Karnage
I-am-a-pirate. I do not need credentials!
Transgender/non-binary/gender non-conforming is the implication as I read it.
Aviation Downturns
- Thread starter jhugz
- Start date
Transgender/non-binary/gender non-conforming is the implication as I read it.
jhugz
Well-Known Member
If thats the case, I’d argue that’s completely ridiculous and copium.
Maurus
The Great Gazoo
Gotcha. I misread then. It seemed like they were people just getting to a legacy. I was wondering who you were all hiring
🦈💜
Well-Known Member
I meant "people like me," as in "people like me." I don't fit the cookie cutter. I'm a trash fish. I don't come from money, or even middle class. I bought my first suit ever for an airline interview.
Airline interviews appear to be designed to screen for white collar people with a certain type of charisma. Doesn't mean "only rich people get hired," but prep has taught me that it's ultimately a roleplaying event.
But any event where you're primarily telling stories is a measure of sociability, nothing more. You're playing the role of the humble, honest person who has learned from their mistakes and grown, and wants nothing more than to be a pilot for $AIRLINE_THAT_IS_INTERVIEWING_THEM.
And you may actually be a humble, sincere, honest person who has learned from their mistakes and grown, and wants nothing more than to be a pilot for !$, but that's not enough. You have to be able to demonstrate that by telling stories and talking yourself up in a humble, sincere, honest, resilient way, rather than letting your reputation and the opinion of those you've flown with speak for your character, and your qualifications speak for your experience.
I believe that I'm good at what I do, and that's reinforced by what people I fly with tell me. Is it objectively true? No idea. Am I the sort of person that the major airlines want? Obviously not. Am I going to magically change into that person the next time they interview me? No, I'm just me. If they hit the point where they're willing to hire me, it's not that I've become better, somehow, it's that their standards have fallen to that point, or I managed to "trick" them into seeing me that way.
That is what I mean by "people like me."
But yeah, when I get misgendered by interviewers who don't apologize or correct themselves the next time after I politely correct them, yeah, I mean, I do wonder about that, too.
jhugz
Well-Known Member
Again, what prep? You fail to answer the simplest questions when again, someone is trying to help. The prep you’re getting is either poor prep, or you’re so jaded you’re getting nothing out of the prep.
As for the “white collar” comment, you couldn’t be more wrong…again. I’ve hired furloughed/soon to be airline pilots in 20 year old suits (as that’s probably the last they wore it) or kids into our pipeline program wearing their dad’s suit. I couldn’t care less. I don’t care what they wear, I do care if they put the time and effort to show up in a pressed shirt and groomed appropriately. Prep shows that you care enough to want the job and are willing to put in a little effort.
Time and time again you’ve proven that you’re not someone who’s willing to put in the time and effort to get the dream job. I guarantee that is coming out in an interview. Why should they hire you? The amount of complaining you’ve done on here about the process, if you put that time and effort with myself/derg and good interview prep, I guarantee you would have been employed.
Finally, again, idk how to say this softly. YOU’RE NOT SPECIAL. Nothing about your background, past life experiences, upbringing, social status, or gender is something I haven’t seen 10x before. Stop trying to use it as an excuse to why you haven’t gotten a job. You haven’t gotten a job because of your attitude and willingness to put in the work.
/fullstop
I gotta say, speaking as a person who has literally offered to fly out to wherever you are, sit down and work with you through the headwinds, I think you’d benefit by listening to JHugz, especially before your next interview. Like NASA launching a rocket: “Work the problem”
And, quite frankly, people would absolutely kill for the opportunity to sit down with someone who even offered a telephone call to talk about it.
And, quite frankly, people would absolutely kill for the opportunity to sit down with someone who even offered a telephone call to talk about it.
Skåning
Well-Known Member
So she didn’t even reach out to you the first time you offered? Horse to water…
I guess it’s easier to just complain online.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
I’m probably gonna get some flak for saying this, but this is one of those rare times you let it go. Take the few minutes of pain, end up with a multi-million dollar legacy career. And once off probation, you can then exact from them (if you see them again) the correct/proper term.
Just an honest opinion. If you’ve had multiple unsats for multiple interviews at different airlines, it’s time to evaluate what could make you memorable to the interviewers. Just my opinion, but correcting them on something like this probably does stand out a little bit.
You should be treated fairly and equally. My point is like that one Chappelle joke, I think where a lady is about to give him a BJ and she calls him a n word. And he goes, this is no time to grow a conscience /have ethics.
I mean, yeah. Would you hire someone who sits there and insists "my qualifications speak for themselves, this whole process is stupid.."? If I flew with someone who wanted to talk about what a hotshot they were in the military, listed their accolades and listened to their squadron mates talk about what a great person they were, I'd probably have a sore neck from looking out the right window the entire time and would run out of fingers and toes counting the times I went "uh huh" and "damn, that's crazy."
ahw01
Well-Known Member
Yeh unfortunately interviews are laboratory conditions and it can take a number of goes (with the same place) until you figure out exactly what they’re looking for. Took me just that with CAE to adapt my teaching style etc.
And sometimes it stays a mystery. I was convinced I wanted nothing more than to work at the place OP is presumably talking about. Prepped, prepped, and prepped and for whatever reason it didn't work out, although reflecting on how nervous and robotic I probably came across in the interview, I probably wouldn't have hired me either. Same story for multiple friends I know who are good pilots and great people, there's a lot of them and current friends at that shop still going "what the heck, man?" to them not making the cut. Looking back, I could throw in a lot of other places that in the last few years have been seen as "easy" that didn't even bother to give me a thanks but no thanks, even with some solid internal recs. Allegedly the airline with a hub 25 minutes from my house was hiring people on the spot at job fairs a few years ago, and supposedly even interviewing people with incomplete applications. I think it remains one of the two airlines I never got so much as a peep from. Certain aspects of this industry will always be a mystery.
CFIT99
because of the implication...
couldn't stress this enough...flew with a CA that was retiring the next month, the crap he went through was on @ZapBrannigan level.
In walks a 27 y/o CKA at a whole owned that seems to be upset that he is flowing and has to take a huge pay cut...luckily he got a seat in the back and didn't get to hear the CA and I run train on his "perfect career projection" ideology.
I said, it's gonna be a real peach when I see that guy in the right seat in a few years...CA responds "don't worry the first sign of trouble and he bails...he was told he was good and pretty his whole life, but his passion was never tested..."
*slow clap*
jhugz
Well-Known Member
You probably should just take the L and sit on the sidelines for this discussion. You’re part of the problem with her. You got her so spooled up over this “unfair process” that her poor performance is part of your doing. Instead of listening to the right people, she instead listened to you and probably cost her a couple of CJO’s.
If you’re misgendered in an interview correct it. As an interviewer I would never take offense to it and would be apologetic. However like everything else, use the correct tone. If you correct the person in the right way, it’s showing traits we want to hire. You’re able to have a hard, uncomfortable discussion but you’re willing to do it in the right ways. Bonus points.
CFIT99
because of the implication...
my first 121 gig, I made about 800/week...my checking account would bounce between $-50 and +$50 for about 2 years. (rent, student loans were all on auto draft)...
I was always a day away from quitting....
DPApilot
GUYSH! GUYSH! GUYSH!
Stay away from my garbage!
DPApilot
GUYSH! GUYSH! GUYSH!
If anyone knows me, they know I don't go wrong with shoes.I saw the shoes he wore to that interview. And he still got hired
CFIT99
because of the implication...
edit: 800...every 2 weeks.
To OPs credit despite some of the other stuff (sorry, I can't find the emojis), I think she needs to give herself some credit for this.
Easily 80% of why captains earn the big bucks and something I hope is instilled in FOs. Saying "no" and speaking up, even when it's unpopular and uncomfortable.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
Oh please. Her performance is hers, and hers alone. Who she chooses to listen to, what she does, etc, is all on her. And most importantly, none of you know how she performed or what she screwed up on in the interviews themselves. You can’t lay the blame on anyone but her.
I didnt give her interview advice. Just general commentary on the sad state of affairs that is airline pilot interviews. It sounds like she has been turned down by every major airline now. That has nothing to do with my commentary. The irony is you’re actually giving her a reason for her failures by blaming me.