Things to know before you buy!

Richman said:
Problem solved, but then you know what I'm talking about. Lots of chariots out there with deal killers that the unwary miss:

Cherokees without the SB1006 done
Cardinals with carry through spar issues
Beeches of all kinds with control surface patches
Superior & ECI cylinder ADs

Pre-buys should look at the seller, not just the airplane. Decent guy who flys reasonably frequently, chances are the ride is ok.

Uncle Bob or "a guy I know" probably requires a fairly close look. Looked at a Cardinal from one of these guys. Advertised as "NDH". Looked up a part number from a logbook entry and it traced back to the whole leading edge of the R wing.
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I was working a fuel shift once and got called out to a really ratty Cessna 150, the guy asked if I knew any mechanics. Now, I worked for a flight school so I know that ratty can also still be perfectly fine mechanically but I'm also not stupid and I know how owners are so I allowed hat I might know a couple and what did he need? He said "I'm looking for someone to do an annual for me that isn't going to make me spend a bunch of money on stupid crap."

So I sent him to the competing shop



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trafficinsight said:
I was working a fuel shift once and got called out to a really ratty Cessna 150, the guy asked if I knew any mechanics. Now, I worked for a flight school so I know that ratty can also still be perfectly fine mechanically but I'm also not stupid and I know how owners are so I allowed hat I might know a couple and what did he need? He said "I'm looking for someone to do an annual for me that isn't going to make me spend a bunch of money on stupid crap."

So I sent him to the competing shop



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He needs to fly that plane down and see a collection of flood cars he wants to "refurbish."
 
trafficinsight said:
Photos of his exhaust system later proved it was a good decision.



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He crappy thing is it probably won't be him that it kills. It'll be some poor bastard taking the flight up to check it out before he buys it and has something go catastrophically wrong.

That's unfortunately what happened to a friend of mine.
 
trafficinsight said:
I was working a fuel shift once and got called out to a really ratty Cessna 150, the guy asked if I knew any mechanics. Now, I worked for a flight school so I know that ratty can also still be perfectly fine mechanically but I'm also not stupid and I know how owners are so I allowed hat I might know a couple and what did he need? He said "I'm looking for someone to do an annual for me that isn't going to make me spend a bunch of money on stupid crap."

So I sent him to the competing shop



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Well, to be fair, there are shops out there that are happy to take an owner for a ride by:

Insisting that overhauls & service bulletins are mandatory for Part 91.

Recommending an overhaul when an IRAN is perfectly acceptable.

Diagnostic ability limited to throwing parts at a problem.

Insisting on new parts when repairing said part is much less expensive (replacing an o ring in a master cylinder).

IAs failing to exercise the discretion given to them by the Administrator.

Failing to understand the difference bweteen a major and minor alteration.

Inability to use standard methods and practices.

Questionable use of logbook entries.

And that's just off the top of my head....

My litmus test for a shop is to look around and see what's on the floor. If it's a variety of vintages and conditions, then it's a good bet that the shop understands how to maintain ships in safe and compliant manner.

If all I see are late models, mostly likely under warranty, then yea, no. I'm sure they don't want my business anyway.
 
There are far far more owners who bought more airplane than they could afford.

Sorry.

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Stuff like this is what scares me about actually buying and owning an airplane. I've been thinking hard about buying a "cheap" (for an airplane) time builder - something like a 152 or a 140 - something metal I could store outside and buzz around in like @Fencer does, but probably at higher altitudes. :)

I'm reasonably mechanically-minded, but I wouldn't know the first damned thing about evaluating a used airplane, and would never know the difference between a good pre-buy inspection and one which was crap. Right now, the only way to be sure would be to have @Roger Roger do the thing because I sort of "know" him and at least trust that he'd do it right.
 
trafficinsight said:
Stop going to that shop.

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Hah, I wish that was just one shop...that list is actually an amalgamation of
experiences, mostly avoided with judicious owner intervention.

Shops need to make money. There is plenty to be made without taking owners for a ride. Most wouldn't balk as much if these practices weren't such an expensive lesson, like recommending an entire strut overhaul when the Schrader valve just needs a new core or a minor mod requires an STC or field approval.
 
Richman said:
Hah, I wish that was just one shop...that list is actually an amalgamation of
experiences, mostly avoided with judicious owner intervention.

Shops need to make money. There is plenty to be made without taking owners for a ride. Most wouldn't balk as much if these practices weren't such an expensive lesson, like recommending an entire strut overhaul when the Schrader valve just needs a new core or a minor mod requires an STC or field approval.
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Lots of times those things are based on experience, like when a cheap ass owner comes in and says "I need a new Schrader valve core." and then tries to stick you with the bill for the strut overhaul at another shop because they got stranded there and it's somehow your fault. ;)

You laugh but....

Anyway, Sounds like maybe you should get your A&P if it's so hard to find a shop around there that doesn't suck.

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Not all shops are like that, not even close to a majority. Plenty of good ones. But I get a chuckle out of the ones that are out there complain about "trunk slammers".
 
This thread has been MOST educational! While part of me would like to buy my own airplane, I don't presently have the finances to do so; that may change in the future, but who knows? Also, I'm concerned about getting burned, as did the OP. In any case, if I were to buy my own airplane, this knowledge would come in handy.
 
MarkM0228 said:
This thread has been MOST educational! While part of me would like to buy my own airplane, I don't presently have the finances to do so; that may change in the future, but who knows? Also, I'm concerned about getting burned, as did the OP. In any case, if I were to buy my own airplane, this knowledge would come in handy.
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I'll tell you the same thing I tell everyone who's considering an airplane. Or a car for that matter.

Find, say, 5 common things you would do to the airplane, or car, and price those out. That will tell you whether you can afford it or not.

My boss years ago was offered a really great deal on a repo'd really high end BMW and asked if I thought he should go for it.

I told him to look up what a brake job would cost.

The next day he said "holy crap I'm glad you asked me that question."

I asked him what he found out and it was something like 25k.

So you think you can afford a Bonanza... ;)

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trafficinsight said:
I'll tell you the same thing I tell everyone who's considering an airplane. Or a car for that matter.

Find, say, 5 common things you would do to the airplane, or car, and price those out. That will tell you whether you can afford it or not.

My boss years ago was offered a really great deal on a repo'd really high end BMW and asked if I thought he should go for it.

I told him to look up what a brake job would cost.

The next day he said "holy crap I'm glad you asked me that question."

I asked him what he found out and it was something like 25k.

So you think you can afford a Bonanza... ;)

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Heh. I can't afford a Bo but I think a C-150 might not be out of the question....
 
I retired the 1963 C150 engine on the 10th, and flight tested the replacement engine on the 13th....yea Friday the 13th! I really enjoy being an owner.
 
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