Republic Hires 430 Hr Pilot!

What are the chances of two guys making the same exact error...

Hmm... Especially... Aww, lemme just watch very closely and take some more notes...

By all means, continue!
 
Doug Taylor said:
My spidey sense is tingling....
Click to expand...

jtrain609 said:
You're not the only one.
Click to expand...

Doug Taylor said:
What are the chances of two guys making the same exact error...

Hmm... Especially... Aww, lemme just watch very closely and take some more notes...

By all means, continue!
Click to expand...

Is there something you guys are trying to get at???
If there is I'd prefer you come right out and say it, I feel like everyone here is talking about me for some reason and I would like to know what I am being accused of.
 
Nah, it's ok, I'm just an interested observer.

I'm just reading my horoscope before my training period, wondering what's in store for the summer! ;)
 
AmazingPilot said:
I don't know what your background is and I really don't care, but a little repect for your fellow pilot from time to time will go a long way.

I am not trying to insult you, so please don't take it that way.
Click to expand...

That should go the same way for a Captain having respect for his FO and vice versa.

Nevermind.
 
There are a lot of good posts about the "teaching" and learning that is taking place in the cockpit, and what is appropriate. We actually cover this in our recurrent CRM classes this year, and it is by far the subject closest to my heart of all those presented to the pilots: Mentoring.

An airline captain is not, and should not, be an instructor, per se. However, the captain does have a tremendous responsibility on the flight deck, because like it or not, they are setting an example. Some type of mentoring is occuring whether or not the captain has chosen to participate actively in the process or not. First officers learn by observation and emulation. We can all agree that in flying, we learn from what we observe.

I know that having been a low-time new hire myself, the only reason I have been fairly successful in my career is directly attributable to those captains that I flew with when I was getting started. They recognized that I wanted to learn, and bothered to take the time to introduce me to new concepts and new ideas. As an example, they explained why it is a good idea to fly at 200 knots when departing the wrong direction. Why go fast away from where you want to go? That is not taught in new-hire training. Separate from flying skills, they also involved me in the decision making processes of the flight, so it was not a new concept to me when I upgraded last year.

As a new hire, a first officer is expected to have a good foundation of flying abilities, knowledge, and decision making capabilities to be effective as the SIC. There are things that just cannot be taught in the classroom, and can only be learned on the line. That is where the captain comes in. Our only argument can be whether or not the current batch of pilots is in fact coming in prepared with the basics. It might be because of attitude, or possibly a training background, but whatever the reason, some new hires are not coming in prepared. For those that do come in prepared, they cannot be expected to learn everything in the classroom. That is just yet another reason why that fourth stripe adds so much weight on the shoulders of a captain.

Honestly, I don't care how much flight time a new hire has. I just hope they have a good attitude, and recognize their limitations and their abilities. By recognizing their weaknesses, they know exactly what to work on. However, it should not be expected that any captain needs to "teach" a new hire how to fly an airplane. There is a big difference between "mentoring" and "teaching."
 
FlyChicaga said:
There are a lot of good posts about the "teaching" and learning that is taking place in the cockpit, and what is appropriate. We actually cover this in our recurrent CRM classes this year, and it is by far the subject closest to my heart of all those presented to the pilots: Mentoring.

An airline captain is not, and should not, be an instructor, per se. However, the captain does have a tremendous responsibility on the flight deck, because like it or not, they are setting an example. Some type of mentoring is occuring whether or not the captain has chosen to participate actively in the process or not. First officers learn by observation and emulation. We can all agree that in flying, we learn from what we observe.

I know that having been a low-time new hire myself, the only reason I have been fairly successful in my career is directly attributable to those captains that I flew with when I was getting started. They recognized that I wanted to learn, and bothered to take the time to introduce me to new concepts and new ideas. As an example, they explained why it is a good idea to fly at 200 knots when departing the wrong direction. Why go fast away from where you want to go? That is not taught in new-hire training. Separate from flying skills, they also involved me in the decision making processes of the flight, so it was not a new concept to me when I upgraded last year.

As a new hire, a first officer is expected to have a good foundation of flying abilities, knowledge, and decision making capabilities to be effective as the SIC. There are things that just cannot be taught in the classroom, and can only be learned on the line. That is where the captain comes in. Our only argument can be whether or not the current batch of pilots is in fact coming in prepared with the basics. It might be because of attitude, or possibly a training background, but whatever the reason, some new hires are not coming in prepared. For those that do come in prepared, they cannot be expected to learn everything in the classroom. That is just yet another reason why that fourth stripe adds so much weight on the shoulders of a captain.

Honestly, I don't care how much flight time a new hire has. I just hope they have a good attitude, and recognize their limitations and their abilities. By recognizing their weaknesses, they know exactly what to work on. However, it should not be expected that any captain needs to "teach" a new hire how to fly an airplane. There is a big difference between "mentoring" and "teaching."
Click to expand...

Great post!!! Thanks for sharing. :)
 
There are a lot of good posts about the "teaching" and learning that is taking place in the cockpit, and what is appropriate. We actually cover this in our recurrent CRM classes this year, and it is by far the subject closest to my heart of all those presented to the pilots: Mentoring.

An airline captain is not, and should not, be an instructor, per se. However, the captain does have a tremendous responsibility on the flight deck, because like it or not, they are setting an example. Some type of mentoring is occuring whether or not the captain has chosen to participate actively in the process or not. First officers learn by observation and emulation. We can all agree that in flying, we learn from what we observe.

I know that having been a low-time new hire myself, the only reason I have been fairly successful in my career is directly attributable to those captains that I flew with when I was getting started. They recognized that I wanted to learn, and bothered to take the time to introduce me to new concepts and new ideas. As an example, they explained why it is a good idea to fly at 200 knots when departing the wrong direction. Why go fast away from where you want to go? That is not taught in new-hire training. Separate from flying skills, they also involved me in the decision making processes of the flight, so it was not a new concept to me when I upgraded last year.

As a new hire, a first officer is expected to have a good foundation of flying abilities, knowledge, and decision making capabilities to be effective as the SIC. There are things that just cannot be taught in the classroom, and can only be learned on the line. That is where the captain comes in. Our only argument can be whether or not the current batch of pilots is in fact coming in prepared with the basics. It might be because of attitude, or possibly a training background, but whatever the reason, some new hires are not coming in prepared. For those that do come in prepared, they cannot be expected to learn everything in the classroom. That is just yet another reason why that fourth stripe adds so much weight on the shoulders of a captain.

Honestly, I don't care how much flight time a new hire has. I just hope they have a good attitude, and recognize their limitations and their abilities. By recognizing their weaknesses, they know exactly what to work on. However, it should not be expected that any captain needs to "teach" a new hire how to fly an airplane. There is a big difference between "mentoring" and "teaching."
Click to expand...


:yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat:
 
I just finished reading this entire thread..man am I exhausted now..specially since I took the IFR and CFII writtens today. Reading this entire thread sure was more tiring but *way* more fun:)
I wish I had some to add but I really don't. Maybe in a few years I will be able to post an interesting opinion in this thread...for now I will keep reading and reading...and learning!

Does anyone know why God "gave" us two ears and one mouth? Anyone? 777forever?
 
I don't know what spidey sense means but I definetly don't get the warm and fuzzies with the thought of hopping on an RJ and it being a Dual Cross Country upfront.
I know I definetly want no part of it and that's not regional bashing. You FOs out there better take this stuff personally because you are on the same playing field as these <500hr guys. If one puts a smoking hole in the ground like Mark was predicting and the traveling public gets the big picture of the problem when grandma Jean walks into the plane she'll look at you and think oh must be one of those young kids that isn't qualified. Not the image I want to have.
I fly a Beech Baron. I probably receive as much respect from some pilots as the skycab out front...At least he wears a hat. I have a high time run here so I get alot of SICs. These guys have around 1,000 hours. I have to play part instructor for the first two weeks because these guys are behind all the time.
I hear alot from our new Lear SICs about how much they are behind the aircraft and how new everything is. These guys have 2,000+hours and most have well over 1,000 mult PIC, night, IFR.
Basically what I saying is there really isn't much more a 600 hour pilot will know then a 430hr pilot. And I wouldn't think we were much safer with a 1,000 hour guy in the right seat. And don't think that becuase they flew seminoles thats a golden ticket.
The problem lies with the training programs. They need to be designed to wash out the guys that didn't get quality training. If this is something that is hard to do....effing do it!!!! That's the job of a training department. Although I have no direct experience but this is why I assume the military can have <1000 hour guys flying jets....with afterburners GASP.
Don't hate on that newly minted FO with his IPOD and jetcareers forehead sunglasses. It's not his fault. He didn't want to flight instruct and the airline hired him. Don't blame him that they passed him through training.

Disclaimer: I'm not in the 121 world. Just my observations.
 
FWIW, guys in the military complain about low-timers, too. Some fighter pilots say the biggest threat to their safety is not surface-to-air missiles or anti-aircraft artillery, but a new wingman fresh outta RTU.
 
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