A look at EAS in AZ

[wheelsup]

A 208 or 402 would be a good choice IMO.

A 208 would be half the cost, roughly, as a B1900 and a 402 would be what, maybe 1/3 the cost? Only issue with a 402 would be bulking out if you have lots of baggage. Only problem with them is the altitudes to clear some mountain ranges under IFR out west.

I know there was a NM operation running PC-12's under an EAS contract, but they went belly up.

 

[Boris Badenov]

There's a certain 135 that shall not be named for fear of invoking it that runs a poop ton of 208s on EAS (or EASish) routes.

 

[dasleben]

There's a certain 135 that shall not be named for fear of invoking it that runs a poop ton of 208s on EAS (or EASish) routes.

I know which one you're speaking of...I interviewed there about a week before I interviewed at Cape, and was offered the job at both companies. I dodged that bullet.

 

[FloridaLarry]

To be rational, EAS needs a new business model

1. Where valid, today's 19 PAX and up model, x miles from any other EAS service. PAX ceiling to get off the EAS dole.

2. 2nd tier: Smaller A/C serving lower daily PAX count. Bottom PAX threshold # to end service as not needed for subsidy.

3. No service w/in X miles of other airline service, EAS or other. They can drive to nearby airports.

These issues should cut +/- one third of current service and wasted dollars, refocus on what was intended after deregulation.

(As always, Alaska has different needs....)

EAS has become a local pork-barrel issue, not a service to the deprived public thing.

I say this after five plus years as an EAS airport board member, token non-pilot ( I was the airline guy...) in KS.

 

[KSCessnaDriver]

A 208 or 402 would be a good choice IMO.

A 208 would be half the cost, roughly, as a B1900 and a 402 would be what, maybe 1/3 the cost? Only issue with a 402 would be bulking out if you have lots of baggage. Only problem with them is the altitudes to clear some mountain wages under IFR out west.

I know there was a NM operation running PC-12's under an EAS contract, but they went belly up.

Or the new Tecnam 2012 that Cape Air is involved with. I did a brief and limited study on direct operating costs of the various 9 seaters (C208, 402, PC-12, PA-31) and nothing could beat the 402 in direct operating costs. The Tecnam, IMO, is something that could do that, or come very close.

 

[scooter2525]

PA-34. Turbo, AFKI, decent payload.

 

[ppragman]

210 withthe known ice - yes they can be run 135 pax. That or a Lance with TKS would be better becuase of the cargo door. But, then again, why go IFR, go VFR in 207s for most of the trips, and run a Navajo on bad weather days.

 

[dasleben]

Senecas and 210s still don't match a 402. A 402C can haul 9 passengers, plus bags, at 180 lbs/hr, with plenty of power to spare. They really don't make them like they used to. Lack of pressurization is an issue in AZ, however.

 

[ppragman]

I

Senecas and 210s still don't match a 402. A 402C can haul 9 passengers, plus bags, at 180 lbs/hr, with plenty of power to spare. They really don't make them like they used to. Lack of pressurization is an issue in AZ, however.

I'd be interested in a comparison to a caravan. The van is supposedly cheaper than a navajo.

 

[Blackhawk]

Nothing more than handouts for pilots.

 

[scooter2525]

Senecas and 210s still don't match a 402. A 402C can haul 9 passengers, plus bags, at 180 lbs/hr, with plenty of power to spare. They really don't make them like they used to. Lack of pressurization is an issue in AZ, however.

9? I'm not questioning you but I would like to see a cabin configuration.

 

[jrh]

9? I'm not questioning you but I would like to see a cabin configuration.

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/5/8/7/0856785.jpg

Four rows of two, plus the copilot seat.

 

[scooter2525]

http://cdn-www.airliners.net/aviation-photos/photos/5/8/7/0856785.jpg

Four rows of two, plus the copilot seat.

Thanks.

How does company/pilots feel about having people ride up front?

 

[dasleben]

Thanks.

How does company/pilots feel about having people ride up front?

I didn't care. I preferred to have everyone in back, but if it was necessary for someone to ride up front, or someone really wanted to, it was fine.

 

[jrh]

How does company/pilots feel about having people ride up front?

The company doesn't *feel* one way or the other...the seat is there as a source of revenue, so they prefer it be occupied, along with the eight in back, I suppose

Individual captains are all over the spectrum with their attitudes. Some will do whatever they can to avoid pax up front unless absolutely necessary for weight and balance. They get annoyed by passengers watching their every move, trying to talk in flight, getting in the way of the controls, etc. I consider those captains to be thin-skinned pansies who probably should have spent more time flight instructing, and I wonder why they came to my operator instead of flying freight.

Many captains are neutral and just show up and fly. Pax up front is simply part of the job.

A few, such as myself, actually like pax up front. It keeps me from getting bored, I occasionally get to talk to somebody interesting, and I enjoy having an audience see how awesome I am. I'll invite people up front if I can tell they're really interested in flying but too scared to ask for the seat.

 

[JOEFRIDAY2]

The company doesn't *feel* one way or the other...the seat is there as a source of revenue, so they prefer it be occupied, along with the eight in back, I suppose

Individual captains are all over the spectrum with their attitudes. Some will do whatever they can to avoid pax up front unless absolutely necessary for weight and balance. They get annoyed by passengers watching their every move, trying to talk in flight, getting in the way of the controls, etc. I consider those captains to be thin-skinned pansies who probably should have spent more time flight instructing, and I wonder why they came to my operator instead of flying freight.

Many captains are neutral and just show up and fly. Pax up front is simply part of the job.

A few, such as myself, actually like pax up front. It keeps me from getting bored, I occasionally get to talk to somebody interesting, and I enjoy having an audience see how awesome I am. I'll invite people up front if I can tell they're really interested in flying but too scared to ask for the seat.

And that is what is known as great customer service! If were were one of the hiring Gods at the larger airlines, I would hire you over a lot of others with 3000+ TT just from your customer service skills.

Joe

 

[Roger Roger]

And that is what is known as great customer service! If were were one of the hiring Gods at the larger airlines, I would hire you over a lot of others with 3000+ TT just from your customer service skills.

Joe

Google "MOCHa HAGoTDI"

 

[Itchy]

EAS needs to go away. Sorry to all the folks flying those routes here, but the way I see it, it's pure pork barrel from an age gone by. EAS serves many airports with an hour drive to a major airport. It irks me when I write out the IRS check that Aunt Edna gets cheap airfare out of her cow town to avoid a three hour drive. If you don't like where you live, either drive or move.

 

[JOEFRIDAY2]

Google "MOCHa HAGoTDI"

Make Our Customers Happy And Have A Good Time Doing It.

I like that!

Joe

 

[KSCessnaDriver]

EAS needs to go away. Sorry to all the folks flying those routes here, but the way I see it, it's pure pork barrel from an age gone by. EAS serves many airports with an hour drive to a major airport. It irks me when I write out the IRS check that Aunt Edna gets cheap airfare out of her cow town to avoid a three hour drive. If you don't like where you live, either drive or move.

Yup, lets get rid of a 100 million dollar program but ignore the hundred billion dollar problems. Makes us all feel good and do nothing. I'm all for cutting EAS, but it should be way down the list of places to start.