What is the cheapest and cheapest path to obtaining my CFI cerrtificate from ground zero?

If this is something that you are really serious about, I would suggest one of the fast track programs like ATP or something similar. I have met a few folks that went through ATP, and they all said it worked well for them, but that it was a VERY intense training period. You REALLY need to do as much reading as possible and be ready to go from day one, and really work at it to succeed. I don't know the specifics, but I THINK they wanted you to complete your written test before you even start each part of the program.

One thing to think about here that will certainly affect the cost is how you go about your training. If you aren't able to take a significant amount of time off work and really hit it hard like you would have to with one of those programs, you are going to cost yourself more in the long run by doing it part time at a local flight school. If you aren't flying AT LEAST 2x a week, you are going to lose some of that knowledge and end up spending more in the long run as you won't retain as much between flights.

If you decide on a local flight school, make sure to choose one with enough airplanes and instructors that you will be able to fly often and have access to an instructor for any ground training that you might need as well. Lots of instructors at the smaller schools are part time, and it can sometimes be difficult to get a consistent schedule with an instructor. While I DO recommend flying with different instructors, if they aren't communicating with each other, and following a common and organized curriculum, that can also slow you down.

I'm sure ATP would have a very standardized set of lessons for each course that each instructor would follow, which would probably help with that, where a small flight school would likely be a lot less organized and put more of that responsibility on the individual instructor. If you do the small school route, Part 141 instruction would be a bit more organized which would help with that, though not all schools are set up to deliver that.
 
I went to a place that advertised "cheap" and "quick" once for my multi. Flew two hours in their plane and left without coming back out of concern for my safety. That plane later went down and took a student and instructor with it. Before that they had another double fatal with aircraft maintenance a contributing factor, and a engine loss accident (both survived) for undetermined reasons.

As for your son and fiance, the best thing you could do for them would be not to go into aviation.
 
WS said:
If you aren't able to take a significant amount of time off work and really hit it hard like you would have to with one of those programs, you are going to cost yourself more in the long run by doing it part time at a local flight school. If you aren't flying AT LEAST 2x a week, you are going to lose some of that knowledge and end up spending more in the long run as you won't retain as much between flights.
Click to expand...

Though I have heard variations of this for, I don't know, at least the 20 years I have been around aviation, I don't think there is much truth to it at all. I've never flown 2x /week training for any rating, and I have a bunch of them. While you can't expect to fly once every six months and make much progress, a few times per month is plenty for most students. There isn't much "knowledge" that is learned in the cockpit anyway, it is a terrible classroom. Most of it is learned on the ground, and reinforced to some degree in the air.

I would also disagree that you will cost yourself more in the long run as well. Realistically, a part 61 trained pilot is going to need 250 hours to be a CFI. They will fly about 100 dual hours getting to that point. In the grand scheme of things, even if they end up flying 10 or 20 more hours dual, it was time they ultimately would need anyway. And we are talking about a $500 to $1,000 difference, which is maybe 1% of their investment in flying at that point.
 
Murdoughnut said:
I went to a place that advertised "cheap" and "quick" once for my multi. Flew two hours in their plane and left without coming back out of concern for my safety. That plane later went down and took a student and instructor with it. Before that they had another double fatal with aircraft maintenance a contributing factor, and a engine loss accident (both survived) for undetermined reasons.

As for your son and fiance, the best thing you could do for them would be not to go into aviation.
Click to expand...

That operation sounds familiar. Where was it? You can PM it to me if you don't want to say it publicly.
 
drunkenbeagle said:
From the FAA's website, you can get all of these in PDF:

Airplane Flying Handbook -- https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/handbooks_manuals/aviation/airplane_handbook/
Pilots Handbook of Aeronautical Knowledge -- https://www.faa.gov/regulations_policies/handbooks_manuals/aviation/phak/
Aeronautical Information Manual (AIM) -- https://www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/media/aim.pdf

There are plenty of others, but that should keep you busy for a while :)
Click to expand...

https://www.amazon.com/Airplane-Fly...words=Airplane+Flying+Handbook,+FAA-H-8083-3B

Is this a good author in Amazon? I can't stand looking at the computer screen too long, so i'm willing to pay for a paperback!
 
Richman said:
Before you do anything else, I would suggest that you make sure you can hold at least a 2nd Class FAA medical certificate. You can search for the requirements online.

Richman
Click to expand...

Looking at the criteria, I should be able to with flying colors! It looks quite similar to my annual examination criteria for volunteer fire department here.
 
You said that you have ADHD do you currently take medication for it? Also you said that you don't want to go in the military again, if you have gibill benefits left you can use them for flight training through a college program.
 
b3181981 said:
You said that you have ADHD do you currently take medication for it? Also you said that you don't want to go in the military again, if you have gibill benefits left you can use them for flight training through a college program.
Click to expand...

I do not take any medication for it, I am able to focus really well and I actually get more done than most people could dream to, I don't understand why it would be a hindering factor in that case...
 
WS said:
If this is something that you are really serious about, I would suggest one of the fast track programs like ATP or something similar. I have met a few folks that went through ATP, and they all said it worked well for them, but that it was a VERY intense training period. You REALLY need to do as much reading as possible and be ready to go from day one, and really work at it to succeed. I don't know the specifics, but I THINK they wanted you to complete your written test before you even start each part of the program.

One thing to think about here that will certainly affect the cost is how you go about your training. If you aren't able to take a significant amount of time off work and really hit it hard like you would have to with one of those programs, you are going to cost yourself more in the long run by doing it part time at a local flight school. If you aren't flying AT LEAST 2x a week, you are going to lose some of that knowledge and end up spending more in the long run as you won't retain as much between flights.

If you decide on a local flight school, make sure to choose one with enough airplanes and instructors that you will be able to fly often and have access to an instructor for any ground training that you might need as well. Lots of instructors at the smaller schools are part time, and it can sometimes be difficult to get a consistent schedule with an instructor. While I DO recommend flying with different instructors, if they aren't communicating with each other, and following a common and organized curriculum, that can also slow you down.

I'm sure ATP would have a very standardized set of lessons for each course that each instructor would follow, which would probably help with that, where a small flight school would likely be a lot less organized and put more of that responsibility on the individual instructor. If you do the small school route, Part 141 instruction would be a bit more organized which would help with that, though not all schools are set up to deliver that.
Click to expand...
I'm not trying to hijack this thread, but I can say that there seems to be a certain amount of truth regarding the small school route. I have been trying to complete my cfi since the summer, and at times, it's been incredibly frustrating with the lack of organization and lack of a structured training program, especially for cfi applicants. I was working with an independent free lance cfi just south of my location who specializes in teaching cfi applicants, but he had some stuff come up with his career/day job that prevents him from flying for the next few months. He found out he may be moving/or lose his job. So he's now off the table, unfortunately. He was a pretty good instructor too. However even he wasn't available as much as I needed at times. My local flight school is terrible at scheduling and terrible with communication. I got my commercial with them this summer with no problems. My cfi for commercial is about to leave for the airlines, and now I'm pretty much left with the most senior cfi who will be working with me. However, again, unfortunately his schedule looks very questionable in terms of his availability. I was hoping to complete this training by the end of this year. But that won't happen now. I have to constantly stay on these guys and they take almost 2 days, sometimes longer, to respond to my texts/emails when I ask them when they are next available to fly/do ground school. They are a great group of people, in fact I really like them and enjoy talking to them each time I'm out at the airport. But man, their availability is horrible. I once heard on another message forum that a lot of CFI's especially at the mom and pop flight schools don't wanna take on cfi applicants because of the amount of prep work involved with it. So they choose not to deal with it. Is there any truth to that? I hope it's not true. This is incredibly frustrating.

I'm really thinking that I may have to enroll in an accelerated program like American flyers or ATP and do this full time and get it knocked out. I am eager to get this done, yet still remaining very patient and humble through this process. But I don't know how much longer I can play the waiting game with the local mom and pop fbo to be honest. They are very short staffed on cfi's and they always say they are looking for cfi's but then again they don't seem to be eager to take on a cfi applicant, even after I've expressed great interest in becoming a cfi to these guys and that I'm not interested in doing it just for the hours.

I have a wife and a kid and if I do enroll in American flyers, which is kinda the place that I'm eyeballing to finish CFI/CFII, how long would it take to compete their program? And do they provide housing for students? I also work part time, and so does my wife (she's full time), so this is something I have to consider very carefully.

Anybody else ever been in this situation? Any advice/replies are welcomed!
 
Bamaaviator said:
I'm not trying to hijack this thread, but I can say that there seems to be a certain amount of truth regarding the small school route. I have been trying to complete my cfi since the summer, and at times, it's been incredibly frustrating with the lack of organization and lack of a structured training program, especially for cfi applicants. I was working with an independent free lance cfi just south of my location who specializes in teaching cfi applicants, but he had some stuff come up with his career/day job that prevents him from flying for the next few months. He found out he may be moving/or lose his job. So he's now off the table, unfortunately. He was a pretty good instructor too. However even he wasn't available as much as I needed at times. My local flight school is terrible at scheduling and terrible with communication. I got my commercial with them this summer with no problems. My cfi for commercial is about to leave for the airlines, and now I'm pretty much left with the most senior cfi who will be working with me. However, again, unfortunately his schedule looks very questionable in terms of his availability. I was hoping to complete this training by the end of this year. But that won't happen now. I have to constantly stay on these guys and they take almost 2 days, sometimes longer, to respond to my texts/emails when I ask them when they are next available to fly/do ground school. They are a great group of people, in fact I really like them and enjoy talking to them each time I'm out at the airport. But man, their availability is horrible. I once heard on another message forum that a lot of CFI's especially at the mom and pop flight schools don't wanna take on cfi applicants because of the amount of prep work involved with it. So they choose not to deal with it. Is there any truth to that? I hope it's not true. This is incredibly frustrating.

I'm really thinking that I may have to enroll in an accelerated program like American flyers or ATP and do this full time and get it knocked out. I am eager to get this done, yet still remaining very patient and humble through this process. But I don't know how much longer I can play the waiting game with the local mom and pop fbo to be honest. They are very short staffed on cfi's and they always say they are looking for cfi's but then again they don't seem to be eager to take on a cfi applicant, even after I've expressed great interest in becoming a cfi to these guys and that I'm not interested in doing it just for the hours.

I have a wife and a kid and if I do enroll in American flyers, which is kinda the place that I'm eyeballing to finish CFI/CFII, how long would it take to compete their program? And do they provide housing for students? I also work part time, and so does my wife (she's full time), so this is something I have to consider very carefully.

Anybody else ever been in this situation? Any advice/replies are welcomed!
Click to expand...
I did my PPL training under part 61 at a small FBO, and up through CFI at a medium size FBO, under part 141. In my experience, at FBO type flight training, the responsibility for scheduling rests solely on the student. At times you will have to dog your instructor to get scheduled, and it is always a good idea to have a couple instructors that you can work with in case you need to do more than your normal instructor can accommodate. I used three instructors for my CFI, not including stage checks and the check ride.

I did my CFII and MEI at UND while also working as an instructor, and the difference with regards to scheduling was night and day. The instructor's schedules were monitored by a lead instructor. While we were free as instructors to adjust our schedules, we were expected to complete at least two training activities per week on average with each student, and we would hear about it if we started to dip below that average. At the larger schools, they want students to get through the program in a timely manner to make room for the next students. The responsibility for the student's progress rests with the instructor, and they have incentives to keep the student moving. At schools like the universities, ATP and probably American Flyers, I think the management will do what they can to make sure that you have an instructor for whatever course you are enrolled in. Don't get me wrong, things do happen, instructors get sick, leave for other jobs etc. But at least at UND, if I was unable to schedule a student, it was MY responsibility as an instructor to try to find someone to cover their training til I came back. During one period where I was in the hospital for a few days, my lead instructor found another instructor to cover my students til I returned.

As I understand it, at SOME of the larger places there is actually a scheduling department that schedules the instructors and students. While that would reduce flexibility for the instructors, I would imagine it would further ensure that you were training vs trying to track down an instructor and sitting at home when the weather was great for flying.

Hopefully someone else can answer your specific questions about American Flyers.

Oh, and regarding CFI training, most instructors preferred to teach other students due to the disproportionate amount of ground training required. Most would rather fly than sit in an office discussing maneuvers, airspace, laws of learning etc. There are also minimum requirements for an instructor to be able to train an initial CFI applicant which will narrow the field as well, since many of the newer instructors are not able to provide the training yet. At the larger schools however, if you are able to teach it and they have a student that needs you, you've got yourself a new initial CFI student, like it or not.
 
Last edited:
I looked into is and I'd be able to get the 2nd class medical certificate. One thing I couldn't find, do I need this before I go for the introductory flight lesson or should I just call over to epix and ask them?

I was thinking about buying this and if I like it 3-4 more lessons as an early Christmas present to myself this month lol.
 
You can do as many lessons as you like without a medical certificate, but you can't solo. I WOULD however recommend that you get it ASAP, as if for some reason you are unable to obtain one, it would be far better to know about it BEFORE you drop a bunch of cash.
 
WS said:
You can do as many lessons as you like without a medical certificate, but you can't solo. I WOULD however recommend that you get it ASAP, as if for some reason you are unable to obtain one, it would be far better to know about it BEFORE you drop a bunch of cash.
Click to expand...

With that being said, it's probably cheaper to go get that done even before the intro just to see if I can! I'm sure I can, but might as well!
 
Makes more sense. And you're right, you do have to stay on top of part 61 instructors. Thankfully my CFI responded to my email from a few days ago and he said he wants to get a schedule going and get the ball rolling with us. So that's encouraging. I've expressed great interest to the guy in WANTING to instruct and not just to build time. We even met and had sort of an informal 'interview' a week or so ago and I'm glad I dressed for the occasion, because it certainly did feel like an actual interview. Talked for about an hour. He told me their training for cfi applicants is a vetting process as to who gets hired. I was contemplating not dressing up for our meet, but in hindsight, glad I did. I've learned part 61 is a tough animal. I'm probably just going to have to stick with it and be extremely patient, as I don't really think I have the option to go to an accelerated cfi course since I have a family and can't afford to quit work. If I had to do this all over again though, my message to the OP would be to go attend an accelerated program if you CAN, especially for the more advanced ratings. I wanted to be done with my ratings a lot sooner, but, oh well, sometimes life happens.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top