FAA teams up with Gulfstream

Say it ain't so!!!!







Either that is the first time I have heard Falcon referred to as FAA or I have missed a lot. I wasn't sure what to expect when clicking the linky. I can't believe Falcon would do this.
 
Oh, it's been happening for a while. Kind of like how Europe-American Aviation in Naples, FL refers to themselves as EAA.

My only question is what do you do at the end of the program?
 
Interesting.

Surreal1221 is instructing there I thought. I'm interested in his perspective above board or through a PM. ;)
 
Interesting.

Surreal1221 is instructing there I thought. I'm interested in his perspective above board or through a PM. ;)


I didnt realize he was instructing there. I know he has been strangely silent anytime anyone tries to mention Falcon and Gulfstream.
 
...heard Falcon referred to as FAA or I have missed a lot...I can't believe Falcon would do this.


I don't see Falcon referring themselves as FAA on the page. The JetCareers post has a misleading subject line but that's all.

We have had two ways to get to our website for over 5 years...

www.falconaviationacademy.com
www.faa-air.com (obviously shorter and easier to type)

There is no deliberate attempt to appear to be "the FAA", that would be ridiculous and poor marketing technique.
 
Interesting.

Surreal1221 is instructing there I thought. I'm interested in his perspective above board or through a PM. ;)

Well, haven't been an employee for Falcon in over a year. My perspective to follow.

I didnt realize he was instructing there. I know he has been strangely silent anytime anyone tries to mention Falcon and Gulfstream.

Strangely silent?

Seriously? Let's look at a couple of things:

1) This forum is not at the top of my monitoring list - since well - I don't have a connection with the company any longer.
2) I have, in the past, recommended veterans to attend Falcon's training as I feel it is top notch and second to none for the cost and overall training experience when utilizing VA Benefits. On that note, in the last three months I've had previous service member associates inquiring about flight training and where to go. I direct them towards Falcon and let them make up their own mind, and I'll also tell them to stay well clear of anything with the name Gulfstream on it.
3) My wife delivered our first child Friday and I haven't really bothered to spend much time on any forums.
4) Well - strangely silent? Give me a break.

As far as my perspective on this relationship.

It's just as bad as ATP (or any school) joining forces with Gulfstream and marketing Gulfstream's internship program as an ethical way to enter the profession.

Really not much else to say about it. It's a downright sad state of affairs and it's unfortunate that schools across this country are breeding a class of pilots who will think that Pay For Training establishments are a normal and natural thing - compounding the fact that Gulfstream Airlines has SALARIED First Officers (not the ones PAYING the company to have a job) out on the street looking for work. It's a ridiculous business practice and one that severely impacts the long term pay, benefits, and quality of life outcomes for every professional part 121 pilot.

Bad is bad, no matter what curtain it is hiding behind.
 
I don't see Falcon referring themselves as FAA on the page. The JetCareers post has a misleading subject line but that's all.

There is no deliberate attempt to appear to be "the FAA", that would be ridiculous and poor marketing technique.


Just to be clear, I didn't mean I could not believe Falcon was calling themselves the FAA, I meant teaming up with Gulfstream.


I don't think the advertising will effect the training, but I hate to see a good company mix themselves with a place like Gulfstream PFJ.
 
...I meant teaming up with Gulfstream.

Well, to be completly honest, Falcon is interested in multiple avenues to secure financing for the training needed to achieve their career. With Sallie Mae going down the tube there is not much left in terms of vocational based training that offers differed payment, reasonable interest rates and large disbursements (since we all know how expense flight training can get)
 
Well, haven't been an employee for Falcon in over a year. My perspective to follow.

Yes, as I was looking at your signature line, I reminded myself you had transitioned from Falcon long ago. Lack of attention to detail on my part.

3) My wife delivered our first child Friday and I haven't really bothered to spend much time on any forums.

This point of fact more than anything else deserves a congratulations. TRUE responsibility now begins. Any other time prior to having a child is simply practice. The true test is now with no failure rate expected.

Again, my congrats to you!

As far as my perspective on this relationship.

It's just as bad as ATP (or any school) joining forces with Gulfstream and marketing Gulfstream's internship program as an ethical way to enter the profession.

Really not much else to say about it. It's a downright sad state of affairs and it's unfortunate that schools across this country are breeding a class of pilots who will think that Pay For Training establishments are a normal and natural thing - compounding the fact that Gulfstream Airlines has SALARIED First Officers (not the ones PAYING the company to have a job) out on the street looking for work. It's a ridiculous business practice and one that severely impacts the long term pay, benefits, and quality of life outcomes for every professional part 121 pilot.

Bad is bad, no matter what curtain it is hiding behind.


I honestly can't agree or disagree with the PFJ viewpoint given the elevated furloughs ongoing. (PFJ vice PFT since Southwest Airlines says you must be 737 typed before training.) Business wise, it's still a viable option to make yourself competitive since after completion you're SIC Beech 1900 typed. Business wise, who is to say the added revenue of a PFJ pilot precludes having to furlough paid SICs?

It's a dilemma indeed.
 
Well, haven't been an employee for Falcon in over a year. My perspective to follow.



Strangely silent?

Seriously? Let's look at a couple of things:

1) This forum is not at the top of my monitoring list - since well - I don't have a connection with the company any longer.
2) I have, in the past, recommended veterans to attend Falcon's training as I feel it is top notch and second to none for the cost and overall training experience when utilizing VA Benefits. On that note, in the last three months I've had previous service member associates inquiring about flight training and where to go. I direct them towards Falcon and let them make up their own mind, and I'll also tell them to stay well clear of anything with the name Gulfstream on it.
3) My wife delivered our first child Friday and I haven't really bothered to spend much time on any forums.
4) Well - strangely silent? Give me a break.

As far as my perspective on this relationship.

It's just as bad as ATP (or any school) joining forces with Gulfstream and marketing Gulfstream's internship program as an ethical way to enter the profession.

Really not much else to say about it. It's a downright sad state of affairs and it's unfortunate that schools across this country are breeding a class of pilots who will think that Pay For Training establishments are a normal and natural thing - compounding the fact that Gulfstream Airlines has SALARIED First Officers (not the ones PAYING the company to have a job) out on the street looking for work. It's a ridiculous business practice and one that severely impacts the long term pay, benefits, and quality of life outcomes for every professional part 121 pilot.

Bad is bad, no matter what curtain it is hiding behind.

I too thought you had been strangely silent over this after you had been so voiced over at the ATP forums. I even speculated that you were intentionally keeping quiet to let it cool off. I guess that is what happens when one makes ASSumptions. For that I am sorry.

On the other side, congratulations on your child! I am 2 months out on my first as well.
 
I too thought you had been strangely silent over this after you had been so voiced over at the ATP forums. I even speculated that you were intentionally keeping quiet to let it cool off. I guess that is what happens when one makes ASSumptions. For that I am sorry.

On the other side, congratulations on your child! I am 2 months out on my first as well.

No need to apologize, I never knew anyone was assuming anything. It is what it is. :D
 
What a shame.. I can remember once upon a time a certain someone in charge over there laughed at such programs... Shameful...
 
What a shame.. I can remember once upon a time a certain someone in charge over there laughed at such programs... Shameful...

Well, in a conversation I had with a Falcon representative a few days ago, they certainly didn't seem too thrilled to have to resort to such measures.

Nevertheless, I still don't have a problem recommending Falcon to someone who needs a couple ratings - as I don't have a problem recommending any other reputable school for individual or a few ratings or ATP testing.

But as far as a full blown career program, it's not Falcon dependent, I'll never recommend doing such a program with any flight school until the benefits are significantly greater than the downside risk. Right now just is not the time to invest money into flight training on the scale of 50-80k, the whip cream on the pie is teaming up with Gulfstream.

ATP wasn't the first, and they won't be the last. As can be seen, more and more schools are leaning towards generating a whole class of pilots who will - due to their indoctrination into the profession - think that PFJ/PFT establishments are a-o-kay. The reasons are absolutely clear and it's the lack of funding from SLM or other private loan organizations, and the downside risk of entering the profession right now, the lack of growth, movement, and earnings. It's home mortgages on a much smaller scale, and the underwriters have realized they can't keep issuing out 50-80k loans for people who will have significant difficulty paying that 550 to 1000 a month loan payment on the wages of an entry-level airline pilot.
 
for people who will have significant difficulty paying that 550 to 1000 a month loan payment on the wages of an entry-level airline pilot.
Just to emphasize this point, in case some fresh young mind is reading this, first year take home pay is about $1300/m at a "good" regional.
 
And before all the 135 / non-airline individuals come in here:

Flying for an airline is not the only flying opportunities out there. But, largely, those who pay the coin to go from zero to hero in 6 months tend to be after an airline gig.
 
Well, in a conversation I had with a Falcon representative a few days ago, they certainly didn't seem too thrilled to have to resort to such measures.

Nevertheless, I still don't have a problem recommending Falcon to someone who needs a couple ratings - as I don't have a problem recommending any other reputable school for individual or a few ratings or ATP testing.

But as far as a full blown career program, it's not Falcon dependent, I'll never recommend doing such a program with any flight school until the benefits are significantly greater than the downside risk. Right now just is not the time to invest money into flight training on the scale of 50-80k, the whip cream on the pie is teaming up with Gulfstream.

ATP wasn't the first, and they won't be the last. As can be seen, more and more schools are leaning towards generating a whole class of pilots who will - due to their indoctrination into the profession - think that PFJ/PFT establishments are a-o-kay. The reasons are absolutely clear and it's the lack of funding from SLM or other private loan organizations, and the downside risk of entering the profession right now, the lack of growth, movement, and earnings. It's home mortgages on a much smaller scale, and the underwriters have realized they can't keep issuing out 50-80k loans for people who will have significant difficulty paying that 550 to 1000 a month loan payment on the wages of an entry-level airline pilot.

OK, not arguing any points expressed, but hypothetically, after having gone through ATP/Gulfstream or FAA/Gulfstream then starting to work CFI until hours are built, isn't your status elevated when seeking a pilot position which demands more money to be paid for the investment?

Just a question. . .
 
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