WacoFan
Bigly
Seriously - look at the Kahn Academy site I posted a page or so ago. I think you'll like how he teaches math. You're dead on with math instruction in the elementary through high school years.
Seriously - look at the Kahn Academy site I posted a page or so ago. I think you'll like how he teaches math. You're dead on with math instruction in the elementary through high school years.
ppragman
No pasa nada.
Also, there's some cool stuff out there about "speed math" and various tricks of the trade that got me interested in math again a few years ago.
WacoFan
Bigly
There is a book published in 1945 but still in print called "How to Calculate Quickly" - look for it on Amazon.
Basically it speaks to the difference between people that have advanced mathematical knowledge and people that have "number sense" - basically people that have very high math education that often need a slide-rule (1945 remember) to do simple calculations that a shopkeeper could do in their head. I got that book because they are fun exercises to do on airplanes. Maggie also read it - she wants to have deep mathematical knowledge as well as "number sense".
ppragman
No pasa nada.
Is that book the "Trachtenburg Method" (sp?) If so the story behind how the guy came up with it is pretty cool.
Thanks for posting that link. I definitely plan on giving it a deeper look!
WacoFan
Bigly
No, it is different.
tgrayson
New Member
I didn't say that they did. But some people aspire to more than that and those are the ones that I speak to. And again, we're only talking high school math and basic physics.
Nope, didn't say that. I said, with highlights added:
And I stand behind that statement. Those with mathematical understanding of aircraft flight (or any subject) have a superior understanding of it than those who don't.
ppragman
No pasa nada.
The Trachtenburg Method was developed by an engineer in a concentration camp to keep his mind busy, cool stuff.
TwoTwoLeft
o- - - - - - -l
:guns::deadhorse:
tgrayson
New Member
And it never ceases to amaze me that those who value education over ignorance would be labeled as "arrogant". Again, I think it reflects a well-known anti-intellectualism in American culture, which tends to value good old-fashioned common sense over education and sophistication. This is why we're rapidly being eclipsed by other cultures who understand that education is the route to power in the real world. The shame is that many of them come to the United States to take advantage of our wonderful-but-declining university system, while American students regard college as 4 years of summer camp. It will be our undoing unless some Sputnik-like humiliation occurs very soon.
Reminds me a bit of how my mother often refers to physicians as being "arrogant", but I think she uses that label for anyone that is demonstrably better educated than she is. Rather than rising to the challenge to educate herself, as some people do, she assigns the flaw to the other person, instead of accepting it herself. In this way, her status quo becomes "normal" and the physician is the one with the character defect. No virtue is so great that it can't be interpreted as a vice when sufficient motivation exists.
WacoFan
Bigly
General commentary not directed at anyone:
Part of it may well be an anti-intellectualism in American culture. It could also be that American culture doesn't hate the knowledge and appreciates what it can create - it hates the intellectual for more personal reasons. To those that are given much, much is expected. People with intellectual gifts often display an arrogance that is off-putting. Many gifted people condescend instead of explain, scoff instead of try to educate and look down upon those they deem "not at their level". I'm not sure why this is - I'm thinking that work with the Autism spectrum explains a lot of it - basically that everyone is autistic to some degree, and this may well be why some who are mathematically or scientifically gifted fall somewhere on the "lower social skills" end of the chart. It isn't always like this - there are some people that are gifted scientifically that have extremely good social skills - I've never witnessed backlash against those people - they explain things and can communicate complex ideas to those that are not as gifted in certain areas as they and do so in a way that doesn't make the person feel like an idiot. I read about this "anti-intellectual bias" and I think it is a joke and a cover for people to continue to act pompous while still being able to feel good about themselves (like your Mom justifying her doctors arrogance, many intellectuals justify their interactions viewed from a "people are anti-intellectual" view rather than an "I am an • and need to work on things" view).
If America was so rabidly anti-intellectual, why are we still the preferred destination for post-graduate education and one of the greatest generators of technology? A more proper term would be "America hates condescending intellectuals" - that statement would be true. Many intellectuals are the equivalent of a trash-talking football player who tries to show up their opponents. You can have Ph D's in various math and science disciplines...but when the crap hits the fan and everyone is forced to grow their own food the smartest people in the room will be the ones that know what berries you can eat without being poisoned and how to kill and gut a deer using only sharp sticks and rocks. Just my opinion but intellectualism today may not really hold a lot of weight if things get to be like Thunderdome - a different skill set will apply. Everyone has different gifts and a truly smart man will find those gifts within people and be able to bring them out.
z987k
Well-Known Member
Ah yes, the apocalypse, I'd much rather put all my eggs in that basket.
And to be honest, if someone is offended by someone's else intelligence... screw em. If fat people get offended that I have no sympathy for their condition or that I look down on them, well sorry, it's entirely a self choice. You have every ability to not do it or fix it etc.
Tgrayson, interesting article that is related to your last post. - http://newsjunkiepost.com/2010/12/1...n-democracy-the-science-behind-self-delusion/
And to be honest, if someone is offended by someone's else intelligence... screw em. If fat people get offended that I have no sympathy for their condition or that I look down on them, well sorry, it's entirely a self choice. You have every ability to not do it or fix it etc.
Tgrayson, interesting article that is related to your last post. - http://newsjunkiepost.com/2010/12/1...n-democracy-the-science-behind-self-delusion/
WacoFan
Bigly
I'll read about this. Cool backstory!
WacoFan
Bigly
tgrayson
New Member
Yes, those studies have been widely publicized in the skeptical community, but it's not clear exactly how far reaching that research is. Clearly, sometimes people do change their minds or are persuaded by the evidence. Why can people sometimes be persuaded to change their minds on important topics and sometimes not? If there is any question that keeps me up at night, this one is it.
tgrayson
New Member
I don't find this true at all. Usually those that are knowledgeable are delighted to explain their thoughts to anyone that's interested. I think that arrogance is merely a label we apply to people we want to refute but cannot. It's very similar to the adage I heard once: "Hatred is the homage that cowardice pays to courage." Just substitute the appropriate words.
tgrayson
New Member
Coincidentally, Point of Inquiry just posted a podcast with one of the authors of the study referenced in your article:
http://www.pointofinquiry.org/
USMCmech
Well-Known Member
America isn't "anti" intellecual, we just aren't impressed by academic achievment by itself. Add "old-fashioned common sense' to formal education and then you are getting somewhere. Persoanlly, some of DUMBEST people I've ever meet have post grad degrees. I also know many highly intellegent, well educated, and very sucessfull high school grads.
As a country we are not a nation of "thinkers" we are a country of "doers". I disagree with your conclusion that this is a liability for us, I see it as a strength.
Well said