ASA PBS TA reached

Divine Wind said:
Sure they can. Then what? The company tells them to piss off.
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Ya know, I just have to point out that everyone has quoted the first sentence and apparently not read the rest of my statement. I don't actually expect the union to waste time on junior FOs. Again, it comes back to political capital and where to spend it. But what do I know? ;)
 
cencal83406 said:
You ASA guys will love this little gem of PBS....

it doesn't honor seniority in a case where a line will "fit" better into someone's schedule. So, say someone 20 junior to you bids for the same line but his training or vacation falls on the days off of the line, he'll get the line over you, especially if you attempted to bid a day off on a potential day of work that was on that line.

:dunno:
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Ask me how thrilled I was to see guys junior to ME (and I'm 7 from the bottom) get a high speed line just b/c they had a sim scheduled for the month. Rex is right, PBS doesn't do a very good job of honoring seniority. It's a company tool to increase productivity. Now, if you're a math major and are senior enough to hold a line, you might be able to game the system. Fact is, you shouldn't be ABLE to game a seniority based system.

And the whole "we're the only DCI carrier that doesn't have it" sounds like Pinnacle management saying "Everyone else is furloughing. Maybe we should, too." Anyone got a copy of ASA's LOA yet? I'd LOVE to look it over. Might even be able to point out some issues that need improving. If I'm REALLY lucky, maybe we can steal some good things in it for our potential re-negotiations on our current TA. :)
 
kellwolf said:
Anyone got a copy of ASA's LOA yet? I'd LOVE to look it over. Might even be able to point out some issues that need improving. If I'm REALLY lucky, maybe we can steal some good things in it for our potential re-negotiations on our current TA. :)
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No, just lots of vagueness.

The email they sent out announcing it had 4 or 5 topics and all of them were "this is happening...but we can't really share details with you yet"

well then don't email me until you can!
 
Screaming_Emu said:
No, just lots of vagueness.

The email they sent out announcing it had 4 or 5 topics and all of them were "this is happening...but we can't really share details with you yet"

well then don't email me until you can!
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I've learned recently, don't buy what's being sold until you see the contract language. Anything else is just spin. I'm still trying to get the knife out of my back from this TA. They could easily tell you all the good things in the LOA and conveniently leave out the bad. None of us had heard about the "reserves can be placed back on reserve for 12 hours after the end of the previous rest period" until the contract language of the TA came out. We heard about RR getting an hour on top of per diem if it was an escalation and some of the other improvements, but none of the backwards movement was mentioned.
 
kellwolf said:
I've learned recently, don't buy what's being sold until you see the contract language. Anything else is just spin. I'm still trying to get the knife out of my back from this TA. They could easily tell you all the good things in the LOA and conveniently leave out the bad. None of us had heard about the "reserves can be placed back on reserve for 12 hours after the end of the previous rest period" until the contract language of the TA came out. We heard about RR getting an hour on top of per diem if it was an escalation and some of the other improvements, but none of the backwards movement was mentioned.
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Indeed. It's always in the details.

But be careful, one of our TA's was sold to us one way, the contractual language said something else and many people got burned.
 
Screaming_Emu said:
No, just lots of vagueness.

The email they sent out announcing it had 4 or 5 topics and all of them were "this is happening...but we can't really share details with you yet"

well then don't email me until you can!
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NO, this group has had lots of problems with communications. I am much more happy when they say stuff is going on, but we can't tell you, as opposed to the just say nothing routine. At least this way we know they are actually doing something besides collecting flight pay loss.
 
kellwolf said:
Ask me how thrilled I was to see guys junior to ME (and I'm 7 from the bottom) get a high speed line just b/c they had a sim scheduled for the month. Rex is right, PBS doesn't do a very good job of honoring seniority. It's a company tool to increase productivity. Now, if you're a math major and are senior enough to hold a line, you might be able to game the system. Fact is, you shouldn't be ABLE to game a seniority based system.

And the whole "we're the only DCI carrier that doesn't have it" sounds like Pinnacle management saying "Everyone else is furloughing. Maybe we should, too." Anyone got a copy of ASA's LOA yet? I'd LOVE to look it over. Might even be able to point out some issues that need improving. If I'm REALLY lucky, maybe we can steal some good things in it for our potential re-negotiations on our current TA. :)
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Latest from union says language won't be complete for a couple months and we shouldn't expect a copy until late november into december.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
Think about the last time you heard your head DALPA honcho give a speech. ;)
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I generally 'change the channel'.

What's a passionate speech worth when it continually resulted in lower pay, worse benefits and larger regional jets -- and how his henchmen swear you're an idiot for not thinking it's the best thing since the discovery of mixing Red Bull w/Vodka.
 
So far from what I can tell, most of those in favor are in favor not because PBS will increase their QOL but rather they fear the repercussions of being "too expensive" and "losing flying."
That if they don't take PBS the airline will wither away with long upgrade times, no more new -900s etc.

So it's a win-win situation for management.

In rough times (like now) you are in fear of not being "cost effective" enough...You could get more of your flying cut .

In good times they'll dangle the factory fresh -900s in front of you and say "we have to cut costs to get these aircraft."
 
Doug Taylor said:
Does your MEC publish "PRO/CON" papers?
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From what I've seen in the Regional World, most MECs seem to be pretty happy with whatever they get and majorly downplay the potential cons. This may be because it is so hard to get ANYTHING from management so they are just happy to have something to give to the pilot group.
 
aevfo said:
Vote will be after we have the TA in our hands and after several road shows. They were talking about the road shows in December.
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Woah. Are we talking a whole new TA already or just a PBS LOA? I was under the impression that it was just the LOA. I know ASA's contract is up soon, but if a new TA is out that early.....I'd be cautious about it.
 
kellwolf said:
Woah. Are we talking a whole new TA already or just a PBS LOA? I was under the impression that it was just the LOA. I know ASA's contract is up soon, but if a new TA is out that early.....I'd be cautious about it.
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It is a PBS TA only. There is a tentative agreement on PBS only, and they still have to write the LOA. By switching to PBS, we will have to completely re-write our scheduling section. Also, by agreeing to this we will also extend our current contract 1 year and we will get a 1% raise on the anniversary (pathetic).
 
aevfo said:
Also, by agreeing to this we will also extend our current contract 1 year and we will get a 1% raise on the anniversary (pathetic).
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Agreed 1% is pathetic. At Eagle, when we were discussing PBS a few years ago, it was calculated to save the company $15M/year. The general (and industry average!) consensus was that we'd get half of that savings in one form or another. The company pulled out of the discussions before we went further than that, but I'm curious about how much ASA is saving by converting to PBS and what the pilots will receive in compensation for accepting the agreement.
 
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