You're the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

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First off, correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that in the eyes of the FAA noise abatment procedures are purely voluntary.

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Somewhat, however, airlines get charged hefty fees for setting-off the noise monitors. If your flight exceeded the maximum decibel level and you don't have a valid excuse for not following the procedure things could get very interesting.


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what would be a valid excuse...other than emergencies or aircraft avoidance?
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

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what would be a valid excuse...other than emergencies or aircraft avoidance?

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Usually in Orange County, we brief that if we lose an engine, have any abnormal indications or experience any control difficulties, all bets are off and we're going to resume the standard departure profile.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

"Hey Capt, thanks for not doing the Noise Abatement Procedure, we would've hit those birds!"

Always CYA when the cockpit voice recorder is running
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

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"Hey Capt, thanks for not doing the Noise Abatement Procedure, we would've hit those birds!"

Always CYA when the cockpit voice recorder is running

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Apparently, there's a captain who jokingly says, "I dunno Sparky, this doesn't look good" to the CVR voice element.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

This is what I'ld say

"its a good thing your flying, because I thought there was a noise abatement procedure here."
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

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Violations and all-expenses-paid trips to the chief pilot's office are issued in pairs.

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Well in that case I'd probably mention it in a non-threating way.

As an interesting side note, I read a case study a while back that found somthing like 40-60% of first officers would allow the captain to fly the aircraft into the ground without saying anything.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

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"Hey Capt, thanks for not doing the Noise Abatement Procedure, we would've hit those birds!"

Always CYA when the cockpit voice recorder is running

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That is great!! I love it!!
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

Thanks Iain, I know it may seem like just cockpit humor, but I've actually done it, slightly different circumstance.
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Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

They'd actually pull a CVR for a noise abatement trigger?!? That's so not cool.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

I think it all comes down to S.A. Like C650 said, if you mentioned it in the pre-takeoff brief, and he still ignored it, then its the Captains problem. You covered your tail and got the brief on the CVR, and you KNOW he is aware of what needs to be done, so if the boss wants to disregard it, fine, but he is the one who goes down for it when the Chief Pilot starts asking questions.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

Guys... unless I'm missing something CVRs only record for 30 minutes and then they record over the old stuff.

Most flights are over 30 minutes long. Even if the t/o brief was given, they couldn't tell what was said because it would have been recorded over.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

You are correct, only the last 30 minutes is recorded. That's why our new checklists which just came out have: "AFTER NTSB REPORTABLE EVENT CVR BREAKER.....PULL". I'm not sure exactly why the FAA wanted that added, I believe it had to due with the ATA 757-300 runover incident.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

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BEFORE EMBARASSING EVENT CVR BREAKER.....PULL

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I've got stories, but you've got to wait for the book!
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Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

Tactfully remind him that we are supposed to do whatever for the NA. If he blows it off, call pro standards.
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

There's a noise abatement procedure for John Wayne Santa Ana Orange County Irvine International Airport? Dang! Why am I not informed of these things! Better go erase those trips from my logbook.

If it's your first trip with the Capt, you're both taking time to figure each other out. Wait for cruise, start updating your Jepps, and say "Hey wasn't that NA procedure back there a b!atch?" Just be nice ... no-one likes a know-it-all FO. That's why no-one wants to fly with me.

Everyone makes mistakes, even when it's intentional.
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Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

What are the fines and any other punishments you could recieve for violating a Noise Abatement procedure?

Also leaving TPA the other day there was a sign before the runway that read "Thank you for following Noise Abatement Procedures" I guess that should remind the Captain if he 'forgets'
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

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First off, correct me if I'm wrong, but my understanding is that in the eyes of the FAA noise abatment procedures are purely voluntary

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yah they are voluntary, BUT you CAN still get fined for it! So what woudl you chose? Adhere to the request or get fined?
 
Re: You\'re the FO: Captain and Noise Abatement

Plus you can get banned at some airports
(tail number ban)
Not cool really
 
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