Windy bumpy flight in a 152

Texguy

Texguy

New Member
I had my longest flight yesterday..4.8 hours in a C152. The winds were around 16 knots gusting to 22. Frankly I was scared for much of the flight with the wind frequently pushing me around. Because of cloud cover I was only 1500 AGL.

I have had my PPL for 3 years but have never become used to bumpy rides or the mildest of turbulence. I remember my instructor telling me bumps due to wind or rising heat were no cause for worry and that I should just plow through it with minimal action on the yoke. He assured me the Cessna is very stable. However yesterday it almost seemed at times that the wind was going to turn me upside down, like in a turn.

How dangerous are winds under 25 knots while in cruise? When the wind tilts me one way or another do I need to turn the yoke the other way or let the plane go back to straight and level? How dangerous are the bumps due to rising heat?
 
you'll be allright. generally speaking i react to wind when it dusturbes my plane. if you're ever in serious doubt, just slow to Va.
 
Howdy, Tex!

Your concerns are completely normal. You're just starting to push against the boundaries of your comfort level. That's never a comfortable thing. However, it is sometimes in your best favor.

The turbulence that you were encountering - at any time, did you feel that the aircraft was out of control? Or, were you just being tossed around a little bit? Were loose items being tossed about the cabin? Did you feel at any time that you were beyond your capabilities?

If you're in doubt, slow the airplane down to Va, and ride it out. Don't fight the bumps, but don't let the turbulence take over the aircraft. Turbulence of this nature isn't harmful to the airplane, and it just takes some getting used to. Of course, the only way that you're going to get used to it is to go fly in it. If you're not sure about it, grab an instructor and go out in it a little bit. After a short time, you'll see that it's ok!

Good luck, and let us know how it works out!
 
If you're ever unsure about the weight of your airplane, use the lowest Va published, and you should be ok.

Of course, in my line of work, I have the luxury of always knowing exactly what my Takeoff weight is. :)
 
I would not worry about the turbulence damaging the airplane unless it gets to the point where you cannot maintain a level flight attitude at all. In general you do not want to make abrupt control inputs to fight the turbulence because you could potentially increase the load factor on the airframe and cause structural damage. However, it takes extreme situations for damage to occur.

How much was the turbulence causing you to bank? 40 degrees? If it gets to the point where it is physically unomfortable, I would just get it on the ground and wait a few hours. Typically the winds die down later in the evening.

Hope this helps.
 
Your opinion on the severity of turbulence tends to change the more you fly. Usually if it isn't rattling your teeth or really picking a wing up on you bad its not going to hurt anything.
 
Texguy said:
How dangerous are winds under 25 knots while in cruise? When the wind tilts me one way or another do I need to turn the yoke the other way or let the plane go back to straight and level? How dangerous are the bumps due to rising heat?
Click to expand...

Winds under 25 knots in cruise can be bumpy or it can be smooth. It really depends on the terrain and your altitude. For example, I flew a C182 at 15000 the other day with the winds being around 65 knots over the Grand Canyon. Airmet for turbulence, PIREPs for mod to svr, and for me? I had the smoothest ride I've had in a while.

As for trying to "fight" with the turbulence? Its a balance. The controls should be moved but smoothly. Remember, if the turbulence is severe enough, dont try to maintain altitude and maintain attitude (wings level).

Also, if flying at Va, keep in mind that Va was determined at max gross weight. So, here is a rule of thumb for determining Va (less doing the square root of the actual weight divided by the max allowable gross weight) - Reduce Va 2 knots for each 100 pounds below max allowable gross weight. An aircraft flying at gross weight will be able to fly at a faster Va as opposed to an aircraft at a lighter weight will have to fly slower because the light aircraft is more suseptable to gusts.

There is a stagnation point with thermal turbulence (usually). You indicated you were flying at a low altitude which without question would be generally more bumpy as opposed to a higher altitude where the thermal turbulence is able to "break apart" (if you will).

A speed generally not taught is the designated design turbulence penetration speed, or VB, and is a great speed to use when flying in svr-extreme turbulence. Its it calculated by using 1.7 times Vs.

Hope this helps. :)
 
meritflyer said:
Also, if flying at Va, keep in mind that Va was determined at max gross weight. So, here is a rule of thumb for determining Va (less doing the square root of the actual weight divided by the max allowable gross weight) - Reduce Va 2 knots for each 100 pounds below max allowable gross weight. An aircraft flying at gross weight will be able to fly at a faster Va as opposed to an aircraft at a lighter weight will have to fly slower because the light aircraft is more suseptable to gusts.
Click to expand...

I think it's also good to point out that the reason Va decreases as weight decreases is because it's easier to exceed limit load factors in a lighter airplane. Remember, load factor is the load supported by the wings divided by the actual weight of the aircraft.

Let's say an airplane (a warrior perhaps) can produce 10,000 lbs of lift at full control surface deflection (no, I do not know the exact number, just providing an easy one to use). If we have the warrior loaded to max gross weight (2440), the load factor imposed would be approximately 4 G's. Now let's take the same airplane with the same full control surface deflection but reduce the weight to 1800. The new load factor is 5.5 G's. Here, you can see that by reducing the weight, our aircraft is able to exceed the limiting load factors more easily. Thus, the speed should be reduced so such lift values cannot be reached.

Oh, and be sure and mention that with your formula sqrt(actual weight/max gross weight), don't forget that that value must be multiplied by the original Vspeed.
 
Nobody likes turbulence -- it's like driving on a bumpy, rutty, pothole filled road.

I've had turbulence so bad my legs were bruised after being banged against the yoke. Even then, though, the airplane wasn't completely out of control.

Then the airplane's color would have changed from white with blue stripes to white with yellow and brown spots.
 
CamYZ125 said:
Oh, and be sure and mention that with your formula sqrt(actual weight/max gross weight), don't forget that that value must be multiplied by the original Vspeed.
Click to expand...
Wow, that's a real simple/good way of putting it, I always try to explain it and tend to go so deep in an explination that I'll confuse myself. As for the adjusted speed forumla.

Speed = Max Weight VSpeed times the square root of (your weight/max a-c weight)

For example: an aircraft with:
*Max t/o weight of 3600lbs
*Actual weight of 2300lbs
*Manuevering speed at Max Weight (3600lbs) 120

You will divide 2300 by 3600 and get 0.639
You will square 0.639 and get 0.799
You will multiply 0.799 by your manuevering speed at max weight (120)
You will get 95.9 knots as your weight adjusted manuevering speed.


This formula works for critical V-speeds such as manuevering speed, rotation speed, best glide speed, stall speed, and approach to landing speeds.

The formula will give you an estimate for Best rate and best angle of climb

This formula should NOT be used for Never exceed, maximum operating, gear and flap limit speeds as they do not need to be adjusted for speed and are the same at all speeds.
 
AlexF said:
Speed = Max Weight VSpeed times the square root of (your weight/max a-c weight)

For example: an aircraft with:
*Max t/o weight of 3600lbs
*Actual weight of 2300lbs
*Manuevering speed at Max Weight (3600lbs) 120

You will divide 2300 by 3600 and get 0.639
You will square 0.639 and get 0.799
You will multiply 0.799 by your manuevering speed at max weight (120)
You will get 95.9 knots as your weight adjusted manuevering speed.
Click to expand...

√2300 = 47
√3600 = 60
47/60 = .78 (120)
New VA = 94
 
meritflyer said:
√2300 = 47
√3600 = 60
47/60 = .78 (120)
New VA = 94
Click to expand...

The forumla is the sqrt of (actual weight/max gross). Make sure you do the division, then take the square root, then multiply by the original. Thus, 95.9 is the new one.

BUT, and correct me if I'm wrong, these should be done in regards to KCAS, as our KIAS and KCAS are going to differ by a bit near stall speeds.
 
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