Air Force, Air Lines eyeballing shortage and 1500 hour rule

I know this has nothing to do with the original topic but since AF helo's were mentioned....

What do Air Force UH-1s do? I imagine all AF Huey guys do is remain CONUS flying from missile silo to missile silo and still get paid the big bucks. That has to be the best military aviation job in the country.... other than the fact they will be the first to be vaporized in WWIII.

USAF has a long history with the UH-1 Huey.

USAF UH-1s do missile silo support and ferrying of Security Police teams in both site security as well as convoy escort for missiles. These units also do civil SAR when hoist aircraft are needed, as well as HEMS in an Army MAST-style role if situations require it and civilian EMS helos aren't available. In fact, the UH-1N unit at Fairchild, which primarily supports the USAF land survival school, gets a ton of civil SAR rescues and is considered to be such an asset, that when the USAF was considering shutting them down, the state of Washington when full-on politicking to keep them. There are also two or three squadrons that do VIP support, with the D.C. unit having some secret squirrel stuff were there to be a national emergency. There used to be actual CSAR units that had UH-1Ns, but all of those are HH-60s now. In the aforementioned roles, the USAF had HH-1Hs and HH-1Ns, with the Hs being retired in the mid-90s. The UH-1Ns are supposed to be getting replaced, but have soldiered on quite well, most of them being 1969-early 70s models.

Up until the mid-1980s, the USAF operated UH-1F models as local base SAR aircraft and range support aircraft. These were unique to the USAF in that they are the "shorty" fuselage UH-1s, like a UH-1B/C, but have the Lycoming L-9/11 replaced by a GE T58 engine, since the USAF had a surplus of those. Because of the way the T58 is mounted, the tailpipe of a normal Huey is covered with a fairing, and the exhaust comes out of the right side of the engine compartment. Another model of the UH-1F, the UH-1P, was used as a USAF gunship for supporting ground troops during and immediately after the Vietnam War, before being retired.

In order below: UH-1F, UH-1P gunship (note exhaust on right side, and rear of engine exhaust covered over), VH-1N VIP Twin Huey, HH-1N Twin Huey, HH-1H SAR Huey

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I know this has nothing to do with the original topic but since AF helo's were mentioned....

What do Air Force UH-1s do? I imagine all AF Huey guys do is remain CONUS flying from missile silo to missile silo and still get paid the big bucks. That has to be the best military aviation job in the country.... other than the fact they will be the first to be vaporized in WWIII.

Are you aware of where those missile silos are located? Being vaporized is a relief.
 
When I was flying in SAT, I worked with a CFI who got a job teaching at IFS shortly after I moved away. A few years later, he got picked up for a Guard C-5 slot. He had to go through IFS as a student with some of the instructors who had been his coworkers a few months earlier.

Yea that's just dumb. When I almost went in the guard in 2012 they would waive IFS if you had a private.
 
Yea that's just dumb. When I almost went in the guard in 2012 they would waive IFS if you had a private.

The policy has changed several times on that over the years.

Again, bearing in mind that the purpose of screening is to asses adaptability to the USAF's training environment. As has been said before, prior aviation experience is no guarantor of good performance in that training.
 
The policy has changed several times on that over the years.

Again, bearing in mind that the purpose of screening is to asses adaptability to the USAF's training environment. As has been said before, prior aviation experience is no guarantor of good performance in that training.

If it's a civilian flight school with civilian instructors it's worthless I'd guess. If it was the old style mini UPT with AF instructors then it'd be worth it.
 
What good does a TFR do at 25'!?!?

Fully coupled flight control systems can do amazing things with modern technology. Can I fly lower and faster than those systems would allow, sure.

Can I do it indefinitely oh heck no.

That's the unfortunate problem with a lot of "experienced" aviators. The experience was gained at high altitude, down low they are just as green as the new guys. Low Level flight is a muscle that has to be exercised to be effective/safe.

Unfortunately we neither dedicate the time to make people that good, or the funding to augment that with technology like TFR because we don't see the long term benefit. It's kinda like how there are systems on the swoopy black helicopters and stuff that can perform dust landings in far safer conditions than conventional side. Those systems outfitted across say the Blackhawk fleet are to expensive to big Army so we'd rather roll over a couple helicopters every year and eat that cost instead.
 
Fully coupled flight control systems can do amazing things with modern technology. Can I fly lower and faster than those systems would allow, sure.

Can I do it indefinitely oh heck no.

That's the unfortunate problem with a lot of "experienced" aviators. The experience was gained at high altitude, down low they are just as green as the new guys. Low Level flight is a muscle that has to be exercised to be effective/safe.

Unfortunately we neither dedicate the time to make people that good, or the funding to augment that with technology like TFR because we don't see the long term benefit. It's kinda like how there are systems on the swoopy black helicopters and stuff that can perform dust landings in far safer conditions than conventional side. Those systems outfitted across say the Blackhawk fleet are to expensive to big Army so we'd rather roll over a couple helicopters every year and eat that cost instead.
You say "TFR" and I think temporary flight restriction. I now realize you mean terrain followin radar.
 
USAF has a long history with the UH-1 Huey.

USAF UH-1s do missile silo support and ferrying of Security Police teams in both site security as well as convoy escort for missiles. These units also do civil SAR when hoist aircraft are needed, as well as HEMS in an Army MAST-style role if situations require it and civilian EMS helos aren't available. In fact, the UH-1N unit at Fairchild, which primarily supports the USAF land survival school, gets a ton of civil SAR rescues and is considered to be such an asset, that when the USAF was considering shutting them down, the state of Washington when full-on.......

Hats off to all the SAR guys and gals. At this point in my career I'm convinced AF UH-1 has to be the best flying job in the military.
 
All this bitching about shortages, if they would get rid of the UPT age limit for prior service or at least grant age waivers I know a whole lot of Army that would jump across the fence in a hurry.


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This plus 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000!!!!!!!!
 
All this bitching about shortages, if they would get rid of the UPT age limit for prior service or at least grant age waivers I know a whole lot of Army that would jump across the fence in a hurry.

This plus 1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000!!!!!!!!

Why you guys are so hot to trot to want to be in the AF is beyond me. Its alot of pain in the ass, for a little bit of nice flying time; which only gets worse with rank. I guess all the services have their own share of BS, but the AF isn't necessarily completely green grass itself. Will be happy when I hang that crap up here in awhile. :)
 
Why you guys are so hot to trot to want to be in the AF is beyond me. Its alot of pain in the ass, for a little bit of nice flying time; which only gets worse with rank. I guess all the services have their own share of BS, but the AF isn't necessarily completely green grass itself. Will be happy when I hang that crap up here in awhile. :)

In the case of the Kiowa pilots it's because most of them are being kicked out simply because we do not have the means to pipeline them to new aircraft fast enough.

For me and others like me, it's to be in a service that actually understands aviation is entirely different from ground forces. We can't treat it like infantry with high cost tractors and expect it to ever meet it's full potential. The fact we send fires and Intel guys to Air units to get some experience before they go to their real job says everything about where the Army ranks fitting into the complex air fight.


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In the case of the Kiowa pilots it's because most of them are being kicked out simply because we do not have the means to pipeline them to new aircraft fast enough.

For me and others like me, it's to be in a service that actually understands aviation is entirely different from ground forces. We can't treat it like infantry with high cost tractors and expect it to ever meet it's full potential. The fact we send fires and Intel guys to Air units to get some experience before they go to their real job says everything about where the Army ranks fitting into the complex air fight.

I saw alot of that. Long ago, I was a FAC attached to 2/2 ACR at Polk, and before that, to 1/503, 2 ID at Casey. I can remember being at a ROC drill for a training op we were doing. These 3 Apaches come in for a landing, and my two FAC team enlisted and I wander over to visit with them before the briefing commences. As the crews exit their aircraft, they're in the one-piece flightsuits, but they start gathering some LBE with pistol belts, take out these camo kits and start painting up their faces, and don a PASGT helmet, before heading over to the briefing area. My conversation with them goes something like this, after basic hello's, handshakes, and identifying who we are.

(watching them get dressed up as described)

"So, what are you guys doing?"

"We're getting dressed for the drill".

"Aren't you guys already dressed?"

"No, we have to put all this crap on"

"But....you guys don't fly with any of that, right?"

"Right. But its what the Batallion commander wants."

"So, who cares what the Batallion commander wants?"

"I see you're obviously not in the Army, Lieutenant......."

The crews attended the drill meeting, went back to their birds, doffed the LBE and helmets, wiped the camo off their faces, and donned their green mesh survival vests and helmets, and got back in their birds.

I couldn't help but think what an absolute waste of time that had all been for them.
 
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We've luckily been able to kill camo paint because of the fire hazard, but everything else is as real or worse now days.

I have to take 2 different types of body armor to the field because some E-9 refuses to let the aviators be different during field problems.

And meanwhile in the world of important crap we should actually be worried about.... S6 still can't get the network up so we have no way of getting the ACO.... screw it just stay really low and everything will be fine right?


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