AOPA Rod Machado article

  • Thread starter Thread starter Roger, Roger
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Usually those that are knowledgeable are delighted to explain their thoughts to anyone that's interested.

So long as they believe the other person is truly interested. This leaves room for bias. Hence, I agree and disagree. Like most partnerships, I think both sides can be equally faulted in most circumstances.

Anyways, any questions on bank turns and their relationship to g-forces when accompanied by a climb or descent? :D
 
Anyways, any questions on bank turns and their relationship to g-forces when accompanied by a climb or descent? :D

No. Just questions on pitch vs power, 61 vs 141, academy vs FBO, shock cooling, and how to log PIC time.

Can you address those please? :) :)
 
No. Just questions on pitch vs power, 61 vs 141, academy vs FBO, shock cooling, and how to log PIC time.

Can you address those please? :) :)

You forgot over-square & LOP... Might as well solve all the world's problems while were at it.
 
I teach primary in both Cessna and Citabria's. I have not seen one student be proficient enough to get through all the pre solo aeronautical experience, as well as knowledge to be able to solo within 10 hours. Now days, a student has to be near private pilot level of knowledge and experience to solo. Modern communication is so much more involved than it was 50 years ago. Not to mention airspace. It was much easier to solo a student 50 years ago. There were no requirements, as long as you didn't smash the airplane into the ground you were good to go.

There is a reason the national average is 60 hours for a PPL. Things have become more complex, more requirements, regulations, knowledge etc.

Besides why the emphasis on soloing anyway? The emphasis should be getting the student the private ticket.
 
I teach primary in both Cessna and Citabria's. I have not seen one student be proficient enough to get through all the pre solo aeronautical experience, as well as knowledge to be able to solo within 10 hours. Now days, a student has to be near private pilot level of knowledge and experience to solo.

I think a lot of has to do with a student's background. Some people have grown up around a grass strip flying with their grandfather in a J-3. I solo'd in 9 hours through CAP when I was 16. They had a great program... if you weren't flying, you were riding in the back seat... soaking in all of the comm and procedure stuff. I think almost every student in the class solo'd around 10 hours... and all students were 16 to 17.
 
I guess I missed how what Tgray said was arrogant? It is a true statement. How could it NOT be true? There is no emotional connotation to it.

He's primarily referring to this statement in a previous post (and was augmented by the quote you posted):

my "teaching style" is remarkably effective in teaching people a deep understanding of these issues, far beyond what they can get via any other means, so, no, I have no interest in whether anyone here or anywhere else disagrees with me, because they are mistaken.
 
He's primarily referring to this statement in a previous post (and was augmented by the quote you posted):

However, his teaching style (using the math to make clear the core foundations of flight dynamics) must, by definition, teach people a deeper understanding than they could get absent the math. Why is it "arrogant" to state that fact?
 
However, his teaching style (using the math to make clear the core foundations of flight dynamics) must, by definition, teach people a deeper understanding than they could get absent the math. Why is it "arrogant" to state that fact?

Well actually, not really, you're assuming that a deeper understanding of the subject material requires the math. Back to "good to know, vs. need to know methinks."
 
Well actually, not really, you're assuming that a deeper understanding of the subject material requires the math. Back to "good to know, vs. need to know methinks."

That depends on what you define as a "deeper understanding" doesn't it?

The question at hand is not that, though, it's far simpler. It is simply "Does a person who understands the math in addition to the other material have a deeper understanding than one who has not been at all exposed to the math?"

With that, I do not see how it is possible to say that non-exposure is the same.
 
That depends on what you define as a "deeper understanding" doesn't it?

The question at hand is not that, though, it's far simpler. It is simply "Does a person who understands the math in addition to the other material have a deeper understanding than one who has not been at all exposed to the math?"

With that, I do not see how it is possible to say that non-exposure is the same.

By and large I would agree, however I think that there's range of "satisfactory" depth of understanding for our discussion. Non-Exposure to the math is also essentially meaningless if someone isn't conversant in math. Pictoral, and written descriptions might provide a deeper understanding to that specific person rather than simply glossing through the heiroglphys of the algebra. I say that as someone who's fairly decent at math. I think its easy to lose sight of the forest for the trees in this regards. For example, a lot of people could tell you the core principles behind the theory of relativity, they could tell you about warping space, Lorenz contraction, etc. but give them a bunch of equations, and ask them to point out the significance of gamma in these equations, or how they relate to the overall structure of the universe, and most will be out of their league.

The problem is that to truly understand the mathematics, you have to have more than simply an algebraic understanding of why something does something. You have to know a little calculus to know "why" there's a 1/2 or "why" there's a 2 in front of it, then to truly understand lift you have to know how to work in the Complex Plane and do the Calculus of Complex Variables so that you can calculate how the Jukowski airfoil sections apply forces in different directions. Then you have to be able to apply that to surfaces which aren't necessarily perfect airfoils, then you might have to use Navier-Stokes equations to try to get a grasp on the turbulence in the flow. See, at some point the information about the physical aspect of flying gets lost in the noise of all the other BS that you're having to sort through to get it. Its not a truly deep understanding if you know "this is the equation that governs lift, this is how it works," if you don't know where it comes from. By the time you get to a truly complete understanding of the mathematics of it, you're so worried about the minutiae you stop thinking the big picture. Depending on the student, someone who's less versed in the mathematics of the subject might actually have a worse understanding of how flying works if they're mired in formulaic jargon. Knowing that lift increases with the square of velocity doesn't tell me a damn thing about "why" it does so. So really, all I've really done is rote memorized some equations at the low end of the mathematics, then maybe, maybe correllated them to the act of flying. I don't really see that as "understanding."
 
I guess I missed how what Tgray said was arrogant? It is a true statement. How could it NOT be true? There is no emotional connotation to it.

Did you come in here just to stir the pot? Because I see you adding nothing to the topic that hasn't already been said. The only difference, is that your first post in this thread is you calling someone out..............
 
Did you come in here just to stir the pot? Because I see you adding nothing to the topic that hasn't already been said. The only difference, is that your first post in this thread is you calling someone out..............

How many posts do YOU determine are required before someone could ask a question in the thread?
 
How many posts do YOU determine are required before someone could ask a question in the thread?

Post count would be zero. But when they start like this, all I see is fire.

I guess I missed how what Tgray said was arrogant?


Same with yours.

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