ATP Final Rule Signed

does anyone know what is the definition of an "aviation degree"? does aerospace engineering count? or does it only refer to degrees like aviation science, aviation flight technology, etc.?
 
I read somewhere that you will be illegible for a restricted ATP if you have 1500 hours, and are at least 21. Basically just lowering the age limit. Is this still the case? I understand that if you graduate from a 141 university, and have 1000hrs, you're eligible, but if we did our training through a part 61 school, are we eligible at 21 years of age? Also, do y'all think all the regionals will accept a restricted ATP? Thanks.
 
ryan4sail said:
I read somewhere that you will be illegible for a restricted ATP if you have 1500 hours, and are at least 21. Basically just lowering the age limit. Is this still the case? I understand that if you graduate from a 141 university, and have 1000hrs, you're eligible, but if we did our training through a part 61 school, are we eligible at 21 years of age? Also, do y'all think all the regionals will accept a restricted ATP? Thanks.
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Yes
 
I scrolled through the PDF but was anyone able to pick up on anything saying about getting the ATP written done before August, that you wont have to go through the ATP CTP??
 
Don't see how anyone can see this as a bad thing.

Dunno if I would count on grandfathering. To quote from the final rule:

"While the FAA has considered and appreciates all of the comments received, the FAA
was not given any discretion to allow pilots serving in part 121 operations to hold any certificate
other than an ATP certificate. There is no latitude in the Act to permit a pilot with a commercial
pilot certificate who is flying in part 121 today to continue flying beyond the date of this self enacting
provision without having obtained an ATP certificate. "

Richman
 
So what's the new regulation then on XC time? From the face of it, it appears that someone with 1,000 TT which some BS degree in "Professional Pilot" spending their days tooling around the traffic pattern in a 172 is more qualified than say someone who went Part 61 flying right seat on a citation, king air, etc etc with 1400 TT, 1000 turbine, 1200 XC, etc etc.
 
StrykerINF said:
So what's the new regulation then on XC time? From the face of it, it appears that someone with 1,000 TT which some BS degree in "Professional Pilot" spending their days tooling around the traffic pattern in a 172 is more qualified than say someone who went Part 61 flying right seat on a citation, king air, etc etc with 1400 TT, 1000 turbine, 1200 XC, etc etc.
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That's what I'm seeing as well...

I couldn't imagine current employees not getting grandfathered in however. That just doesn't make sense (oh wait, this is aviation, nothing makes sense) to take someone who is already in the right seat, with experience and seniority, and kick them out because they don't meet some new requirement. I'm all for safety and appropriate regulations, but jeesh.
 
ajdwings said:
I wouldn't panic yet. We're hearing that a grandfather for current 121 guys is imminent. There has to be.

No way ALPA will allow any govenment legislation that puts guys on the street (at least they shouldn't allow it)
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Just curious where or from who you are hearing a grandfather is imminent for current 121 guys?
 
Mark815 said:
That's what I'm seeing as well...

I couldn't imagine current employees not getting grandfathered in however. That just doesn't make sense (oh wait, this is aviation, nothing makes sense) to take someone who is already in the right seat, with experience and seniority, and kick them out because they don't meet some new requirement. I'm all for safety and appropriate regulations, but jeesh.
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I work at a place where one of the pilots has less than 1,500 TT and didn't go to a Riddle. He's got a ton of a time in the A/C and a type but we're wondering what will happen to him when this thing comes into law. Worst case is that he just leaves the company to do some extra flying to get to the mins then come back... but that means we're temporarily losing a very experienced F/O for a little bit.
 
So I take it the cross country time for people that didn't go to Riddle or the like is still 500 hours. Fantastic...
 
Not horribly unreasonable imo. But then again the best part of this bill IMO is that it'll make it harder for airlines to fill classes making them have to look at other ways to entice people. I think it will also make people who are just looking for an easy career where you throw 40k at training and think you're done with advancing your skills look elsewhere for employment. I think attitude is the major factor on whether or not you'll be a successful new hire. This will weed out a few of the "gulfstreamesque" crowd.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
Not horribly unreasonable imo. But then again the best part of this bill IMO is that it'll make it harder for airlines to fill classes making them have to look at other ways to entice people. I think it will also make people who are just looking for an easy career where you throw 40k at training and think you're done with advancing your skills look elsewhere for employment. I think attitude is the major factor on whether or not you'll be a successful new hire. This will weed out a few of the "gulfstreamesque" crowd.
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Or it'll send guys into 100k debt from an aviation university and have to take the first job offer they get which might pay very very low because they need a job to pay back the debt and only have 1,000 hrs
 
StrykerINF said:
Or it'll send guys into 100k debt from an aviation university and have to take the first job offer they get which might pay very very low because they need a job to pay back the debt and only have 1,000 hrs
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The only "Aviation university" is Riddle. There are many other universities out there with comparable programs that will cost the same as flight training elsewhere + the cost of a degree from a state university.

Regardless, if they take out 100k in debt to avoid another 500 hours of flight instructing, they are the people who I am talking about in the first place.
 
sport08 said:
does anyone know what is the definition of an "aviation degree"? does aerospace engineering count? or does it only refer to degrees like aviation science, aviation flight technology, etc.?
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I was wondering the same thing. Maybe there's more detail deep within.
 
I'll be the one to say it, I'm actually pretty happy about it... the 1,500TT is fair, 1,000 for a Part 141 University? maybe a silly exemption but better than the 250 hr exemption that was proposed. Plus, it requires airline pilots to have real experience and will probably lead to some kind of pay recovery for new hire pilots in the longer term. I can tell you right now my company is sweating bullets over this. Were one of those regionals that doesn't like to hire below 1500TT but occasionally does to fill seats when necessary to avoid paying a competitive wage and to delay contract negotiations, now that option is off the table.

Don't get me wrong, its not perfect... but its a step in the right direction.
 
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