With the new violations the feds are handing out like candy

[chrisatc]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

So why aren't ALPA and NATCA sponsoring a letter-writing campaign to put an end to the practice?

How much do you think such a campaign would accomplish? What do we say? You never enforced the rules before, why now? They are "technically" correct in saying these incidents are a violation of the rules.

Perhaps you are speaking about how they respond to the violations. The ones enforcing the rules live in a black and white, theoretical world. You and I operate in the real world that is full of gray. How do you reconcile the two worlds when the other side thinks their world is the only one that exists?

These issues are all being worked behind closed doors. However, the upper echelons of the FAA hold all the power and can and will do as they please until catastrophe strikes. Only then will real change take place.

Chris

 

[tgrayson]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

How much do you think such a campaign would accomplish? What do we say? You never enforced the rules before, why now? They are "technically" correct in saying these incidents are a violation of the rules.

Quite a lot. The FAA responds to political pressure, just like any organization. 100% compliance with the rules is impossible, and the present FAA behavior tends to a "Big Brother" environment where people are motivated to squeal on others.

Wasn't there a bit of a stink a few years ago when controllers were expected to report go-arounds to airline management? The complaint was that it provided a disincentive for a pilots to perform a go-around.

 

[chrisatc]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

Quite a lot. The FAA responds to political pressure, just like any organization. 100% compliance with the rules is impossible, and the present FAA behavior tends to a "Big Brother" environment where people are motivated to squeal on others.

Wasn't there a bit of a stink a few years ago when controllers were expected to report go-arounds to airline management? The complaint was that it provided a disincentive for a pilots to perform a go-around.

Perhaps a grass-roots campaign might have a political impact, mass response from individuals. I just don't think the FAA will respond to NATCA or ALPA as it will be perceived as just complaints from those getting busted. That being said, I am for anything that will change the current state of affairs.

Chris

 

[aloft]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

If nothing else, guidance needs to be established to a typical municipal or state criminal code, with different levels of violations: infractions, misdemeanors, etc. Some of the things one may be violated for are downright trivial, while others...not so much. But under the current system, a violation is a violation.

 

[Jason]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

Yes you could, FAA management has the ability to review the tapes at any time and they have a habit of not only violating you the pilot but the ATC (DEAL) for not reporting it if they do overhear a "violation."

When your management is "reviewing the tapes", do they only have the audio of the radio communications or do they also have visual records of the radar screens?

 

[ILSstud]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

When your management is "reviewing the tapes", do they only have the audio of the radio communications or do they also have visual records of the radar screens?

That's a good question I was curious of the same thing...because like I said if I make an error in altitude or heading I am pulling the turbulence or bumps in the road excuse....

 

[whysoserial]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

Viewing the radar is possible.

 

[v1valarob]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

Viewing the radar is possible.

ATC has the ability to pick up clear air turbulence on their radar screen?

 

[chrisatc]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

When your management is "reviewing the tapes", do they only have the audio of the radio communications or do they also have visual records of the radar screens?

They have it all for 45 days.

Chris

 

[whysoserial]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

ATC has the ability to pick up clear air turbulence on their radar screen?

Don't believe I said that. The question was if radar data was available to view after the fact. The answer is yes.

 

[SpiraMirabilis]

Re: With the new violations the feds are handing out like ca

ATC has the ability to pick up clear air turbulence on their radar screen?

Well straight and level flight at 7500ft looks different than a turbulent aircraft oscillating altitudes on a radar scope.