Colgan ALPA ?
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Rocketman99
Frozen Guppy Manipulator
WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!I guess those that didn't vote or voted no are gonna learn the hard way and will be prayin for the next ALPA vote if there is one! Sorry guys!
Get that TPIC and ge the hell out of Dodge, before the #### hits the fan.
YGBSM!!! I'm still waiting for someone to post that this was all a bad joke and the drive really didn't fail. Geez. We're all <insert expletive here> now. Thanks a lot to all those that didn't vote "because it'll pass no problem." Unbelievable.
Seggy
Well-Known Member
Well, what can I say, we lost by four votes. There are a few things I do know.
1) Sitting in the room with Mary F. was the Pinnacle President Buddy Casey. He had a big smile on his face when the results were announced. Prepare for the whipsaw!
2) Spoke to the Pinnacle ALPA MEC chair. He is a great guy and WILL protect HIS pilots who are members of ALPA.
3) Need to wait a full year to file for another vote for representation.
4) The guys that voted no or didn't vote have NO right to complain about ANYTHING that is going to happen at this company. If you don't like it, change it through the open lines of communication the company says we have.
5) ALPA is a top notch organization. They are needed in this industry. I have met some lifelong friends over there, sorry I couldn't deliever the results.
6) The guys of jetcareers at Colgan are stand up guys and have character. I know the guys on here voted yes and were sincere in their support of ALPA.
1) Sitting in the room with Mary F. was the Pinnacle President Buddy Casey. He had a big smile on his face when the results were announced. Prepare for the whipsaw!
2) Spoke to the Pinnacle ALPA MEC chair. He is a great guy and WILL protect HIS pilots who are members of ALPA.
3) Need to wait a full year to file for another vote for representation.
4) The guys that voted no or didn't vote have NO right to complain about ANYTHING that is going to happen at this company. If you don't like it, change it through the open lines of communication the company says we have.
5) ALPA is a top notch organization. They are needed in this industry. I have met some lifelong friends over there, sorry I couldn't deliever the results.
6) The guys of jetcareers at Colgan are stand up guys and have character. I know the guys on here voted yes and were sincere in their support of ALPA.
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
Honestly ALPA would have hindered the entire concept of Colgan. Colgan is, and always has, been a place to upgrade quick and get out. Look at the Colganites on here. Upgraded in a year. People were still on reserve as F/O's at my company after a year.
The whipsaw will actually be good for the Colgan people. They will be the ones getting the flying. ALPA is good for the majors but in reality it's tough having a "good" contract at a contract carrier. My $0.02. Sorry the drive didn't come thru though, I know people put a lot of effort into it. Hey, look at the bright side, at least you got free pizza!
The whipsaw will actually be good for the Colgan people. They will be the ones getting the flying. ALPA is good for the majors but in reality it's tough having a "good" contract at a contract carrier. My $0.02. Sorry the drive didn't come thru though, I know people put a lot of effort into it. Hey, look at the bright side, at least you got free pizza!
Seggy
Well-Known Member
Ahh, how is it good that we are going to be whipsawed and 'getting flying' with substandard wages and workrules?
How do we know how much longer we will be at Colgan? Can't bank on it to get in and get out.
Also XJT, Comair, Air Wisconsin, ASA, and Mesaba have all had good contracts.
How do we know how much longer we will be at Colgan? Can't bank on it to get in and get out.
Also XJT, Comair, Air Wisconsin, ASA, and Mesaba have all had good contracts.
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
No, but *most* people that went to Colgan went there for one of several reasons. One was outstation basing. The other was a quick upgrade. The latter is probably why 75% of new hires go there would be my guess.
Also, your wages aren't so substandard. They're pretty much inline or above for the equipment IMO, save for the Q400 which still beats out Lynx.
I know it's frustrating, but honestly, get your TPIC time and leave for a company like Netjets while you wait for a major to call. At least you have the option. It sucks just as much being at a company that really has no financial viability after another 5 years or so, and with long upgrades.
You added this, so I'll respond too:
Lost 25% of their codeshare. Placed aircraft under own-risk flying with Delta. Started their own branded flying to find a home for the remaining a/c. Losing $$ hand over fist.
Not so much anymore, they got screwed with the bankruptcy case.
Concessionary contract. Bid on 90 seat flying with current 50 seat rate, and lost. No where in the ballpark for competitive. <8 years left on the US Air contract.
SkyWest's whipsaw. They'll shrink while SkyWest grows.
Contract gutted after the sham bankruptcy. Upgrade was 6+ years. Now with lower rates they are obtaining a boatload of flying and upgrading quickly.
H46Bubba
Well-Known Member
Seggy, did the AAA pilots have a big impact on the vote? I know they're trying to kick ALPA to the curb. I know you guys jumpseat on them a lot, so there was plenty of opportunity for a lot of unhappy AAA pilots to give their $.02 to a lot of persuadable Colganites. I don't thing the entire worlds supply of KY could help you guys for the next year. Steven what's the response like over at PNCL?
Steven what's the response like over at PNCL?
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Wow. I feel like I've been punched in the gut there.
Glad to know that us getting beat down during contract negotiations is gonna be good for someone, though.....
BobDDuck
Island Bus Driver
You know better then that. You did just about everything you could as did the other guys on the OC. Something about leading a horse to water...
wheelsup
Well-Known Member
I don't like it, but don't you hate sunshine being blown up your butt? Reality is reality.
Don't you guys technically still "own" the Colgan flying? I suppose one way to get around it is for Pinnacle to keep both companies run separately.
Baronman
Well-Known Member
I'd say less than 75% go for a quick upgrade. Maybe that's what they say as one of the few if any benefits of going to get Colganized. Two friends I have who recently went there didn't have the time to go to be competitive at other companies. Both had less than 400hrs total time and both went to interview at Colgan.
With regard to XJT, our company has never, despite all the changes recently even mentioned the word "concessions." If this were SKWY or Colgan I'm sure we would be getting them assigned to us.
We also lost money this quarter, as you say "hand over fist." I guess you haven't seen or choose not to understand the expenditures that have taken place to establish and basically diversify the customer base. Additional employees, capital expenditures, etc are all investments in the companies future. These things are needed to secure our future. And the pilots still are enjoying a good contract. If the majority of guys at SKWY or COLGAN had some stones, they could put some money in their pockets.
I'm not even a huge ALPA fan, but COLGAN seems like exactly the type of place that could benefit. And now more than ever that they were bought and have larger equipment on the way. I hope they don't feel the whipsaw but if crap starts flowing their way, I'll just shrug my shoulders and say you guys had a golden chance. You blew it.
Seggy
Well-Known Member
75% of the guys are here because they couldn't go anywere else with the time they had when hired.
We have no workrules, haven't had a raise in seven years.
You said that most companies who provide contract lift can't get a good contract. I pointed out companies that have in the past ten year had good contracts. That was the point I was trying to make. If we have places like Colgan that can be used to whipsaw every carrier out there with substandard rates and work rules then how can we raise the bar in this industry.
Seggy, did the AAA pilots have a big impact on the vote? I know they're trying to kick ALPA to the curb. I know you guys jumpseat on them a lot, so there was plenty of opportunity for a lot of unhappy AAA pilots to give their $.02 to a lot of persuadable Colganites. I don't thing the entire worlds supply of KY could help you guys for the next year.
The AAA guys were actually pretty good to our guys. They were saying, "ALPA is needed at a company like yours and what is going on."
:yeahthat:
Velocipede
New Member
Unbelievable! You ACTUALLY believe that a whipsaw is good for ANYONE in aviation? How about a glance at the big picture, slick. If it works on one property, it will spread to others. Let's see how you feel when your company starts an alter-ego and whipsaws YOU.
It is unfathomable to me that someone who holds this opinion was actually smart enough to get through flight training. :banghead:
TVB
Well-Known Member
Wow, 4 votes. That stings. One thing I know is that it wasn't a reflection of the work the guys at the OC put into this. Thanks for the hard work even though we didn't get the results we wanted.
Say what you will about the pilots that go to colgan, but a good contract here means a better one at the comairs, and skywests, and even mainline. But now look what happens when we have no union and crappy pay rates come out on the Q, Lynx starts up with even worse rates. If we had a good contract and good rates announced on the Q do you think Lynx would announce so low payscales? I don't.
I hope you guys at pinnacle don't get whipsawed now, and i hope we don't get stapled to the bottom of your seniority lists. And I really hope you don't take our flying away
But we'll have to wait and see now
Say what you will about the pilots that go to colgan, but a good contract here means a better one at the comairs, and skywests, and even mainline. But now look what happens when we have no union and crappy pay rates come out on the Q, Lynx starts up with even worse rates. If we had a good contract and good rates announced on the Q do you think Lynx would announce so low payscales? I don't.
I hope you guys at pinnacle don't get whipsawed now, and i hope we don't get stapled to the bottom of your seniority lists. And I really hope you don't take our flying away
But we'll have to wait and see now
Snuggle
Well-Known Member
I've only been here a short time and I already know the union could have only helped us. I couldn't really see anything bad coming from a union at Colgan. We needed one bad.
I went from being really happy to be working here to the total opposite lately. The way we get treated here is just not right.
I went from being really happy to be working here to the total opposite lately. The way we get treated here is just not right.
Velocipede
New Member
Come on, Snuggle. Don't you know a whipsaw is GOOD for you?