I'm not saying it was aliens but...

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Manned space travel? Probably.

What’s been accomplished with unmanned space exploration is bonkers, though.

As usual, we define words very differently.

“Bonkers” to me would be near light travel, permanent installations on multiple planets and moons, etc. We’ve basically sent a few probes out that have some cool gizmos. The movie 2001: A Space Odyssey wasn’t supposed to be outlandish. It was what they thought we would be doing by then. And here we are a quarter century after that having barely scratched the surface of near space travel. Yet people want me to believe that we’ve got machines capable of defying physics? Sorry, I ain’t buying it.

 

[ppragman]

Manned space travel? Probably.

I know it’s is fun to crap all over Elon - hell, I enjoy it, but the control theory and software that’s gone into making the Falcon first stage boost back and land is, seriously, “bonkers.”

Granted that’s not “manned” per se - but yeah it can be.

We maybe (maybe) could have done something like that during the golden era but I doubt it. In my opinion it is • astounding.

Not being blown away but what’s been done in our lifetime in space is really a bummer and I see this take everywhere. Manned space flight is incredible right now. Not as advanced as we’d want it to be, but incredible.

 

[Roger Roger]

I’m with Todd on this, as long as we’re still using reaction propulsion it’s pretty hard to call anything a real breakthrough in space travel

 

[ppragman]

As usual, we define words very differently.

“Bonkers” to me would be near light travel, permanent installations on multiple planets and moons, etc. We’ve basically sent a few probes out that have some cool gizmos. The movie 2001: A Space Odyssey wasn’t supposed to be outlandish. It was what they thought we would be doing by then. And here we are a quarter century after that having barely scratched the surface of near space travel. Yet people want me to believe that we’ve got machines capable of defying physics? Sorry, I ain’t buying it.

“Defying” physics is silly - defying what we know about physics. We’ve simply chosen to be more interested in information for the last several decades than hardcore mechanical engineering projects.

I am not totally convinced that this isn’t some sort of heretofore not understood natural phenomenon either.

perhaps the reason these don’t seem affected by internal stresses is because they aren’t a physical thing that can be torn apart by those sorts of forces.

My cat thinks the laser pointer defies explanation, but it’s not a real physical thing… it just looks like one.

 

[ppragman]

I’m with Todd on this, as long as we’re still using reaction propulsion it’s pretty hard to call anything a real breakthrough in space travel

Hard core disagree. The advances in engineering have been straight up phenomenal. We have rockets that land like buck rogers now… that’s amazing in ways that I don’t think most people truly get.

The forces on those things are utterly incredible. Would I have preferred we kept Apollo going? Absolutely, but yeah - we didn’t. But still what we have done is utterly mind blowing still.

 

[zmiller4]

As usual, we define words very differently.

“Bonkers” to me would be near light travel, permanent installations on multiple planets and moons, etc. We’ve basically sent a few probes out that have some cool gizmos. The movie 2001: A Space Odyssey wasn’t supposed to be outlandish. It was what they thought we would be doing by then. And here we are a quarter century after that having barely scratched the surface of near space travel. Yet people want me to believe that we’ve got machines capable of defying physics? Sorry, I ain’t buying it.

Fair point. We were also supposed to be going to work in flying cars according to 1960’s science fiction. I think it’s unwise to hinge our expectations off what science fiction authors believe is going to happen—because that represents nothing more than a guess at what might be technologically possible, rather than what’s economically and politically feasible.

We landed a probe on a damn asteroid, sampled it, and are returning it to Earth for study (fun fact: one of the people responsible for that mission is a registered member here). That’s pretty impressive to me.

 

[ppragman]

Who’s the badass that walks among us?

 

[derg]

Manned space travel… meh, but there's some pretty interesting things going on. But unless it's a weapon of destruction, funding is lackluster.

I would absolutely LOVE a more robust manned space program, but as long as funding is in the hands of people like Kevin McCarthy and unreliable billionaires like Elon, I think we're just going to have really cool internet for the time being.

We're literally flying helicopters around Mars.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=thk4Rha-fTk

What's exciting is crowd-funding the solar sail project for proof of concept: (and here's shameless plug to join other nerds like me at The Planetary Society

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=at_NwEKlafY

 

[Richman]

Have you not watched the gun camera videos of the "Tylenol shaped" UFOs?

2 Navy Airmen and an Object That ‘Accelerated Like Nothing I’ve Ever Seen’ (Published 2017)

What began as a training mission took a bizarre turn in 2004, an encounter that caught the attention of a Pentagon program investigating U.F.O.s.

www.nytimes.com

Was it pretty and white, with wheels, curtains and a red stripe?

 

[derg]

Was it pretty and white, with wheels, curtains and a red stripe?

And the boys go into business
And marry and raise a family
In boxes made of ticky tacky!

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

“Defying” physics is silly - defying what we know about physics.

True, that’s a better way of saying it.

I am not totally convinced that this isn’t some sort of heretofore not understood natural phenomenon either.

perhaps the reason these don’t seem affected by internal stresses is because they aren’t a physical thing that can be torn apart by those sorts of forces.

My cat thinks the laser pointer defies explanation, but it’s not a real physical thing… it just looks like one.

Again, while anything is possible, I just don’t see that as plausible. We aren’t talking ball lightning here. It’s clearly an object that is reacting to the movement of the aircraft pursuing it. And yes, you could say the same thing about a laser pointer. But that’s because an intelligent being is controlling the laser pointer.

Fair point. We were also supposed to be going to work in flying cars according to 1960’s science fiction.

I’m not talking science fiction, I’m talking what NASA people were expecting. Remember, we were promised a space shuttle that would launch weekly. That promise was made nearly 50 years ago.

 

[Apophis]

I don’t think the Pentagon would be out there openly admitting to having national security concerns, no. Nor do I think they would get the pilots who recorded the footage to go out and lie about it on national TV. I think those are some pretty fantastical excuses to try to explain this away. I think some of you have taken skepticism (a generally fantastic way of looking at the world) to an absurd level to try to explain away obviously very concerning things.

Look, I’m a raging atheist and skeptic and I 100% agree. The problem with the skeptic community is that in situations like this, they almost become a religion in terms of skepticism for skepticisms sake. I honestly think some of these people would still try to use the weather anomaly or some other excuse even if an alien craft touched down in friggin Washington DC.

It’s okay to admit we don’t know what this stuff is. It’s also okay to admit it might not be from here. Some skeptics are so afraid of the stigma associated with admitting this, they’ll cling to tenuous, inaccurate explanations with the fervor of a religious nut.

You can’t tell me that tic-tac incident was some sort of weather event. That’s complete and utter horse doodoo. And that’s just one of several events that defy explanation.

 

[Boris Badenov]

It’s okay to admit we don’t know what this stuff is. It’s also okay to admit it might not be from here.

Sure. I mean it might have come through with Ant Man from the Quantum Realm or whatever, and comic book explanations of real physical phenomenon might be 100% accurate. Anything is possible! But it's not even approaching likely enough to be taken seriously by grown-ups.

 

[ppragman]

We're literally flying helicopters around Mars.

Right… that’s utterly incredible to me

Again, while anything is possible, I just don’t see that as plausible. We aren’t talking ball lightning here

I don’t know, to be perfectly honest. I’m not discounting aliens to be clear - or some hypothetical species of super squids from the depths of our own oceans or other such flights of imagination.

But… part of me says that leaping to the alien conclusion or “it’s intelligently controlled” may be an oversight.

Hell maybe it is “aliens” but they’re not intelligent they’re actually some sort of critter that just lives in space - like the space whale and periodically they decide to check planets out.

But that’s because an intelligent being is controlling the laser pointer

That intelligent being could be human though too right? What better technology to confuse your enemies than a something that looks like it’s accelerating at wild speeds.

I don’t think we should rule out human trickery either. Maybe we can’t build tick tacs because the stresses would make it fly apart but maybe someone’s invented some cool trick with lasers or something.

Regardless, I don’t disagree with you in principle - like I hope it’s aliens and I think that it may be… but I don’t weight that probability very highly in my mind. It’s probably something less exciting that we don’t understand like a 4D rotating space rock or some cool laser based system that can make it appear like solid structures. Hell even “space whale” sounds more plausible to me than “intelligent alien spaceships or their drones.”

You can’t tell me that tic-tac incident was some sort of weather event.

I mean, probably not I agree, but I think we should keep a really open mind here. Sprites coming out of the top of TStorms was seen as fanciful until just a few years ago. Maybe it’s not a weather event but something natural and equally strange.

But it's not even approaching likely enough to be taken seriously by grown-ups.

I disagree with this. If it is aliens then it’s basically earth shatteringly important that the grownups study this and not kooky crystal dudes or Tom Delonge.

I really appreciate the fact that this subject isn’t taboo anymore in academia.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

I suppose we just disagree then on what is most plausible. I find it incredibly unlikely to be man-made or natural phenomenon, while I find aliens to be pretty high on the list. I would also say unmanned alien probes, time traveling humans, or inter-dimensional beings to also be plausible answers. None of these are ruled out by what we know of physics, and they would fit far better with the evidence we have at this point. In my opinion, of course. I’m not saying you’re wrong. Just that we weight the probabilities differently.

 

[ppragman]

I suppose we just disagree then on what is most plausible. I find it incredibly unlikely to be man-made or natural phenomenon, while I find aliens to be pretty high on the list. I would also say unmanned alien probes, time traveling humans, or inter-dimensional beings to also be plausible answers. None of these are ruled out by what we know of physics, and they would fit far better with the evidence we have at this point. In my opinion, of course. I’m not saying you’re wrong. Just that we weight the probabilities differently.

That’s fair - I’d argue that the probability for a lot of this stuff is unknowable presently… hence my hesitation to lean too far in either direction. I frankly have no idea what the hell is going on. Don’t get me wrong… I’m definitely hoping for aliens… but I don’t think any of this is “knowable” - like how can I rule out crazy government stuff at this stage? Maybe someone invented a reactionless drive in the 90s and it’s been kept in some lab or whatever.

Until we know more I guess I’m weighting most things equally…

 

[Boris Badenov]

Lol. If they're aliens, they're the stupidest aliens imaginable. They can toy with the fundamentals of mass, velocity, electricity, magnetism, and energy like a cat with a mouse, but they can't manage to stay off the TV. Is humanity really so lonely that it needs to go inventing imaginary friends?

 

[derg]

Lol. If they're aliens, they're the stupidest aliens imaginable. They can toy with the fundamentals of mass, velocity, electricity, magnetism, and energy like a cat with a mouse, but they can't manage to stay off the TV. Is humanity really so lonely that it needs to go inventing imaginary friends?

Maybe they have a trailer park fetish?

I don't know if an alien race has the ability to master galaxy-scale travel is going to find a planet of murder monkeys that interesting to spend the resources to visit.

 

[Apophis]

Sure. I mean it might have come through with Ant Man from the Quantum Realm or whatever, and comic book explanations of real physical phenomenon might be 100% accurate. Anything is possible! But it's not even approaching likely enough to be taken seriously by grown-ups.

Awesome to see you have everything figured out!

Your arrogance is exactly what I’m talking about.

 

[Apophis]

Lol. If they're aliens, they're the stupidest aliens imaginable. They can toy with the fundamentals of mass, velocity, electricity, magnetism, and energy like a cat with a mouse, but they can't manage to stay off the TV. Is humanity really so lonely that it needs to go inventing imaginary friends?

Again, this is what I’m talking about. Extreme skeptics can’t handle the idea they might be wrong, and that their nonsense explanations might not be true, so you resort to jokes and name calling to cope.

You’re honestly no different than a religious nut.