Visual Approach

M

meritflyer

Well-Known Member
Is radar service terminated when instructed to contact the tower? I read in the AIM that it is terminated when instructed to change to the advisory frequency but didnt find if radar is terminated when told to contact the tower. Anyways, your thoughts?
 
There is a question in the Gliem IR Test Prep book that asks this. It says radar services are terminated.
 
Well, if they terminate radar services and say contact advisory (uncontrolled field), why wouldn't they terminate radar services into a controled (towered field)?


On approach, you are under their control. Once contacting tower, you are now under the towers control. Approach won't care about you until you go missed if need be.

That's how I made sense of it.
 
JEP said:
Well, if they terminate radar services and say contact advisory (uncontrolled field), why wouldn't they terminate radar services into a controled (towered field)?


On approach, you are under their control. Once contacting tower, you are now under the towers control. Approach won't care about you until you go missed if need be.

That's how I made sense of it.
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Makes sense except when departing class B airspace, the tower always advises "radar contact" and gives you your initial vectors to airways or transitions. Its usually 3-5 minutes before they hand you off. So, why wouldnt tower keep you in radar contact on approach.
 
meritflyer said:
Makes sense except when departing class B airspace, the tower always advises "radar contact" and gives you your initial vectors to airways or transitions. Its usually 3-5 minutes before they hand you off. So, why wouldnt tower keep you in radar contact on approach.
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???? In your first post you asked:

Is radar service terminated when instructed to contact the tower?
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If you are departing Class B airspace why would you be contacting the tower? Am I missing something? :confused: Usually when I leave my Class D field, I contact approach and then receive radar contact from the approach controlers. I don't get that when leaving Class B.

Back to work for now.
 
meritflyer said:
Makes sense except when departing class B airspace, the tower always advises "radar contact" and gives you your initial vectors to airways or transitions. Its usually 3-5 minutes before they hand you off. So, why wouldnt tower keep you in radar contact on approach.
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i depart various class B airspaces on a regular basis (primary airports, not satellites) and i've never had tower tell me "radar contact", always approach.
 
Salt Lake International does it all day long. As soon as you're about 300' AGL or so, climbing on rwy heading, tower always says "radar contact, turn right to the ______ (transition)" You're never handed off to departure until you've been airborne for typically atleast 5 minutes.
 
JEP said:
???? In your first post you asked:



If you are departing Class B airspace why would you be contacting the tower? Am I missing something? :confused: Usually when I leave my Class D field, I contact approach and then receive radar contact from the approach controlers. I don't get that when leaving Class B.

Back to work for now.
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I was just saying the inverse of the initial question. Departing, you'd already be on tower. Maybe a little confusing.. sorry.

Most class D doesnt have radar service like class B so you wouldnt get "radar contact" until you contacted the radar controlling facility.
 
meritflyer said:
I was just saying the inverse of the initial question. Departing, you'd already be on tower. Maybe a little confusing.. sorry.

Most class D doesnt have radar service like class B so you wouldnt get "radar contact" until you contacted the radar controlling facility.
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I thought that's what you were talking about. Departing you'd already be on tower.

I still don't understand how you'd get radar contact. I would hope they have you on radar before you depart. :confused:


Anyhow....time to IPL, back to work.:(
 
casey said:
i depart various class B airspaces on a regular basis (primary airports, not satellites) and i've never had tower tell me "radar contact", always approach.
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:yeahthat:

Doug, care to weigh in on this one? Being SLC based and all.
 
JEP said:
I thought that's what you were talking about. Departing you'd already be on tower.

I still don't understand how you'd get radar contact. I would hope they have you on radar before you depart. :confused:


Anyhow....time to IPL, back to work.:(
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Nope. Atleast where I trained at (KSLC), the tower always says "radar contact".. everytime. Anyways, this is getting confusing. I need a drink..
 
It's all ATC procedures. At my facility we terminate radar to one of the Class D airports in our airspace simply because there is no radar coverage to ensure the arrival gets on the ground, so the tower over there has to call us with a down time...non-radar procedures. You can still be on an instrument approach, contact approach, or visual approach and not have radar; what do you think happens when the radar fails?

Radar contact is a completely different animal. Radar contact is not called on departure sometimes because certain criteria per the .65 are not met. We can radar identify you if there is a take-off call from the tower, you're observed within 1 nm of the runway end on departure, you change the transponder code, momentarily turn the transponder to standby and back to ALT, turn more than 30 degrees, report over a specific point, or if you ident. I'm not too familiar with operations at class B airports, only Class D and TRSA. Hope this helps.

- Nate
 
meritflyer said:
Is radar service terminated when instructed to contact the tower? I read in the AIM that it is terminated when instructed to change to the advisory frequency but didnt find if radar is terminated when told to contact the tower. Anyways, your thoughts?
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When I monitor local PHX class B traffic I always hear this:

"Cactus #1234 runway 25R clear for take-off maintain 7,000."

"Cactus #1234 contact departure on 125.8."

"Approach Cactus #1234 at 5,000 for 7,000."

"Cactus #1234 radar contact,direct CHEEZ maintain FL210."
 
Everyday when I blast off of SLC IFR I get "Turn to heading 280, RWY 16L cleared for takeoff"... At 400' I start my turn and usually as I roll through 240 heading the controller is saying "Heading 280 contact departure". Never had them tell me radar contact.

Granted, when I depart VFR, they hang on to me for a while and the tower calls radar contact. Then the tower keeps me until I cross the Barn (assuming the Barn transition) before handing me off to departure.
 
May I suggest some reading material?

meritflyer said:
I read in the AIM that it is terminated when instructed to change to the advisory frequency but didnt find if radar is terminated when told to contact the tower.
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AIM 5-4-3(e.3) should answer this one for you. Radar service is terminated at controlled airports upon landing.

JEP said:
I still don't understand how you'd get radar contact.
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AIM 4-1-2. Towers can provide IFR seperation under certain circumstances, and they don't use their eyeballs to do it (thankfully). :)

meritflyer said:
Atleast where I trained at (KSLC), the tower always says "radar contact".. everytime.
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Not always.

meritflyer said:
You're never handed off to departure until you've been airborne for typically atleast 5 minutes.
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Where did you come up with that nonsense?
 
Eatsleepfly said:
AIM 5-4-3(e.3) should answer this one for you. Radar service is terminated at controlled airports upon landing.
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Dunno...when I was training for my PPL in TUS, which is Class C airspace. I'd always hear approach telling the airliners coming in from the east over the Catalina mntns. to turn to heading XXX cleared for approach, radar services terminated contact Tucson tower on XXX.X frequency.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JEP
I still don't understand how you'd get radar contact.


EatSleepFly said:
....
AIM 4-1-2. Towers can provide IFR seperation under certain circumstances, and they don't use their eyeballs to do it (thankfully). :)
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That I understand, but what I was getting at was that I have never had the tower tell me "radar contact".

I would always hear that after departing my field and getting switched over center controllers.
 
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