SWA FO arrested for trying to board with a handgun

Cherokee_Cruiser said:
FFDOs at cargo carriers = beyond ridiculous. I understand the Auburn Calloway incident. But come on. Nothing more than a chance to show your **** outside, knowing full well you carry only boxes and the occasional 121 CASS-approved pilot jumpseaters.

The only legitimate threat is the threat-within. And for that case, full barrier cockpit doors are actually harmful.
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This is woefully ignorant. Educate yourself on animal shipments, animal handlers, the drugs they carry, and how many cargo aircraft have hardened cockpit doors. It's a huge problem that needs to be fixed yesterday.
 
Finny said:
This is woefully ignorant. Educate yourself on animal shipments, animal handlers, the drugs they carry, and how many cargo aircraft have hardened cockpit doors. It's a huge problem that needs to be fixed yesterday.
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There is no problem on cargo planes requiring pilots to fly armed via FFDO program. The only realistic threat is going to be the inside-factor, as was the Calloway case.

The real problem is unscreened cargo, and moreso for the nations ports.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
There is no problem on cargo planes requiring pilots to fly armed via FFDO program. The only realistic threat is going to be the inside-factor, as was the Calloway case.

The real problem is unscreened cargo, and moreso for the nations ports.
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Dude, with all due respect, you are talking out your ass about an area that you have zero experience in.

Just because you aren't aware of things happening, or can't envision them happening, doesn't mean they aren't. The Jumpseat security process isn't what we are talking about here, nor the insider threat.

Not going to get into specifics here for obvious reasons, but suffice to say you have an opinion that is not shared by a lot of people that work in the cargo business.
 
Hacker15e said:
Dude, with all due respect, you are talking out your ass about an area that you have zero experience in.
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When has that ever stopped him?

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Hacker15e said:
Dude, with all due respect, you are talking out your ass about an area that you have zero experience in.

Just because you aren't aware of things happening, or can't envision them happening, doesn't mean they aren't. The Jumpseat security process isn't what we are talking about here, nor the insider threat.

Not going to get into specifics here for obvious reasons, but suffice to say you have an opinion that is not shared by a lot of people that work in the cargo business.
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Fly boxes. Need guns? :rolleyes:

Statistics, actual events, and history are on my side. We'll see the day when some stowaway or terrorist (NON-insider) takes over a Fedex/UPS jet. If that day comes, I'll eat my own words/crow. The threat are terrorists which (IMO obviously since I'm not google) won't find on a flight deck unless it's an insider like Calloway or another jumpseater.
 
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Cherokee_Cruiser said:
FFDOs at cargo carriers = beyond ridiculous. I understand the Auburn Calloway incident. But come on. Nothing more than a chance to show your **** outside, knowing full well you carry only boxes and the occasional 121 CASS-approved pilot jumpseaters.

The only legitimate threat is the threat-within. And for that case, full barrier cockpit doors are actually harmful.
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You've clearly never commuted on a cargo carrier...
 
On a side note, I wonder at what point in this industry of flying 121 jetliners does one have enough experience to know what he's talking about. 5 yrs? 10? 20? Just let me know what that point is :)
 
Hacker15e said:
How much time do you have flying 121 cargo operations?

I suppose once you have a single day doing that, I'll give some credence to your rather strong opinion on the issue.
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Only one time on Fedex it was from SFO-MEM, the CA briefed to me that if I saw someone come from there (pointed to that small door from the pallet area to the galley), that I should call him immediately and inform him, and then do what I could do defend myself. Initially I laughed but then realized he was serious. "Yes sir" , said I, and then accidentally slept the entire flight instead of keeping a watchful eye for a statistical improbability..... ;)
 
Hacker15e said:
Yes, the only person that could possibly gain access to a freighter is an insider or a jumpseater.

Obviously.

No other personnel have access to the aircraft for the hours and hours it is on the cargo ramp. The loading, maintenance, and other handling personnel are all vetted to the same level as the crew is, right? The cargo ramp is such a tightly-controlled access area that nobody could mosey on to it undetected, either. And there obviously isn't any place on a freighter that someone could hide and wait until after taking off....so.....

So obviously the only possible threat is a crewmember or a jumpseater. <smh>

Not sure exactly how detailed I need to get with this concept before you kind of grasp what we're talking about here.
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Would you not agree that they qualify as "insider" which is the exact term I used. Insider, aka, someone who works a job and is supposed to be where he's supposed to be and then uses or abuses his access rights to get an unfair advantage on the system to do damage. Or maybe some outsider can rush the ramp, hide, and gain access to the plane.

Risk analysis is statistics based on numbers? This comes off like wearing an meteorite-proof helmet so you can survive one hitting your head from outer space when it enters earth's atmosphere. I mean, sure I guess you could. But IMO, I'd rather make sure I put my seatbelt on in a car. Eg, what I am driving at is that there are far more important things like 117 cargo carve out and postal/cargo screenings or lack thereof.

I don't mean to personally offend you. I know you've served your country, flew fighters, flew armed, and now fly cargo 121. You sir can pack all day long and twice on Sundays :) I respect you even when we don't agree. You already know my views on the FFDO program for pax carriers, let alone cargo.
 
I just got back from going for a nice run on a beautiful SoCal evening, and upon reflection I realized that I had a bit of an attack of the jagoff in this thread earlier. There was no need to schlong-measure, so I apologize.

Back to your regularly-scheduled forum bickering.
 
I get the need for the FFDO program I guess.

But am I the only one who feels a little uncomfortable when Billy Bob sitting next to me straps on his piece when we're about to push?
 
I don't think I've flown with an FFDO since a domestic turn I did on the 767 years ago.
 
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