BE58 Configuration (ILS)

[MikeOH58]

TItle says it all...How do you configure Baron when shooting an approach...Person teaching me the aircraft wants me approach flaps and 120 knots up till FAF. Drop Gear at Glide Slope Intercept and fly approach at 110. Mixtures and Props full at 500 feet.

I don't agree with waiting to drop the gear at glideslope intercept, and I certainly don't agree with the mixtures and props being touched at 500 feet (opposed to DH).

Aside from being a little louder, does anyone see any issue with props being full at the start of the approach, rather than putting them full if going missed?

 

[jml2992]

The company I work for trains in the Baron and that may color how I have been taught to fly it but we are taught to do the landing procedure (Mixture, Props, Cowl Flaps) just after crossing the FAF on an ILS or before begining a descent from turning inbound on a non-precision approach that has no FAF. Gear down timing on a precision approach is set 1 dot below glide slope intercept and we fly the approach at 100 kts with flaps 15. Flaps are set at 15 when you are vectored on base and course alive or after localizer alive on the intercept. Again, this is just how we were taught to instruct our trainees but I think even in most of my meager 200 hrs of 135 freight experience, our company had us gear down and props full forward just after the FAF but that was a turbine aircraft. I've never heard of anyone not putting the props full forward until just before DH though. With most of the power settings required to keep those airspeeds on a 3-degreee path, I would guess props full forward or not wouldn't make much difference on the sound/noise abatement because of the your manifold pressure is out of the prop governing range and the props set on the detent anyway but I would much rather have them ready for the go around long before I got to DH. Just my experience and I'm sure you have a reason for doing it the way you do it.

 

[shdw]

Aside from being a little louder, does anyone see any issue with props being full at the start of the approach, rather than putting them full if going missed?

Well you said 500' on an ILS, which usually has a missed at 200'. IMO I don't see a problem in the procedure. I am curious what it is that you have a problem with in this case?

Putting props full earlier, likely at a higher power setting than at that 500' point, would require more delicacy to avoid overspeed. Aside from that I don't see a problem with either procedure.

The only possible problem I foresee is if you always had your props/mixture full earlier, in the previous aircraft you have flown, you might forget to put them full if you do a go-around prior to the 500' point.

 

[dasleben]

TItle says it all...How do you configure Baron when shooting an approach...Person teaching me the aircraft wants me approach flaps and 120 knots up till FAF. Drop Gear at Glide Slope Intercept and fly approach at 110. Mixtures and Props full at 500 feet.

I don't agree with waiting to drop the gear at glideslope intercept, and I certainly don't agree with the mixtures and props being touched at 500 feet (opposed to DH).

Aside from being a little louder, does anyone see any issue with props being full at the start of the approach, rather than putting them full if going missed?

What's redline? Fly that. Just kidding. Kinda.

Disclaimer: I don't fly a Baron, but I can weigh in about the props/mixtures. The mixtures are absolutely fine to be pushed up far out. You're not going to hurt anything that way. But, I really wouldn't put the props forward all the way out at the FAF. You can, but it's obnoxious and might cause some extra wear on the governors (unfounded).

Company profile where I'm at is props to full when the props come off the governing range. Up until then we're on the approach at 2450 RPM, which is much nicer on the ears and easier to sync. We may push the props to full as low as 10' (yes, ten feet) if that's when the props come off the governor. Nothing wrong with that technique either. If you need to go around before that, you just have to make a concentrated effort to go mixtures-props-throttles. That'll take care of any issues beyond that.

Gear is typically dropped whenever the hell I feel like it; as long as I have the gear down, have flaps 15 set, and am Vref+15 or less by 1000' AGL, it's considered stable. On a visual I drop the gear right around a 4 mile final. On an ILS it's usually 5 miles. All good.

 

[ackeight]

If you want to fly the baron the Airnet way who has hundreds of thousands of hours of baron pilots flying then this is their profile.

-3 miles from FAF flaps approach 150KIAS slowing to 120
-FAF Gear down 120KIAS slowing to blue line. Leave the props/mixture alone from cruise config
-Go around at DA mixtures props throttle full forward.

That is just the normal ILS. The high speed is what you guessed it would be. Faster.

 

[T2on2y]

I completed initial Baron 58 at flight safety last month, and they teach approach flaps when on vectors slow to 120kts. At gs intercept drop gear 16'' mp and 120kts. If going missed just full throttle leave props at 2500 or on short final full flaps, mix, prop.

 

[ppragman]

If you want to fly the baron the Airnet way who has hundreds of thousands of hours of baron pilots flying then this is their profile.

-3 miles from FAF flaps approach 150KIAS slowing to 120
-FAF Gear down 120KIAS slowing to blue line. Leave the props/mixture alone from cruise config
-Go around at DA mixtures props throttle full forward.

That is just the normal ILS. The high speed is what you guessed it would be. Faster.

That seems to be the most reasonable to me, if you're flying passengers too, they get nervous when there are loud sudden sound changes (ie pushing the props forward) so I always try to wait to do that sort of thing. Preferably, you'd be able to wait until you were off of the governor in general to push the props forward.

Hit DA, then like always, right to left, "mixtures props throttle" and you'll be fine.

 

[minitour]

Flaps at the marker, gear 1000' AGL. Flaps to land when you're landing.

Cross the marker with the flaps coming to approach and 150, hit DH at blue line.

Mixtures, props, throttles (that order) for a missed approach. If you don't need all of that gas and climb power (like if you're landing) don't screw with it.

-mini

 

[Douglas]

If you want to fly the baron the Airnet way who has hundreds of thousands of hours of baron pilots flying then this is their profile.

-3 miles from FAF flaps approach 150KIAS slowing to 120
-FAF Gear down 120KIAS slowing to blue line. Leave the props/mixture alone from cruise config
-Go around at DA mixtures props throttle full forward.

That is just the normal ILS. The high speed is what you guessed it would be. Faster.

This our profile too, though instead of blue line, we go for about 105.

 

[beechpilot]

We configure for the flap/gear speed about 3 miles from the FAF, then over the FAF it's approach flaps and gear down. On about a 2 mile final we go to full flaps and about 105 for the speed.

 

[boondr]

What's redline? Fly that. Just kidding. Kinda.

Disclaimer: I don't fly a Baron, but I can weigh in about the props/mixtures. The mixtures are absolutely fine to be pushed up far out. You're not going to hurt anything that way. But, I really wouldn't put the props forward all the way out at the FAF. You can, but it's obnoxious and might cause some extra wear on the governors (unfounded).

Company profile where I'm at is props to full when the props come off the governing range. Up until then we're on the approach at 2450 RPM, which is much nicer on the ears and easier to sync. We may push the props to full as low as 10' (yes, ten feet) if that's when the props come off the governor. Nothing wrong with that technique either. If you need to go around before that, you just have to make a concentrated effort to go mixtures-props-throttles. That'll take care of any issues beyond that.

Gear is typically dropped whenever the hell I feel like it; as long as I have the gear down, have flaps 15 set, and am Vref+15 or less by 1000' AGL, it's considered stable. On a visual I drop the gear right around a 4 mile final. On an ILS it's usually 5 miles. All good.

We need you at 170 kts to the marker!

 

[dasleben]

Flaps at the marker, gear 1000' AGL. Flaps to land when you're landing.

Cross the marker with the flaps coming to approach and 150, hit DH at blue line.

Mixtures, props, throttles (that order) for a missed approach. If you don't need all of that gas and climb power (like if you're landing) don't screw with it.

-mini

I like your style, Commodore.

We need you at 170 kts to the marker!

Not a problem! We can usually give you faster for longer than that anyway. Trying to get some of your comrades to figure that out though. I'm sick of getting spun around for the jets, then getting told to slow way down once the controller figures out that the 737 has slowed to 140 and we're still doing 180. Not to mention, once we start downhill at 170+ it takes a while to slow back down to 140-150 when we're still descending. We have to stage cool the turbos in the descent.

 

[MikeOH58]

Mini/Doug, what mani setting are you using for 101/105? 16" more or less holds 120 perfectly...

Regarding mixtures. Are you saying your landing with whatever mixture setting you leaned for in cruise? Not increasing at all during the descent?

Would any airnet pilot have a copy of their maneuver manual handy?

 

[derg]

I haven't touched a mixture control in over a decade, not sure why you're asking me!

 

[Douglas]

Mini/Doug, what mani setting are you using for 101/105? 16" more or less holds 120 perfectly...

Regarding mixtures. Are you saying your landing with whatever mixture setting you leaned for in cruise? Not increasing at all during the descent?

Would any airnet pilot have a copy of their maneuver manual handy?

16" (Bottom of green arc) and 2300 RPM. It works well for us.
Pretty much correct on the mixtures, but I fiddle with them a little, sometimes.

 

[dasleben]

Is the BE58 turbo, or no?

 

[minitour]

I like your style, Commodore.

I didn't make it up...I just flew it. Pretty sure that was it anyway. The high speed anyway.

Mini/Doug, what mani setting are you using for 101/105? 16" more or less holds 120 perfectly...

Not sure. Probably something in the 14-16 range depending on conditions.

Regarding mixtures. Are you saying your landing with whatever mixture setting you leaned for in cruise? Not increasing at all during the descent?

Exactly.

Would any airnet pilot have a copy of their maneuver manual handy?

I have one at home, but I won't be home for another 2 weeks.

Is the BE58 turbo, or no?

Just a "stock" BE58? No.

-mini

 

[ackeight]

Flaps at the marker, gear 1000' AGL. Flaps to land when you're landing.

Cross the marker with the flaps coming to approach and 150, hit DH at blue line.

Mixtures, props, throttles (that order) for a missed approach. If you don't need all of that gas and climb power (like if you're landing) don't screw with it.

-mini

Yup that's the high speeder, and what I do most of the time unless it's very low mins.

 

[EIR]

App flaps and gear @ the marker or a hair before. Full flaps when I commit to the landing.

 

[cmill]

well, i use the same setup for any aircraft i fly, and it all depends on the ceiling/vis.

If i expect to take the p[lane down to 1/2 a mile, im gonna get it landing config. If im gonna break out 3 miles out, why slow it down so much?

As far as the mixture goes, theres no reason not to put it full forward. As far as props, they're obnoxious, and i can count on one finger the times ive had to go missed, and zero fingers the times ive needed the power from the props. But., that would be different if i was in the mountains.