CFI Training and Checkride Write Up - SDL FSDO

[Ziggyfuzz]

Congratulations!

I dont get the 'airport diagram' thing... where does it state a taxi diagram is required, and furthermore where does the FAA even provide one outside of approach plates, which obviously aren't required for VFR flight? The AFD diagrams aren't detailed enough to use for taxi. Where do they pull these requirements from? I do use approach plate diagrams as a matter of habit even VFR because I find them handy, but hearing about junk like this popping up as being important for examiner-so-and-so drives me nuts.

Anyone can get one for any airport for free on duats, flitghtplan.com etc. Just watch for the new PTS coming out starting with trickle down from CFI, then PPL, then others to follow, there will be a new task specifically dealing with runway/taxi incursions. It has been recommended by the FAA by advisory circular AC 91-73, which will soon be updated as well, that all pilots have a "10-9" or airport diagram out for taxi operations. I am a part time DE and this is something that at the time I cannot, and would not, bust an applicant for on a checkride, however I will counsel them on where to find it and that they should be using it. After all, isn't it part of flight planning? Knowing where you're going?

 

[Ziggyfuzz]

Anyone can get one for any airport for free on duats, flitghtplan.com etc. Just watch for the new PTS coming out starting with trickle down from CFI, then PPL, then others to follow, there will be a new task specifically dealing with runway/taxi incursions. It has been recommended by the FAA by advisory circular AC 91-73, which will soon be updated as well, that all pilots have a "10-9" or airport diagram out for taxi operations. I am a part time DE and this is something that at the time I cannot, and would not, bust an applicant for on a checkride, however I will counsel them on where to find it and that they should be using it. After all, isn't it part of flight planning? Knowing where you're going?

Here is an excerpt from AC 91-73A, soon to be replaced by 91-73B as I got word from FAA this week....

"g. Taxiing.
This paragraph will not discuss speed management or maneuvering the aircraft,
but will suggest some good practices regarding other cockpit activities during taxi.
(1) Prior to taxiing, a copy of the airport diagram should be available for use by the
flightcrew.
(a) If you are operating a single-pilot aircraft, follow the aircraft’s progress on the
airport diagram to ensure that you are following the instructions received from ATC.
(b) For aircraft that require more than one pilot, a flight crewmember other than the
pilot taxiing the aircraft should follow the aircraft’s progress on the airport diagram to ensure
that the instructions received from ATC are being followed."

 

[Hacker15e]

Thanks for the nice writeup on your experiences.

Watching and critiquing students can be a difficult skill to acquire and I overlooked this portion of CFI training before going through it.

Do you mean that you didn't spend much time during your training doing this, and that it was a challenge on the checkride?

 

[Ziggyfuzz]

Then it would be IFR and still no. since IFR is <1000' and/or 1-3SM; MVFR is 1000'-3000' and/or 3-5SM. Then one must fallow the basic VFR weather mins in 91.155 and fallow

91.157
(a) Except as provided in appendix D, section 3, of this part, special VFR operations may be conducted under the weather minimums and requirements of this section, instead of those contained in §91.155, below 10,000 feet MSL within the airspace contained by the upward extension of the lateral boundaries of the controlled airspace designated to the surface for an airport.
(b) Special VFR operations may only be conducted—
(1) With an ATC clearance;
(2) Clear of clouds;
(3) Except for helicopters, when flight visibility is at least 1 statute mile; and
(4) Except for helicopters, between sunrise and sunset (or in Alaska, when the sun is 6 degrees or more below the horizon) unless—
(i) The person being granted the ATC clearance meets the applicable requirements for instrument flight under part 61 of this chapter; and
(ii) The aircraft is equipped as required in §91.205(d).
(c) No person may take off or land an aircraft (other than a helicopter) under special VFR—
(1) Unless ground visibility is at least 1 statute mile; or
(2) If ground visibility is not reported, unless flight visibility is at least 1 statute mile. For the purposes of this paragraph, the term flight visibility includes the visibility from the cockpit of an aircraft in takeoff position if:
(i) The flight is conducted under this part 91; and
(ii) The airport at which the aircraft is located is a satellite airport that does not have weather reporting capabilities.
(d) The determination of visibility by a pilot in accordance with paragraph (c)(2) of this section is not an official weather report or an official ground visibility report.

:yeahthat:

 

[Shiner]

Do you mean that you didn't spend much time during your training doing this, and that it was a challenge on the checkride?

When initially thinking about the flight training costs for the CFI, I though the majority of time would be spent getting used to the right seat. After seeing my "student" do a few maneuvers, I realized it can be difficult to see exactly what they need to fix and critiquing in a tactful way. It wasn't an issue by checkride time. Still waiting on my first real student, so we'll see how that goes.

 

[MikeD]

Anyone can get one for any airport for free on duats, flitghtplan.com etc. Just watch for the new PTS coming out starting with trickle down from CFI, then PPL, then others to follow, there will be a new task specifically dealing with runway/taxi incursions. It has been recommended by the FAA by advisory circular AC 91-73, which will soon be updated as well, that all pilots have a "10-9" or airport diagram out for taxi operations. I am a part time DE and this is something that at the time I cannot, and would not, bust an applicant for on a checkride, however I will counsel them on where to find it and that they should be using it. After all, isn't it part of flight planning? Knowing where you're going?

I wouldn't bust someone for not having a taxi diagram. It depends on if the PIC needs it, and thats a *gasp* judgement call the PIC needs to make. Departing or landing at KLAX, KORD, or many multi-runway airports? I'd agree it'd be smart to have a taxi diagram along with having pre-studied and at least gained a basic knowledge of what's where at the airport before going there. Or, if say diverting there, then of course a taxi diagram would be smart. But lets get real too, would someone REALLY need a taxi diagram out for, say, the below airport? With "one crewmember following the aircraft's progress"? Really?

http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/1110/05034AD.PDF

 

[Hacker15e]

When initially thinking about the flight training costs for the CFI, I though the majority of time would be spent getting used to the right seat. After seeing my "student" do a few maneuvers, I realized it can be difficult to see exactly what they need to fix and critiquing in a tactful way. It wasn't an issue by checkride time. Still waiting on my first real student, so we'll see how that goes.

Your statement just made me wonder how much of that in-flight assessment of student performance and in-flight instruction was part of your training. Many writeups I've seen regarding CFI checkrides make it appear that the focus is on pre-flight instruction and in-flight demonstration, and your comment sort of sounded like it agreed with that...but apparently not. Not a criticism, just interested in knowing how CFI training works in the FAA world.

Thanks!

 

[Ziggyfuzz]

I wouldn't bust someone for not having a taxi diagram. It depends on if the PIC needs it, and thats a *gasp* judgement call the PIC needs to make. Departing or landing at KLAX, KORD, or many multi-runway airports? I'd agree it'd be smart to have a taxi diagram along with having pre-studied and at least gained a basic knowledge of what's where at the airport before going there. Or, if say diverting there, then of course a taxi diagram would be smart. But lets get real too, would someone REALLY need a taxi diagram out for, say, the below airport? With "one crewmember following the aircraft's progress"? Really?

http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/1110/05034AD.PDF

I guess it all depends on the circumstances. First time there, maybe as an aid to a progressive, otherwise....not!! I also remember my 121 days, 10-9 was always out, even when we knew by heart the "south route" at LAX. I also would hate to see a single pilot with his head between his knees, miss a turn or something else because he had his nose stuck in a taxi diagram! Theres never one fix that will apply to every single situation! IMHO...

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