SVFR

esa17 said:
Maybe he is, maybe he isn't. How many pilots do you know that won't stall an airplane because someone told them it was dangerous? I see this question as "how difficult is it" and no where do I see "should I?" Maybe by asking the question he's removing a fear an instructor placed in him.

SVFR can kill you but so can severe clear. If the OP is expanding his knowledge base and trying to become a well rounded aviator then good on him. If he's in a situation where he "needs to go" and get an SVFR after being an ink wet private he should probably go get more coffee.

Jumping all over the kid for asking a question is bad joo-joo.
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I don't think anyone jumped all over him. I gave my opinion. Just because my opinion was for him to not go doesn't mean i was chastising him. At the private pilot level there is rarely a "need to go" situation. JFK jr "needed to go", now he's dead. NTSB reports are filled with this crap. People at that experience level really shouldn't push thier luck.

I feel like this is such a clear cut situation and honestly I can't believe some of the responses. It's such an easy "don't go" it shouldn't even need explaining.
 
esa17 said:
SVFR can kill you but so can severe clear. If the OP is expanding his knowledge base and trying to become a well rounded aviator then good on him. If he's in a situation where he "needs to go" and get an SVFR after being an ink wet private he should probably go get more coffee.
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...or an instrument rating.

:popcorn:
 
Roger said:
This is true. I used SVFR a few times getting in and out of the home 'drome when I was CFI-ing.

To address the OP's question, the trick is often finding out who to ask for your SVFR clearance... If you're looking to depart a Class D field with 2 SM visibility, it's easy...just tell ground on your initial callup what you want to do.

Now, if you're entering a Class E surface area in the middle of nowhere and all you've got is a sectional chart, finding the center frequency to use to get your SVFR might be a bit of a challenge.
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Which is why you should have your AFD, or "Alaska/Pacific Chart Supplement" with you at all times.
 
Roger said:
Now, if you're entering a Class E surface area in the middle of nowhere and all you've got is a sectional chart, finding the center frequency to use to get your SVFR might be a bit of a challenge.
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Without going into a ton of detail, most ARTCCs can't authorize SVFR into most class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communication (most importantly, on the ground) with pilots. Unless there is a RCAG on or near the field, you're not going to be able to get SVFR outside of an airport with a control tower.
 
Barty said:
Without going into a ton of detail, most ARTCCs can't authorize SVFR into most class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communication (most importantly, on the ground) with pilots. Unless there is a RCAG on or near the field, you're not going to be able to get SVFR outside of an airport with a control tower.
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I did not know that. Interesting. My only experience with SVFR has been in/out of a Delta with TRSA.
 
Barty said:
Without going into a ton of detail, most ARTCCs can't authorize SVFR into most class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communication (most importantly, on the ground) with pilots. Unless there is a RCAG on or near the field, you're not going to be able to get SVFR outside of an airport with a control tower.
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Can you source this information? I'd be interested to read a little more about it. Thanks.



Topic at hand:

Special VFR on a risk scale can easily be high risk. It certainly can result in a risk level unmanageable or barely manageable to the low time or rusty pilot. However, like any aviation task, risks of SVFR can be monitored, mitigated, and prepared for by the proficient pilot.



OP:

I applaud you for taking the effort to further your knowledge. I suggest you go with an instructor, seeking out a day where SVFR is necessary, to gain experience. Furthermore, I would request, in advance, that the instructor have some lesson planned on SVFR operations for you when the day comes. While you're at it, put it towards your wings program so you don't need a BFR in the coming year or so.

This would be a great time to put together a personal limitations worksheet. Document every wind, weather, ATC, or other (SVFR, night, Class B, etc) limitations you might give yourself for pattern, local, and XC flights. Fly by these limitations. Limitations shall not be changed on the day of a flight for the purposes of conducting that flight.
 
Barty said:
most ARTCCs can't authorize SVFR into most class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communication (most importantly, on the ground) with pilots.
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Hmmm, that communication is a requirement for class E surface areas.
 
Barty said:
Without going into a ton of detail, most ARTCCs can't authorize SVFR into most class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communication (most importantly, on the ground) with pilots. Unless there is a RCAG on or near the field, you're not going to be able to get SVFR outside of an airport with a control tower.
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How many places with a surface area don't have an RCAG? Every place I've ever seen that has a surface area has an RCAG, or one near by. Its kind of necessary for getting IFR clearances into and out of there. Plus, if you don't have access to an RCAG, you can get a special from the FSS too. Done that plenty of times as well, works great. So if you've got a nearby RCO you can get your clearance out of the surface area. Usually they have you call them on the RCO when you're clear, and give you a void time.
 
Barty said:
Without going into a ton of detail, most ARTCCs can't authorize SVFR into most class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communication (most importantly, on the ground) with pilots. Unless there is a RCAG on or near the field, you're not going to be able to get SVFR outside of an airport with a control tower.
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not true you get a SVFR clrn the same way you would get a IFR clrn if there is no RCO at a uncontrolled a/p, find the phone number and call the fac direct or call FSS for a relay.i dont know what they are teaching you where you work but thats ATC 101.i spent 20 years at ZAU so i know and have done this on mid shifts a few times.
 
It seems to vary airport to airport...back home, KPWT has an RCO for Seattle Approach, while KCLM has an RCO for Seattle Radio. Out here, KTVF is listed as using the KGFK RCAG for clearances, yet it's Echo to the surface. MSP center frequently loses radio contact with me out there. I'd have to agree that it's probably a roll of the dice on whether or not the controlling agency will close down the airspace to all other IFR traffic to allow an SVFR arrival or departure, and that the type of communication available at the airport plays a part in that decision.
 
ppragman said:
How many places with a surface area don't have an RCAG? Every place I've ever seen that has a surface area has an RCAG, or one near by. Its kind of necessary for getting IFR clearances into and out of there. Plus, if you don't have access to an RCAG, you can get a special from the FSS too. Done that plenty of times as well, works great. So if you've got a nearby RCO you can get your clearance out of the surface area. Usually they have you call them on the RCO when you're clear, and give you a void time.
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We have been briefed that we can't do SVFR in most of our class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communications, but it is possible this is a local order only. I do know that we (Memphis Center) have a couple of class E surface areas that lack RCOs because of a screw up in the transition to L-M, and I was led to believe that this was a nationwide problem according to the person giving the briefing.
 
Barty said:
We have been briefed that we can't do SVFR in most of our class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communications, but it is possible this is a local order only. I do know that we (Memphis Center) have a couple of class E surface areas that lack RCOs because of a screw up in the transition to L-M, and I was led to believe that this was a nationwide problem according to the person giving the briefing.
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I wouldn't know about the rest of the lower 48 states as in Alaska there is no Lockheed Martin FSS. But up north, you can get a special either from center through the RCAG, or through flight service if you can't patch through.
 
Barty said:
We have been briefed that we can't do SVFR in most of our class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communications, but it is possible this is a local order only. I do know that we (Memphis Center) have a couple of class E surface areas that lack RCOs because of a screw up in the transition to L-M, and I was led to believe that this was a nationwide problem according to the person giving the briefing.
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Back when the transition happened, I seem to recall there were a few places right in the SoCal basin where you couldn't reach FSS by radio for a clearance. The use of cell phones is now permitted... :laff: The net result is Socal TRACON has a direct-dial number for picking up your clearances, although I've never asked 'em for Special VFR, they will happily give you a clearance accompanied by a void time of "two minutes from now" :bandit:. I've never called FSS in SoCal to get an IFR clearance, but this is a byproduct of where I operate and not necessarily how it works anywhere else.
 
Barty said:
We have been briefed that we can't do SVFR in most of our class E surface areas due to a lack of direct two-way radio communications, but it is possible this is a local order only. I do know that we (Memphis Center) have a couple of class E surface areas that lack RCOs because of a screw up in the transition to L-M, and I was led to believe that this was a nationwide problem according to the person giving the briefing.
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well that explains it, more FFA stupidity ask you masters how are you suppose give an IFR clrn under the same conditions?
 
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