non-aerobatic aircraft: a smile and a "remember when" story. The risk of getting caught: your career, certificate action, and quite a bit of future potential earnings. It's completely not worth it.

 

[Groundpounder]

So they hired a guy without the certificates and ratings to fly an airplane for them. And they were surprised this happened?
I'm putting this on the owner for being a cheap sob. Looks like it costs less to hire professionals.

Throw "Don Wittington" and "World Jet" into google, and you'll have a few hours of entertainment.

 

[Groundpounder]

Of the over 70 types in my logbook, I have aileron rolled most of them, completely around, 360 degrees. To aerobatic types, a roll goes all the way around....

Give us some examples of the aircraft you've rolled.

 

[hook_dupin]

Ok. Simply put: that's horrible judgement. The only types you should be doing this are certificated aerobatic aircraft.

To be completely correct, I should add experimental and exhibition categories to the list....

 

[Inverted]

Ok. Simply put: that's horrible judgement. The only types you should be doing this are certificated aerobatic aircraft.

I used to not think that way. I used to think "Oh Bob Hoover demonstrated barrel rolls in a Beech while pouring coffee. These maneuvers are incredibly benign." Well, not everybody agrees with that sentiment and their ability to destroy your career is quite high. Someone could easily argue that what you are doing is putting the aircraft in an attitude not necessary for normal flight (part of the 91.303 definition for "aerobatic") . The reward of successfully accomplishing a barrel roll in a non-aerobatic aircraft: a smile and a "remember when" story. The risk getting caught: your career, certificate action, and quite a bit of future potential earnings. It's completely not worth it.

Thanks for the lesson. Let me guess, your introduction to spins was in a 172 for your CFI, and that is the only aerobatic maneuver you have ever done. Am I correct? You have demonstrated a lack of knowledge and understanding. I would like you to explain to me since you know, what forces act on an airplane that would make it anything other than benign during a constant G roll? Who ever said I did anything to risk my career?

 

[Inverted]

Give us some examples of the aircraft you've rolled.

Check your PM.

 

[hook_dupin]

Thanks for the lesson. Let me guess, your introduction to spins was in a 172 for your CFI, and that is the only aerobatic maneuver you have ever done. Am I correct? You have demonstrated a lack of knowledge and understanding. I would like you to explain to me since you know, what forces act on an airplane that would make it anything other than benign during a constant G roll? Who ever said I did anything to risk my career?

You are not correct. I have significantly more experience than you think I do, and I will leave it at that.

 

[Ash Williams]

I think some people on here are rolling joints.

 

[Roger Roger]

I think inverted tROLLin. Also I'm surprised that no one has brought up the airnet Lear crew that totaled a 35 dropping it out the bottom of a "barrel" roll.

 

[Goonie]

I knew a guy who did rolls in a non aerobatic airplane.

He's dead now. I'm sure he probably wanted a reset button on his way down still strapped to the seat as the plane broke apart in midair.

Don't really shed a tear for him. Unfortunately he took two innocents with him that didn't know any better.

Anyone that does aerobatics in non certified planes please just do it single pilot. Don't bring anyone else to your smoking hole.

Not calling you out @Inverted. All the 70 planes could have been certified for aerobatics. If not, well, good luck I guess. Just don't pretend you're Hoover with people on board.

 

[xargos]

Highly doubtful and just fun internet banter. The only places the snap roll theory exists is on internet forums, no official news sources report it.

The damage is much more conducive to a hard landing.

Here's a photo of another aircraft that made a hard landing.

It should gain a few knots in cruise, like dimpled golf balls.

 

[mshunter]

Thanks for the lesson. Let me guess, your introduction to spins was in a 172 for your CFI, and that is the only aerobatic maneuver you have ever done. Am I correct? You have demonstrated a lack of knowledge and understanding. I would like you to explain to me since you know, what forces act on an airplane that would make it anything other than benign during a constant G roll? Who ever said I did anything to risk my career?

While you are totally correct about a constant G roll, openly admitting to rolling nearly everything you have ever flown is not a very good idea, well, because you are openly admitting to breaking regs, and flaunting it. It may be perfectly safe, but it surely isn't very wise.

Is a Lear 55 certificated for aerobatics (I have a type from CAE in one, LR-JET)? Because that's what you are admitting to, on a public forum, in front of your piers and possible future employers and co-workers. Knowing that, were I to own an airplane, I'd never hire you, let alone allow you to touch it, because I now see you as a liability. And like I said, it may be perfectly safe, doing rolls in a Lear, or whatever you have your hands on now or previous, isn't legal, and that makes you a liability in two ways. #1, I could send you off to training and 3 months later you get caught somehow and your certificates revoked, so I just wasted all that time and money on your training. #2, you are exposing me and my company to potential legal issues should you roll and make a mistake, ending up in someone's backyard/house, all caught on film in a "hey y'all, watch this" moment.

Were I out doing those kinds of things, I'd shut the 'eff up about it reeeeaaaaaalllll quick. I am willing to bet you don't have the feds approval to be out doing those kinds of things. It is not part of a "normal flight" and thus, would be considered aerobatics. A steep climb, low pass, or sharp turn could, and has, resulted in certificate action against pilots in the past, and will still do so in the future.

In other words, now is your chance to put down the shovel. You can't put that dirt over there back in now, but you can certainly not add to the pile of it, and the size of the hole you are digging.

 

[Champcar]

I find it ironic the dude with a MossY avatar just admitted to rolling over 70 aircraft (no way they are all aerobatic).. When is your youtube channel debuting?

Sorry but there is nothing impressive about an alerion roll. Its like the guy who owns a new Mustang, thinks its cool but no one really cares.

 

[scooter2525]

I have rolled just about everything I have flown, which is a significant amount. I highly, highly doubt that this Hawker was snap rolled. Even aerobatic airplanes receive damage from snap rolls, it is on of, if not the most aggressive maneuver you can do to an aircraft. Granted you don't have the severe gyroscopic issues that you get with recip aircraft, but the instant G load increase wouldn't cause a fuselage to wrinkle, it would snap the wings off. Aileron rolls and barrel rolls are very gentle on an aircraft, and if you keep slight positive G, you can do a roll with your eyes closed and it feels like you are flying strait and level.

I haven't rolled any types that I've flown.

Your move.

 

[derg]

Do not roll non-aerobatic airplanes.

I have too many dead friends that did ridiculous crap in airplanes.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I have rolled just about everything I have flown, which is a significant amount.

 

[DPApilot]

Heh. And you guys think I post stupid stuff online?

 

[deadstick]

Heh. And you guys think I post stupid stuff online?

No, but didn't you roll an MD80?

 

[SpiceWeasel]

Heh. And you guys think I post stupid stuff online?

Did you christen another hot tub?

 

[mikecweb]