That Could Have Been Bad

[CK]

As I was approaching Rock Hill, Sc today I heard a Twin Cessna annouce that he had an engine failure and would like to divert to Rock Hill. I landed about 10 minutes ahead of him and watched as he came in. He was about fifty feet above the glide path and maybe 10-15 kts fast on a 5000 foot runway. He would have had no problem stopping before the end. At about thirty feet above the runway and 1000' down it, I heard full power applied. It was nearly 100*F and very humid. The airplane appeared to be an early model 414 or 401, neither of which are spectacular performers on two engines let alone one. I looked over at my passenger and said, "I don't think he is going to make it".

The airplane stayed around 30 feet, with full power applied, and the gear and flaps out. As he got towards the end of the runway the nose started to pitch up and you could see it start a slow decent. I got the attention of a line man and yelled at him to get on the radio and tell the Twin Cessna to raise the gear and flaps. The lineman made the radio call and I could see the gear come up. The airplane mustered up the lift to climb a few hundred feet and he camed around and landed. Had the gear remained down I think he would've been done in another twenty or thirty seconds. After he landed I saw four people and two dogs get out. It was the closest I've seen to an accident in a long time. Let this be a good lesson, it is better to run off the end of the runway at 30kts than it is to VMC roll into the ground at 100.

Alex.

 

[OregonTrail]

exciting story and quick thinking. Glad to hear everyone was alright.

i dont think i would ever try to go around with one inop. it would have to be an extraordinary cirrcumstance, like children playing on the runway...

 

[jhugz]

this be a good lesson, it is better to run off the end of the runway at 30kts than it is to VMC roll into the ground at 100.

Truer words can not be said.

Props on assisting him. Fly safe out there guys.

jhugz

 

[c172captain]

Thats a good story. I often have students ask me how in the world someone would end up with proper configuration to get the highest Vmc and I've always said something along the lines of "Well..." "Sometimes..." "What if..."


Now I can give them an exact story of how and when someone would be in the most danger and in the worst configuration to reach Vmc, thanks

 

[TallFlyer]

i dont think i would ever try to go around with one inop. it would have to be an extraordinary cirrcumstance, like children playing on the runway...

Actually the Seneca II will do a SE go around just nicely. My MEI and I did it a few times in our training just for fun.

The caveat to that is it was just he and I and some ballast in the back. I'd be a little more circumspect about the procedure with a lot of people in the back or heavy.

 

[mooneyguy]

As I was approaching Rock Hill, Sc today I heard a Twin Cessna annouce that he had an engine failure and would like to divert to Rock Hill. I landed about 10 minutes ahead of him and watched as he came in. He was about fifty feet above the glide path and maybe 10-15 kts fast on a 5000 foot runway. He would have had no problem stopping before the end. At about thirty feet above the runway and 1000' down it, I heard full power applied. It was nearly 100*F and very humid. The airplane appeared to be an early model 414 or 401, neither of which are spectacular performers on two engines let alone one. I looked over at my passenger and said, "I don't think he is going to make it".

The airplane stayed around 30 feet, with full power applied, and the gear and flaps out. As he got towards the end of the runway the nose started to pitch up and you could see it start a slow decent. I got the attention of a line man and yelled at him to get on the radio and tell the Twin Cessna to raise the gear and flaps. The lineman made the radio call and I could see the gear come up. The airplane mustered up the lift to climb a few hundred feet and he camed around and landed. Had the gear remained down I think he would've been done in another twenty or thirty seconds. After he landed I saw four people and two dogs get out. It was the closest I've seen to an accident in a long time. Let this be a good lesson, it is better to run off the end of the runway at 30kts than it is to VMC roll into the ground at 100.

Alex.

:yeahthat:

Single engine in a light twin IS an emergency! Its nothing to play with! I'm landing first time in!

 

[astec]

sick story Alex... quick thinkin on ur part dude... peace

 

[CK]

Actually the Seneca II will do a SE go around just nicely. My MEI and I did it a few times in our training just for fun.

The caveat to that is it was just he and I and some ballast in the back. I'd be a little more circumspect about the procedure with a lot of people in the back or heavy.

There is a very big difference between practice and real life. Doing a single engine go around with your MEI for fun is about as realistic as flying under the hood is compared to flying in actual IMC. It is a decent simulation, but nothing like real life. There have been plenty of people who have died doing single engine go arounds in Seneca IIs and I am sure the guy who was in the Twin Cessna today had done go arounds with his MEI before with no problem.

Single engine in a light twin IS an emergency! Its nothing to play with! I'm landing first time in!

Yes and no. If there is nothing deformed the airplane will fly almost the same, it just will not perform well. Aslong as you keep energy on your side and do not get below blue line or on the backside of the curve an engine shutdown is not necessarily an emergency. However, you are right, you just don't do single engine go arounds. You are never too high on one engine. If you go gear down, full flaps and dive at the runway you will live 99.9% of the time, if you attempt a go around and aren't balls on you will almost certainly have a higher risk of not making it.

Alex.

 

[derg]

Good story, thanks for sharing!

I learned to fly multi-engine up in Prescott, AZ and energy management is absolutely critical.

Hell, I landed an MD-90, single-engine, laden with fuel and a full boat of passengers and it's really only an emergency if you lack situational awareness and energy management fail.

 

[OregonTrail]

Actually the Seneca II will do a SE go around just nicely. My MEI and I did it a few times in our training just for fun.

The caveat to that is it was just he and I and some ballast in the back. I'd be a little more circumspect about the procedure with a lot of people in the back or heavy.

did you have the engine shut down and featherd? According to the Airplane Flying Handbook the FAA recommends all in flight simulated engine failures below 3000 feet AGL be introduced with a smoth reduction in throttle. thus the engine is kept running available for instant use if necessary.

I cannot find a FAR or an AIM for this but it seems practical and safe

 

[Roger, Roger]

What the heck was he thinking? I hope he slapped himself upside the head once he made it back on the ground.

 

[pullup]

Wow, plant the bitch on the runway...that's what insurance is for. Hard landing > Stall/spin/crash/burn. Good to see everything worked out.

 

[PA44-LUV]

Let's just say if I have a single-engine failure I'm still requesting emergency equipment just to play it safe. Saw that with a King Air on one engine at my airport, even though the airplane landed fine and other than the feathered prop, observing from the ground you wouldn't have known anything was up....well that and the fire trucks waiting for him...

 

[JrsyGuy]

Thats a good story. I often have students ask me how in the world someone would end up with proper configuration to get the highest Vmc and I've always said something along the lines of "Well..." "Sometimes..." "What if..."


Now I can give them an exact story of how and when someone would be in the most danger and in the worst configuration to reach Vmc, thanks

Most of the factors mentioned in the story lower your Vmc speed. Hot, humid, dirty... Performance is severely degraded but not Vmc.

 

[SpiraMirabilis]

Can do a single engined miss in a 414 no problem. I don't think I'd want to though. Even in the Dash where single engine misses were one of the main items in the sim I would rather not do it.

Edit to add: I've never flown a 414 full. I've flown one with 4 peeps in it though, and one with just me in it

 

[nocturnalaviator]

Performing single-engine go-arounds in a light twin with a student is just a dumb move. As an instructor you are setting the example. What example is that? Teach the student to safely land the airplane under single-engine, one shot, one try because that's all you get. Showing a student a single-engine go around is just that, showing them they can do it too. We as MEI's should be training by use of strict discipline enforcing and reiterating proper procedure, not wannabe test pilot maneuvers (practicing single-engine go arounds for FUN?!). BTW what is the V2 speed on a seneca or seminole? Single-Engine, one shot, one chance, better get it right. And if you can't control airspeed, and maintain a stabalized descent down to the runway under one-engine, chances are you can't when both blades are turning. Enough said.

 

[Ralgha]

However, you are right, you just don't do single engine go arounds. You are never too high on one engine. If you go gear down, full flaps and dive at the runway you will live 99.9% of the time, if you attempt a go around and aren't balls on you will almost certainly have a higher risk of not making it.

Bullcrap. If it's a choice between running into a brick wall at the end of a runway, or falling off a cliff at the end of the runway, or anything else involving sudden stops or drops, I'm doing the single engine go-around. They're just not that hard to do. Know your airplane, and fly the minimum speed or better. Those who will never do a single engine go-around are lacking confidence in themselves and have a severe tunnel vision.

 

[stesta5074]

Bullcrap. If it's a choice between running into a brick wall at the end of a runway, or falling off a cliff at the end of the runway, or anything else involving sudden stops or drops, I'm doing the single engine go-around. They're just not that hard to do. Know your airplane, and fly the minimum speed or better. Those who will never do a single engine go-around are lacking confidence in themselves and have a severe tunnel vision.

I agree with you but I know nothing. I think you should be trained to the maximum of an airplanes capability so you know where the limits are. KCHD has a program called "pilot proficiency" that teaches, among other things...

"You can and will be taught how to do a power off stall with or without flaps and maintain control throughout a 1500 foot loss of altitude while making left and right turns to headings. You will find out just how safe and controllable your airplane is and its much more fun to fly."

"At the end of this program you will come up abeam the end of the runway on downwind pull the power to idle, throw out full flaps and do a slipping 180 approach to touchdown. Everything is done within the limits of the airplane because everything mentioned does not get close to the limits."

 

[nocturnalaviator]

Bullcrap. If it's a choice between running into a brick wall at the end of a runway, or falling off a cliff at the end of the runway, or anything else involving sudden stops or drops, I'm doing the single engine go-around. They're just not that hard to do. Know your airplane, and fly the minimum speed or better. Those who will never do a single engine go-around are lacking confidence in themselves and have a severe tunnel vision.

Severe tunnel vision, you got it! What do I have to prove by doing a single-engine go around so what? That just tells me you can't come in stabilized to begin with. If someone pulls out on the runway offset into the grass, let the insurance co. do their job. I won't argue about how easy or how hard a single-engine go around is to do. I have nothing to prove, but a safe track record. Its about using your head, and common sense. Sounds like you suffer from that macho hazardous attitude we all learned about. BTW, in the POH of such light twins, show me the single-engine go around procedure/check list? What is your SE roc? Will you clear the obstacle? ODP climb gradient could you meet that if you had to use it?

 

[jhugz]

The two/three twins I have flown is the Piper Apache/Geronimo & the Seminole. On a hot day with close to full gross weight you are sinking at blue line even with a sim feather. How would you know what your blue line performance is if you haven't simulated it already that day. Why take the chance and not be able to climb when you are 50 feet above the ground even with the engine feathered? Even if you are super quick you are going to loss probably 100 feet by the time you bring the throttles open and start to clean up. I teach & learned a 300 hundred foot buffer. If you are coming in to land and are below 300 ft AGL you are committed to the landing and going to have to stick it on the first time or go off the end of the runway. Any engine failure with the gear still down were coming back in to land, and finally treat it as an in air emergency after the gear is in transit.