Two Planes Nearly Collide over Pacific

He's a writer, he's being dramatic and looking for a story. This is what writers do.

He also doesn't understand, nor discuss, any of the modern CRM that help keep us safe. We assume that error is inevitable, and we work to trap those errors to prevent airplanes from crashing. To be very frank, the system didn't fail here, the system worked. First, somebody made a mistake, second, nobody caught that mistake, third a safety system stepped in to warn the pilots that a mistake was made, and fourth the undesired aircraft state of having a mid-air was avoided.

The problem is that there is no garden variety RA. Sure, they happen, but you don't don't normally get one at cruise (and in fact, I only know one person, who posts here, that has gotten an RA in the flight levels). The pilot likely followed the TCAS guidance with some amount of vigor, though it's unnecessary. I think you have something like 7 seconds to respond to an RA, so while you should certainly rotate the aircraft smartly into the guidance, there's generally no need to shove the nose over or yank it back.

As for this writer saying that the FAA isn't involved and that airlines simply self police these issues, this is completely false, and the writer misunderstands ASAP programs (or does not know that they exist). The FAA is a party to ASAP reports, and this would have likely been a mandatory ASAP.

So put simply, to the outside world, this may LOOK LIKE DISASTER. To those that deal with it every day, it's an uncomfortable screw up that will likely result in some retraining for whoever screwed up, once they figure out who that person is. Either a controller gave a bad altitude, or a pilot went to a wrong altitude. Both happen every day. At my last shop, I believe the majority of ASAPs were filed due to vertical deviations, where the pilot was at the wrong altitude.
 
The "author/blogger's" title is false and overly dramatic. He did not almost die (unless he wasn't wearing his seat belt), nor would it have been the deadliest crash ever. The article was poorly written buy someone who clearly doesn't understand the basics of airplane design and engineering. I'm sure it was scary as hell but this dramatization is one man's point of view as a passenger. An engineer from Boeing would have a very different take on it.
 
jtrain609 said:
I only know one person, who posts here, that has gotten an RA in the flight levels...
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Good post, well said. Add me to your list if you like.

WSH Center issued us a crossing restriction for FL240 that resulted in an RA with crossing traffic perpendicular to our course just after we leveled off. We suspected an RA might occur but couldn't get a word in without blocking the controller. In this particular case, the system worked.
 
A little off topic here but something I would like clarification on. Does anyone know why American 11 was filed for an odd number altitude? When teaching my students sometimes they would file incorrect altitudes and FSS would tell them their requested altitude was incorrect and change it before filing. Never flown in real busy airspace yet, is it common for your clearance to get changed by ATC even to the effect of an "incorrect" altitude assignment?
 
I wonder if this bedwetter has a huge stain on the front of his pants if a car whips by him at 40 mph when he's on the sidewalk, waiting for the light to change.

And if he's driving, and someone cuts in front of him so he has to brake, does he crap his pants?

Dear writer (no not journalist because you're not worthy of the title):

Stop being a whiny little bitch.

Thank you.

Sincerely,

Me
 
According to the author on his twitter page: 8 miles from a midair.
 

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Has there ever been a midair between two TCAS equipped aircraft?

Has there ever been a midair between an aircraft with TCAS and an aircraft with no TCAS?
 
vdsteelman said:
A little off topic here but something I would like clarification on. Does anyone know why American 11 was filed for an odd number altitude? When teaching my students sometimes they would file incorrect altitudes and FSS would tell them their requested altitude was incorrect and change it before filing. Never flown in real busy airspace yet, is it common for your clearance to get changed by ATC even to the effect of an "incorrect" altitude assignment?
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Sometimes it happens. ATC will assign some awkward altitudes. When I flew from OPF-CVG they would constantly assign me an odd altitude even though a vast majority if not all of the route is favored to the west.

I have gotten FL180 several times even though it was not "available".
 
I think you have to look at it from the perspective of an educated and curious passenger. He has no control and suddenly his plane descends from what he thought was cruise flight. He probably has limited understanding of the aviation system and upon researching it, of course he's going to sensationalize his experience for his own benefit: the WORST AIR DISASTER EVER!!!! (that never happened because the system worked)
 
vdsteelman said:
A little off topic here but something I would like clarification on. Does anyone know why American 11 was filed for an odd number altitude? When teaching my students sometimes they would file incorrect altitudes and FSS would tell them their requested altitude was incorrect and change it before filing. Never flown in real busy airspace yet, is it common for your clearance to get changed by ATC even to the effect of an "incorrect" altitude assignment?
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Read the reg again. Those altitudes apply in uncontrolled airspace (for IFR). "Incorrect" may apply to their sector.

For VFR
§91.159 VFR cruising altitude or flight level.
Except while holding in a holding pattern of 2 minutes or less, or while turning, each person operating an aircraft under VFR in level cruising flight more than 3,000 feet above the surface shall maintain the appropriate altitude or flight level prescribed below, unless otherwise authorized by ATC:

(a) When operating below 18,000 feet MSL and—

(1) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd thousand foot MSL altitude +500 feet (such as 3,500, 5,500, or 7,500); or

(2) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even thousand foot MSL altitude +500 feet (such as 4,500, 6,500, or 8,500).

(b) When operating above 18,000 feet MSL, maintain the altitude or flight level assigned by ATC.

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34294, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-276, 68 FR 61321, Oct. 27, 2003; 68 FR 70133, Dec. 17, 2003]

For IFR
§91.179
(a) In controlled airspace. Each person operating an aircraft under IFR in level cruising flight in controlled airspace shall maintain the altitude or flight level assigned that aircraft by ATC. However, if the ATC clearance assigns “VFR conditions on-top,” that person shall maintain an altitude or flight level as prescribed by §91.159.

(b) In uncontrolled airspace. Except while in a holding pattern of 2 minutes or less or while turning, each person operating an aircraft under IFR in level cruising flight in uncontrolled airspace shall maintain an appropriate altitude as follows:

(1) When operating below 18,000 feet MSL and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd thousand foot MSL altitude (such as 3,000, 5,000, or 7,000); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even thousand foot MSL altitude (such as 2,000, 4,000, or 6,000).

(2) When operating at or above 18,000 feet MSL but below flight level 290, and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd flight level (such as 190, 210, or 230); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even flight level (such as 180, 200, or 220).

(3) When operating at flight level 290 and above in non-RVSM airspace, and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any flight level, at 4,000-foot intervals, beginning at and including flight level 290 (such as flight level 290, 330, or 370); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any flight level, at 4,000-foot intervals, beginning at and including flight level 310 (such as flight level 310, 350, or 390).

(4) When operating at flight level 290 and above in airspace designated as Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum (RVSM) airspace and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd flight level, at 2,000-foot intervals beginning at and including flight level 290 (such as flight level 290, 310, 330, 350, 370, 390, 410); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even flight level, at 2000-foot intervals beginning at and including flight level 300 (such as 300, 320, 340, 360, 380, 400).

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34294, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-276, 68 FR 61321, Oct. 27, 2003; 68 FR 70133, Dec. 17, 2003; Amdt. 91-296, 72 FR 31679, June 7, 2007]

S
 
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Binet-Simon said:
Read the reg again. Those altitudes apply in uncontrolled airspace (for IFR). "Incorrect" may apply to their sector.

For VFR
§91.159 VFR cruising altitude or flight level.
Except while holding in a holding pattern of 2 minutes or less, or while turning, each person operating an aircraft under VFR in level cruising flight more than 3,000 feet above the surface shall maintain the appropriate altitude or flight level prescribed below, unless otherwise authorized by ATC:

(a) When operating below 18,000 feet MSL and—

(1) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd thousand foot MSL altitude +500 feet (such as 3,500, 5,500, or 7,500); or

(2) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even thousand foot MSL altitude +500 feet (such as 4,500, 6,500, or 8,500).

(b) When operating above 18,000 feet MSL, maintain the altitude or flight level assigned by ATC.

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34294, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-276, 68 FR 61321, Oct. 27, 2003; 68 FR 70133, Dec. 17, 2003]

For IFR
§91.179
(a) In controlled airspace. Each person operating an aircraft under IFR in level cruising flight in controlled airspace shall maintain the altitude or flight level assigned that aircraft by ATC. However, if the ATC clearance assigns “VFR conditions on-top,” that person shall maintain an altitude or flight level as prescribed by §91.159.

(b) In uncontrolled airspace. Except while in a holding pattern of 2 minutes or less or while turning, each person operating an aircraft under IFR in level cruising flight in uncontrolled airspace shall maintain an appropriate altitude as follows:

(1) When operating below 18,000 feet MSL and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd thousand foot MSL altitude (such as 3,000, 5,000, or 7,000); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even thousand foot MSL altitude (such as 2,000, 4,000, or 6,000).

(2) When operating at or above 18,000 feet MSL but below flight level 290, and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd flight level (such as 190, 210, or 230); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even flight level (such as 180, 200, or 220).

(3) When operating at flight level 290 and above in non-RVSM airspace, and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any flight level, at 4,000-foot intervals, beginning at and including flight level 290 (such as flight level 290, 330, or 370); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any flight level, at 4,000-foot intervals, beginning at and including flight level 310 (such as flight level 310, 350, or 390).

(4) When operating at flight level 290 and above in airspace designated as Reduced Vertical Separation Minimum (RVSM) airspace and—

(i) On a magnetic course of zero degrees through 179 degrees, any odd flight level, at 2,000-foot intervals beginning at and including flight level 290 (such as flight level 290, 310, 330, 350, 370, 390, 410); or

(ii) On a magnetic course of 180 degrees through 359 degrees, any even flight level, at 2000-foot intervals beginning at and including flight level 300 (such as 300, 320, 340, 360, 380, 400).

[Doc. No. 18334, 54 FR 34294, Aug. 18, 1989, as amended by Amdt. 91-276, 68 FR 61321, Oct. 27, 2003; 68 FR 70133, Dec. 17, 2003; Amdt. 91-296, 72 FR 31679, June 7, 2007]

S
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Don't brings your facts in here.
 
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