UFO over Hilo

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Cal Goat said:
.......UFO theories are harmless compared to your examples (which are terrible analogies for this topic.....
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I used society's demonstrated failure to face the rape of its children, right under its nose by its high priests, as an analogy only to demonstrate our collective moral cowardice in dealing with frightening subjects. I raised it as an example of the common man's inability to believe any explanation not approved by his high priests of Official Explanations. The analogy had nothing to do with the question of extraterrestrial life. The analogy was merely meant to set the stage for the next post I was planning......a topic which I predicted that your group would avoid tackling. Evangelical debunkers such as yourself, ATN and Loft have a religion all their own, and they can be relied upon to run from the central argument, which you did.
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Cal Goat said:
I grew up believing a lot of things, but education and life experience made those beliefs irreconcilable with facts that could not be ignored......
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And my next post was planned to deliver a FACT which I predicted that you, ATN, Loft and the others would try to ignore. The reported observations and conclusions of 'retired' United States astronauts and Military personnel (see inigo88's posts above). The Barney/Betty Hills and the "Jim Bobs" that evangelical debunkers try to rest their case on is largely irrelevant to those of us who attempt to fairly weigh the evidence. They are merely a strategy for diverting attention away from the more persuasive evidence. There has been a noticeable movement of retired astronauts and military men, who've braved the ridicule of a frightened society and the mindless debunkers, to come forward and testify as to their beliefs. The belief that there is evidence and argument for the presence of extraterrestrial life in our solar system, and perhaps on earth. Your ideologically driven JC group's attempt to steer clear of the astronauts and military observers, and instead flee right back to the "Jim Bob" argument demonstrated my point. Thank you. Mission accomplished.
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Qutch said:
Evangelical debunkers such as yourself, ATN and Loft have a religion all their own, and they can be relied upon to run from the central argument, which you did.
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Exactly when I have ever been an Evangelical debunker? WTH are you going off on a bend about now?
 
Qutch said:
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And my next post was planned to deliver a FACT which I predicted that you, ATN, Loft and the others would try to ignore.
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You ranted and begged for weeks that people should ignore you and ignore your posts, then when they do, you complain. Make up your mind. You just cannot resist lying about people can you?
 
ATN_Pilot said:
What "evidence?" An astronaut saying that he believes in intelligent life outside our planet is not "evidence." It's an opinion.
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As usual, you are demonstrating that you again did not bother to study the posts you are refuting before posting. So again, you don't know what you are talking about. Go back and look at inigo88's post, and the letter from astronaut Gordon Cooper to the United Nations. Then post your distraction ridicule if you must.
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Qutch said:
As usual, you are demonstrating that you again did not bother to study the posts you are refuting before posting. So again, you don't know what you are talking about. Go back and look at inigo88's post, and the letter from astronaut Gordon Cooper to the United Nations. Then post your distraction ridicule if you must.
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I don't think you understand what the word "evidence" means.
 
ATN_Pilot said:
I don't think you understand what the word "evidence" means.
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I don't think that you know what it means. "Evidence" includes eyewitness testimony.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/evidence

I also accused you of avoiding the issue of astronaut observations, conclusions and beliefs. You are still avoiding it all. How do you explain the work of The Disclosure Project and the testimony of astronauts and retired military?

(now I suppose that you'll wish to go back and edit your post the way I see Loft is doing right now.)
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Here's the problem with Cooper, Qutch: he claims to have seen not one, not two, but multiple UFOs over his aviation career. None of these were while he was in space (convenient, since there would have been more witnesses in the capsules there). All of these "sightings" took place while flying planes. Now, everyone on this site is a pilot (except for you, apparently :rolleyes: ). And most of us have thousands of hours. Probably more than Mr. Cooper, in fact. And yet, despite that, why are we not seeing all of these UFOs? Why is Cooper seeing these UFOs everywhere, while just about every other pilot isn't seeing them anywhere?

Sorry, it strains credibility. Cooper died after suffering from Parkinson's Disease, by the way. Parkinson's is known for causing visual hallucinations in about a quarter of the people who have the disease. Was that a factor? I don't know. But I think it's relevant.
 
Qutch said:
(now I suppose that you'll wish to go back and edit your post the way I see Loft is doing right now.)
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There you go with your lies, again. I've never edited my posts for content. I only edit for spelling or grammar errors, or to add content that I forgot to include. Never to remove it.
 
Qutch said:
And my next post was planned to deliver a FACT which I predicted that you, ATN, Loft and the others would try to ignore.
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Listen up Carnac the Great Predictor, I haven't posted in this thread since Thursday. I have other things occupying my thoughts and time.

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ATN_Pilot said:
Here's the problem with Cooper, Qutch: he claims to have seen not one, not two, but multiple UFOs over his aviation career. None of these were while he was in space (convenient, since there would have been more witnesses in the capsules there). All of these "sightings" took place while flying planes. Now, everyone on this site is a pilot (except for you, apparently :rolleyes: ). And most of us have thousands of hours. Probably more than Mr. Cooper, in fact. And yet, despite that, why are we not seeing all of these UFOs? Why is Cooper seeing these UFOs everywhere, while just about every other pilot isn't seeing them anywhere?

Sorry, it strains credibility. Cooper died after suffering from Parkinson's Disease, by the way. Parkinson's is known for causing visual hallucinations in about a quarter of the people who have the disease. Was that a factor? I don't know. But I think it's relevant.
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O.K. That's a little more straightforward answer. Thank you.

However, I don't think that Cooper was suffering from Parkinson in the 50s as a fighter pilot, one who later passed the astronaut physical. Come 'on ATN. Knock that stuff off. You don't think that anyone can see through those types of debating tactics? That's ridiculous.

I have no first hand knowledge of the UFO phenomenon, nor a fixed opinion on the matter. I guess I'm agnostic on it. I just wanted to see the astronaut question (not just Cooper, but Mitchell and Musgrave as well) included in the debate. I couldn't care less what Barney Hill or "Jim Bob" claims that he saw. Like you, I'm not persuaded by that type of testimony.
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Qutch said:
O.K. That's a little more straight forward answer. Thank you.

However, I don't think that Cooper was suffering from Parkinson in the 50s as a military pilot, who later passed the astronaut physical. Come 'on ATN. Knock that stuff off. You don't think that anyone can see through those types of debating tactics? That's ridiculous.
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You should do some more research. Hallucinations have been reported in Parkinson's Disease sufferers many years before the disease was diagnosed, or any other symptoms appeared. As I said, I'm not sure that that is the case here. He may just have been lying for attention. But do I think this guy saw a bunch of UFOs? No, no frickin' way. Like I said, it strains credulity when the overwhelming majority of pilots never see a single UFO in their careers that span 25,000 hours, when this guy claims to have seen numerous UFOs over just a few thousand hours.
 
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Colonel Gordon Cooper. United States Air Force fighter pilot and astronaut.

ATN_Pilot said:
You should do some more research. Hallucinations have been reported in Parkinson's Disease sufferers many years before the disease was diagnosed, or any other symptoms appeared. As I said, I'm not sure that that is the case here. He may just have been lying for attention. But do I think this guy saw a bunch of UFOs? No, no frickin' way. Like I said, it strains credulity when the overwhelming majority of pilots never see a single UFO in their careers that span 25,000 hours, when this guy claims to have seen numerous UFOs over just a few thousand hours.
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I wanted to log that one for history.
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A Life Aloft said:
Listen up Carnac the Great Predictor, I haven't posted in this thread since Thursday. I have other things occupying my thoughts and time.
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Your usual level of credibilty and respect for the facts Loft. Was someone impersonating you and posting in your name on Friday? (posts 141 & 142)

(maybe you want to go back and edit that post also?)
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