JeppUpdater
Well-Known Member
Over Lybia. I can't really say much more.
The party starts at 5 minutes or so.
The party starts at 5 minutes or so.
Video: F-14 vs Mig dogfight
- Thread starter JeppUpdater
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BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
Wasn't this compared to "beating up the kids off the short bus?" Or is my memory failing me?
Boris Badenov
This is no laughing matter.
Is this the one where they killed these dudes because they'd misunderstood the radar data and went all Murica on some poor guys who were just flying along in a straight line?
PositionAndHold
Well-Known Member
If you listen, it seems that the F14's turned away or offset five different times. Each time the MIGs turned back towards them. The way I took the sound of the audio was "I don't want to be the M'fer that starts WWIII, please don't engage us". But the MIG's kept turning in so they had to take them as hostile.
My dad was on that cruise. I got a Tomcat poster autographed by one of the 4 crew and a tshirt that said "USA-2 Lybia-0" with graphic F-14s shooting a sparrow and sidewinder into the Migs... Pretty cool to a six year old. I had that poster hanging up on my closet door for years until it got lost in a move to Japan.
I've heard the arguments about the overzealous RIO jumping the gun in giving the Migs a face shot, but when the audio clearly shows that the composite warfare commander (AB) raises the warning status to "yellow" the RIO gains a lot backing from his bosses bosses boss to take action to defend his section from the closing Migs.
I've heard the arguments about the overzealous RIO jumping the gun in giving the Migs a face shot, but when the audio clearly shows that the composite warfare commander (AB) raises the warning status to "yellow" the RIO gains a lot backing from his bosses bosses boss to take action to defend his section from the closing Migs.
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
Yes I was surprised to learn that the RIO could launch a missile not the PIC. I did hear someone mutter "Jesus" when the first FOX 1 was called out over the intercom, or radio. I don't know enough about these things to know if that was a radio transmission or intercom transmission.
The Fez
Analog Millennial
It sounded like who I think was AB wasn't very enthused when the engagement actually kicked off.
F-14: "Fox 1!"
AB: "Oh, Jesus..."
AB....you got some 'splainin to do!
Cessnaflyer
Wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Top Gun is so much better to watch.
Were the pilots able to eject or were they riding their coffins down?
Were the pilots able to eject or were they riding their coffins down?
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
One ejected but apparently there was no Libyan rescue operation to recover the pilot. According to wiki...
AB, was the guy saying "close out, warning yellow weapons hold, I repeat warning yellow weapons hold Alpha Bravo out."
AB is the Battle Group Commanders direct represntative (read the admiral is likely standing over the O-5s shoulder as he raises the weapons and warning status and that radio call is made).
That message is then relayed to the F-14s from the E-2, telling them that Bravo directs Warning yellow weapons hold... Aka an attack by the Lybians was "probable". The RIO becomes more amped up shortly after that message.
"Oh Jesus" was the pilot.
AB is the Battle Group Commanders direct represntative (read the admiral is likely standing over the O-5s shoulder as he raises the weapons and warning status and that radio call is made).
That message is then relayed to the F-14s from the E-2, telling them that Bravo directs Warning yellow weapons hold... Aka an attack by the Lybians was "probable". The RIO becomes more amped up shortly after that message.
"Oh Jesus" was the pilot.
D
Deleted member 27505
Guest
Well, see the RIOs gotta sit back there knowing they never get to touch the stick... they gotta do something with all that pent up enthusiasm and twitchy fingers.
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///AMG
Well-Known Member
Dunno what was the case for the Tomcat, but in the Super Hornet, the WSO doesn't get to release any ordnance……seems like a strange 180 for that community to have made, if indeed that was a thing for RIO's.
ryan1234
Desensitized Member
At least there's a stick in the F-15E back cockpit... and the pickle button is hot in A/G MM and Master Arm
///AMG
Well-Known Member
newer build supers give the WSO the ability to release, but master arm is still in the front, and it is for whatever reason, a no-no. Couple guys got kicked out of the RAG a few years back for letting the backseater drop on live day, and then lying about it when the truth came to light.
Hacker15e
Who am I? Where are my pants?
Yup, a button that I have yet to see actually used, despite a lot of folks in the Union that have tried to advance that idea many times.
So is the other union unable to determine the right parameters during engagement or what is reason the other union wouldn't throw a "bone" their way.
Hacker15e
Who am I? Where are my pants?
It is about division of duties during a critical phase of the attack. WSOs have a different job during the bomb run that doesn't involve pushing and holding the pickle button; either eyes in the "feed bag" keeping the crosshairs on the target, or having eyes outside to make sure we're not getting shot or jumped.
It isn't that a back-seater is a second-class citizen, or not worthy, or any of that junk. It is that it isn't his job. It also has something to do with the weapon release being in the legal authority of the actual aircraft commander.
The only reason *to* do it is to let the back seater do something cool, which, unfortunately, isn't usually a valid reason in a combat vehicle.
I should have prefaced my question with a previous poster's comment about the F-14 and the RIO/WSO having release authority. Good to know the back seater isn't considered unworthy.
