B-Jet crash in San Diego

[Richman]

We got a clutch of DHC-8-200s that came with 2 GPS equipped UNS-1Bs versus the 1 KNS660 RNAV boxes our 100s had. We had to do an entire day's groundschool on the differences, and most of that was just the box.

For the most part, the UNS made everything work better in the airplane, and the -200 was a much better performer and had much better A/C to boot.

As for "performative art", I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but most certification for just about anything around the world works that way.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

It certainly didn't help that I spent years using a different CDU. The Universal was in the book and we spent a few moments on it in the sim. When I mentioned I was weak on it the instructor said "It's in the book, you should know it by now". Then when I asked for more time (which I would gladly paid for). "It's not in the syllabus and we don't have time for that". They ran everything so tight there wasn't room for extra training.

Boxes checked, insurance satisfied.

Y'all have fun on the line now!

 

[SurferLucas]

Maybe it's the Stockholm syndrome talking, but the Universal is my favorite FMS out of all the ones I've operated. The interface is a bit clunky but it has everything you need and nothing that you don't. My favorite features were the vertical speed required in real time to meet crossing restrictions, and being able to type in headings while staying in LNAV for some buttery smooth intercepts. Now the GNS-XLS, that's the work of the Devil or some seriously evil individual.

I’m there with you, I really miss that feature.

 

[Roger Roger]

I too thought the UNS was a really good first FMS, especially in its newest WAAS equipped versions. I never experienced it but I guess some of the older versions had some real idiosyncrasies that were taken care of in the new versions. I did find getting vectored to an RNAV approach to be a much bigger pain in the ass than with the Boeing box though, in particular I remember it being really fussy about which leg you had active for the intercept, whereas for the most part the Boeing seems happy as long as you intercept somewhere regardless of what waypoint is at the top

Actually as far as the Guppy goes I like the FMC fairly well.

 

[KLB]

It certainly didn't help that I spent years using a different CDU. The Universal was in the book and we spent a few moments on it in the sim. When I mentioned I was weak on it the instructor said "It's in the book, you should know it by now". Then when I asked for more time (which I would gladly paid for). "It's not in the syllabus and we don't have time for that". They ran everything so tight there wasn't room for extra training.

It really all depends on the program and sims you're in and how busy they are unfortunately. Sometimes giving someone more time in the sim eats up time for the person going next. But don't get me wrong. I am no fan of the big box corporate aviation training structure.

 

[averettpilot]

When I went through the Loft Citation type, it was totally scripted and on script. When I felt like I needed more time with the FMC/CDU thing, I was told unable as it's not in the syllabus. There was no time to vary from the syllabus and I should just let the F/O program the box. I told them to stop the sim and literally walked out of the building. They were kind enough to gift the balance of my sim time to a friend a year later. I came from a 121 background with a union. If you need more time on something, you got more time, and the Capt was expect to know how to everything the F/O had to do. Surreal experience.

Loft in San Diego was terrible. I wrote a review about how half the stuff in their sim was broken and how the training was as you say, and they came after me by telling my company that I was disparaging them. Terrible training.

 

[averettpilot]

Yeah, "121 stink" generally means "expects to to know wtf he/she is doing, rather than just checking the requisite boxes and hoping for the best". Not always, but often.

It’s kind of funny coming from 135 to 121 because I feel like there’s a lot they withhold in terms of information. I’ve never seen the CG envelope for the CRJ. It’s not in any manual that’s made available to me. Just send off the data and plug in the numbers

 

[CFI A&P]

It’s kind of funny coming from 135 to 121 because I feel like there’s a lot they withhold in terms of information. I’ve never seen the CG envelope for the CRJ. It’s not in any manual that’s made available to me. Just send off the data and plug in the numbers

If you dig around your documents, there should be a weight and balance program manual or similar that has that info. Are you provided the B.O.W. for that airframe and a See Gee Wheel?

 

[Richman]

If you dig around your documents, there should be a weight and balance program manual or similar that has that info. Are you provided the B.O.W. for that airframe and a See Gee Wheel?

View attachment 83860

We had a whizz wheel that they gave to DC-9 folks to calculate descents. One guy I flew with absolutely nailed every single crossing restriction, so I finally asked him how he used it.

He held it up, looked through the grommet in the middle, and said “that looks about right”.”

 

[Fixtur]

Loft in San Diego was terrible. I wrote a review about how half the stuff in their sim was broken and how the training was as you say, and they came after me by telling my company that I was disparaging them. Terrible training.

I got my first (SIC) type there in the 525. I didn't find it to be terrible, but then I didn't have any basis of comparison. Also, it was half an hour from my house, so that was pretty cool.

Last year I wrote them about an accelerated ATP/full type in the 525. I was thinking a few days of ground, a couple/three sims and a checkride. I have 500 hours in type (though it's been a few years), all the study material, and I'm a current 135 check pilot, so I thought we could work something out instead of the full ground and sim sched.

Would be worth spending a few bills to me to get the full type and ATP ride done, and spend a week in Carlsbad.

They hit me back offering the full two weeks ground and week of sim. No thank you; too rich for my blood.

If anyone knows a place that might make such a deal, I'm all ears.

Fix

 

[N3901C]

I got my first (SIC) type there in the 525. I didn't find it to be terrible, but then I didn't have any basis of comparison. Also, it was half an hour from my house, so that was pretty cool.

Last year I wrote them about an accelerated ATP/full type in the 525. I was thinking a few days of ground, a couple/three sims and a checkride. I have 500 hours in type (though it's been a few years), all the study material, and I'm a current 135 check pilot, so I thought we could work something out instead of the full ground and sim sched.

Would be worth spending a few bills to me to get the full type and ATP ride done, and spend a week in Carlsbad.

They hit me back offering the full two weeks ground and week of sim. No thank you; too rich for my blood.

If anyone knows a place that might make such a deal, I'm all ears.

Fix

Why not just go work somewhere that will pay you to get an CJ type and ATP?

 

[Fixtur]

Because I'm happy where I am.

I could go get the ATP in a Seneca for relatively cheap any time. Thought that doing it that way would be more fun.

 

[CFI A&P]

Because I'm happy where I am.

I could go get the ATP in a Seneca for relatively cheap any time. Thought that doing it that way would be more fun.

Go ahead and do it in the Seneca now, you’ll have to do a full ride for any future type ratings anyway. Might as well use a familiar airplane to make it easy.

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

I got my first (SIC) type there in the 525. I didn't find it to be terrible, but then I didn't have any basis of comparison. Also, it was half an hour from my house, so that was pretty cool.

Last year I wrote them about an accelerated ATP/full type in the 525. I was thinking a few days of ground, a couple/three sims and a checkride. I have 500 hours in type (though it's been a few years), all the study material, and I'm a current 135 check pilot, so I thought we could work something out instead of the full ground and sim sched.

Would be worth spending a few bills to me to get the full type and ATP ride done, and spend a week in Carlsbad.

They hit me back offering the full two weeks ground and week of sim. No thank you; too rich for my blood.

If anyone knows a place that might make such a deal, I'm all ears.

Fix

I got my 525(s) type and 500 series citation SIC endorsement at LOFT.

No issues and I didn’t find it terrible.